None of what you are saying is necessarily wrong in my opinion. Meyers would benefit from more time. He might be drafted and then never crack a starting lineup and consequently only last a few years. All of the above is a definite maybe.

But it isn't the point of the thread. The thread is labelled "Draft Status". All of our partisan wishing that Meyers stays for his Junior year (when we would absolutely start another thread with the same name) is interesting, but not to the question. The question is his draft status. It is excellent. Just flat out excellent.

You said it right. Besides, comparisons are meaningless. I believe ML will have every chance to go, and will go. He's said as much.

Like someone else said, I'm thoroughly enjoying every minute he plays this year, assuming it'll be his last as a collegian. I even enjoy the wild turnovers and mistakes. Invariably, he then does something like the spin move, gets loose for an intimidation dunk, dribbles out of trouble, makes a sweet dish inside, corrals a key board, or hits pressure free throws. The good far, far outweighs the bad and the ugly, and we'll see more and more good.

+1

He gone

If you were an NBA GM with a top 10 pick, would you pass on Meyers Leonard?

That is the question all Illinois fans need to ask. The answer is NO.

So he's leaving after this season, enjoy the next 3 months.

...I don't see it yet......were people talking about Billy Paltz this way back in the day? How about "Big Country"?

The kid needs seasoning, at the least.....

Agreed. Nice post.

Big Country Reeves was a top 10 pick.

Leonard is easily a top 10 pick. Look at who has been of late. It's a pretty easy call.

Yep, correct I suppose.....


....I guess my argument should be "can you believe they would waste a top ten pick on THAT?"

We're talking about a league that had to pass a minimum age requirement because they didn't have the self control to avoid picking HS kids like Leon Smith. :D

So yes, I believe they would. And I'm not sure I'd call it a "waste" of a pick.

This is obviously for selfish reasons, but I would love to see him stay (while I admit it's extremely unlikely). More so than having ML would make us a top 10 team, but I've enjoyed watching him grow as a player and seeing all of the amazing plays he makes. It's unfortunate to only get one full season of that before he goes to the NBA and rides the pine for a few years while he develops further.

Fev where do you see a strong, athletic combo guard like Wroten going. He has potential lottery pick written all over him?

ML might not leave after this season. Whoever thinks Sullinger ruined his draft status is silly. Kid is still a beast and a lottery pick.

I'm not going to lie, I want ML back because we're National Championship contenders if he does in an age where teams are stacked with top 40 players many of whom were McD's AA's. This would be a great team and fun for us fans having seen a lot of their natural and coach helped growth throughout their careers.

I'll dunno if Gottlieb has many NBA connections, but DraftExpress has him 12th and Chad Ford has him 20th, and both seems ot have good NBA connections when it comes to the draft. If Leonard does well versus Sullinger, Zeller and MSU, he'll probably hold onto his lottery position.

Sullinger and Leonard are facing two different scenarios when making the decision to leave. Sullinger's family is not in the same situation as Sullinger. Sullinger was aware there was a potential lock out. Sullinger is also at a tweenter position where he needs more athleticism and lateral quickness. Sullinger made the right decision to come back. He has changed his body and has worked on his range. He is never going to project higher than Meyers will due to his size. Meyers is a freak athlete over 7 foot with a great frame to carry more muscle.

Seems the same convo is going on over at the Ohio State Scout board....

Meyers is and will be a 1st round draft pick.....but his is a year or 2 away from being a top 15 pick......Meyers does his self and the program a lot of good by staying at least another year......there are plenty of 7'0 footers of teams benches and if he wants to play...he should wait..and on the other side--by Meyers staying i see top recruits coming to play with him...he might be ILLINOIS best recruiting tool at this point...

Preach it! ML has been blessed with some incredible advantages. Compare and contrast him to another 7'+ guy who came through Champaign--Mike Tisdale. Meyers has the natural ability, the sinewy musculature, and the frame to add more. He's agile. He can elevate. He's not afraid to try things and stretch his game. He's got the right amount of attitude. If he matures and is able to harness all that incredible athleticism, and he wants to work hard enough, he could develop into a legendary player I think.

Am I overstating things?

Not overstating at all. Andrew Bogut with elite athleticism basically. I could easily see his shot extending to 20 feet in the pros with the ability and strength to play inside as well. He is a much better prospect than Greg Oden when he entered the draft imo

That spin move he showed against Minny by itself will have the Scouts drooling. Barring something unforeseen I would be surprised if he didn't go top 5 and shocked if he doesn't go top 10

Can't and won't agree with this at all. Oden was the best center I've ever seen play in college basketball. I hope he makes a come back this year.

ML might be a lottery pick and will definetly get drafted in the first round if he comes out this year. In noway right now would he go top 3 like Mr. Oden unless a team wants to wait 3 or 4 years just like Chandler, Howard, Deandre Jordan, or Andrew Bynum took to really become effective centers in the NBA. Spencer Hawes is just now starting to get it and is probably one of the reasons why Tiz was cut.

Agree to disagree on this one but Oden was dominant defensively but very limited in his offensive game. Not taking anything from Oden but I think Meyers has a greater skill set

Oden was great on the blocks on offense. He had a ton of post moves, with both hands.

I recall him using his overwhelming size and strength well but i dont recall hiim having many refined moves. His offensive game reminded me of shaq's in college

Shaq had a tremendous post game. Am I in bizzarro world? Does Spock have a goatee? :huh: I'm sure Youtube has highlight videos of Shaq and Oden to check out.

My opinion is that ML is a first rounder with a shot at the lottery if he comes out this year. However, if he stays another year and keeps improving, I could see him being a top 5 pick and in conversation for top overall. He has that sort of skill set that is rare and desired by NBA teams.

Those post games don't translate particularly well to the NBA unless you are Shaq and he is one in a million. Point being is that most great NBA centers had to develop more than just a power game. Meyers IMO has a face up game that is far more advanced than Oden's when he left school.

Shaq is the 5th leading scorer in the history of freaking basketball.

Thats terrific but as I said "Those post games don't translate particularly well to the NBA unless you are Shaq and he is one in a million."

The comparison was never with Shaq, it was whether Myers is a better prospect than Oden. I say yes because his skill set is greater as he already possesses a face up game. Unless you are Shaq, every great modern center has also possessed a face up game that I can recall including Ewing, Olajuwon, Mourning, Parish, Jabbar.

Meyers is far from a finished product but he has a soft touch and range on his jumper to rely upon when his athleticism invariably leaves him due to age and wear. Oden did not have that leaving college.

No, and what we saw from Meyers during that Minny game was he can bounce back quickly from making costly mistakes. He has an edge and confidence about him and when he matures, it could equate to something special.

Besides Meyers, how many of us thought he would make BOTH of those foul shots. He's only 19, right?

And how many of us thought we'd be having this conversation at all, let alone this early in the season?

Honestly, of all the questions about the team and likely starters going into this season, he was the one we were most worried about. Remember the Q's?

Would DJ bounce back from the soph slump? Yes.
Would Brandon continue his improvement? Yes -- despite maddening lapses.
Would Sam fit in as PG? Yes.
Would Tyler show more? He did at first.
Could the incredibly inept-looking, lost white giant we saw stumbling around as a frosh possibly start at the 5 on a D1 team?

What a turnaround (and I don't mean jump shot, tho he has that, too)!

I did not think he would.

For some reason I wasn't too nervous. I guess I thought he would make them.

I used to call Meyers Bambi last season. You could see he had the potential, but he had to learn to walk first. I really wasn't sure if he would make those shots at the end of the game, but it says a lot about his mental approach. It's something this team has lacked for awhile. He had a second chance to redeem himself and he did. He took the ball strong to the hole to draw the foul. He played very well in the OTs. ONIONS!

Somebody "in the know" has talked to some NBA scouts that have Meyers in their top 5 draft board.

He has some nice intangibles. You're right that he doesn't seem to dwell on mistakes or play head games with himself. He exudes confidence, not cockiness (to me). Your description is perfect: "an edge and confidence about him". You can't really coach or teach that. It's innate. Coupled with maturity and experience, I agree it could elevate him to a special place.

And as we've all acknowledged, he is blessed with ability that allows him to do things that the vast majority of human beings his size are unable to do. The raw material God supplied is pretty eye-popping.

Yep. Given the circumstances, and what we've heard of his intent -- and given the uncertainty of a tourney run even under the best of circumstances -- performing well on the conference stage is going to help his stock tremendously. He certainly knows that.

I felt he could, but would the pressure of the moment get to him? Apparently not. He saved the game there. Not just 19, but 7'1" and 19.

I did, but I have also had the advantage of watching him and knowing his body language for longer than most here. Once he is locked in he is very good from the line. Confidence is one thing this kid does not lack, that chip that it took so long to firmly place on his shoulder needs to stay there. Like I said in a previous post last year; "he looked like a dog that had been whipped" and now seems as if that dog has been given a little more chain and is able stretch his legs a bit.

This young man is not unintelligent by any means, he just has a lot to learn about the game of basketball. He will be fine, enjoy!

You're referring to Brad Sturdy's post on Rivals.com.

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Posted: Today 1:41 PM
Re: Meyers Leonard opinions...
Will not slip past the 15th pick this year. Already told friends that he is gone after this season.
Weber didn't play him last year because he knew Leonard would leave after one year. Word out of the program is that Weber is already telling Leonard he is not ready and is desperately trying to get him to stick around another year to save his job. Weber thinks the new AD at Illinois will fire him after next season if Meyers Leonard leaves and they post their typical underachieving 7-12 seed season.

Found this little jewel on the OSU scout site today...interesting comments from a outsider.

Sounds like a load of something to me...

Next post said something along the lines of "sounds like a lot of guesses to me".

Based on his handle I'm guessing that's a guy with a major anti-Illinois bias.

That POS has a lot of nerve posting anything about the Illini.

Yep. Great story.

I dont think that Meyers helped his stock today.

He didn't particularly hurt it either, other than not being bright enough to get out of the lane 2 out of the 10 times he actually found himself in it. The rest of his game can be coached up--tell the kid he needs to stay inside the arc and stop it with setting picks 8 feet inside the half-court line and that problem goes away.

There is no way leaonard is ready for the NBA. First of all he needs to quit pouting. I hate his attitude. He needs to take lessons from D Rose. He's going to rub off on his teammates. Purdue fronted him today, he needs to fight for his position. He's going to have to do some
major work to be ready for the NBA. He's amazing when the defense plays behind him but teams are figuring out how to defend him and he can't deal with it. Dont get me wrong he's an amazing player with a ton of potential but I just dont see it when teams figure how to play him.

I think getting knocked on his ass a few times by the big boys in the NBA is what he needs the most. He is gone if he projects high enough.
All about the $$. Can't blame him at all for that. Why would anyone who has no money and is in their early 20's risk injury and a big payday.

So everytime Meyers touched the ball today he had at least 2 guys collapsing on him. Did they not practice against it this week and what adjustments did they make at halftime?

ML is not a beast. At least not yet. He has a long way to go before he could be considered a beast.

Leonard is pretty much a first year player. He is not ready for the NBA. He is not strong enough. He needs another year to see if he can compete with true big men. As of the Purdue game, he cannot compete with his peers much less an NBA big man. Hate to say it.

Speaking of loving college life, hasn't Robbie Hummel been in college for about 60 years now???? Tired of him and players that player for 5-10 years it seems like.:D

We seem to be a little bi-polar. Yesterday morning he was the next NBA all-star and now he's too weak, too immature, etc. Let's see how Meyers, the team and the Coaches respond.

NBA scouts don't draft based on consistency. They draft on talent and Meyers has a boatload of it. As my boy Hawk would say...HE GONE!!!

Meyers isnt ready for the pros. He needs to grow up and dominate the college level. He hasnt done either.

BJ Mullens wasn't ready either. There are numerous other examples of big men in the same boat.

Leonard will get rated and drafted on potential. That is how the NBA does it. When he goes to test for teams his stock is only going to rise. His athleticism is off the charts for a guy his size.

Again, anybody saying Leonard will come back (or needs to come back) is either in denial or doesn't understand how NBA teams draft....or possibly they are just being selfish for the sake of the program and want Leonard to come back next year so we won't be even worse than we are now.

Leonard is more Gani Lawal than BJ Mullens right now as far as draft position. I'm not saying ML isn't he #1 or 2 center prospect but he isn't guaranteed lottery money just yet. There are a lot of talented players out there. I could see three Tar Heels and three Wildcats in the first 14 picks. That's only 8 spots left. Most teams take the best available player, not best available player based on ceiling with their lottery pick. We see a lot of these all world centers playing in the D league right now.

If the draft was today I would say he shouldnt go. Money isnt everything to me though. I think his NBA career is what is most important IMO. As of now he needs more time at the college level. God only knows how much he will progress from now to the end of this season.

I keep hearing this argument, and I honestly don't understand it. What is more time in college going to gain him other than risk for a potential injury?

NBA drafts on potential. Keep repeating that to yourself.

I would say as of right now he looks to be the center with the 2nd or 3rd most potential in college.

BS the NBA drafts on production - Production that has the potential to carry over into big league play


As of right now ML is struggling to produce against his college peers when the going gets tough.

And I dont get how some say that potential can develop just as well in the NBA. If that was true then Meyers didnt need college at all. But it isnt true and as now he simply isnt ready for the NBA, so taking money out of the equation, he should not leave IMO.

If this is true, then why is he already in the 12-15 range on most mock drafts? Why are the scouts Klee talks to saying he is the number one center prospect on their board?

His numbers don't say that

Meyer's didn't have a choice on college. With the one year rule in effect he couldn't try going straight to the league.

I'm not sure how much his potential can develop if he stays. Sam seems to be the best passer into the post and he's gone next year and the others don't seem to get the ball to him when he's open. Either the players didn't stick to the game plan against PU or the coach didn't prepare the team. Hopefully things will improve through the rest of the season. We shall see.

Mock draft boards at this stage of the season are like polls at this stage of the season - They will change due to production on the floor.

7 points against PU
7 points against UNLV
14 points against MO


Yes they do - a star NBA prospect should step up in big games - not show great signs of stuggle in big games.

Klee has stated that the only way Leonard will drop at this point is if he has a season ending injury. The NBA people he has talked to are super high on Leonard. The chances of him dropping on the draft boards are slim to none.

I think they could use a sports psychologist on staff as much as the trainers.

We 'll see.......

14 pts and 13 rebounds is struggling?

He got a combined 12 shots in the UNLV and Purdue games. He can't control not getting the ball. You cherry picked your stats big time to try and prove your point.

If you do not think ML has not struggled against higher level competition this year then you are drinking kool aid.

Yes he can controll getting the ball - its called offensive rebounds - its called roll from the pickset instead of standing there. Its called quit being out farther then 10 feet from the post. Its called make it to the free throw line.

41 pts and 18 rebounds against the two best centers he has faced this year in Sacre and Sampson. The offense dictates that he set a high ball screen and he is second on the team in free throws.

Your opinion is not matching the facts

The NBA decided to not allow 18 year olds in the league for a good reason. The NBA isnt good at developing. I also do not get why people try to make it the guards fault why Leonard cant get better position for a pass. Purdue fronted Leonard and took him out of the game. It was very obvious that the game plan was to throw down low to Leonard but Purdue took him physically and then mentally out of our plan.

This is another reason he'll leave after this year -- sick of getting constantly double teamed in college. He won't face that issue in the NBA for a few years until/if he develops a strong enough offensive game there.

They had an NBA guy on BTN tonight talking about the potential of Big 10 players. The focus was on Leonard and Sullinger. He basically said Sullinger understands how to play as a big man and has enough of a perimeter game to make the move. He said Leonard had a considerable amount to learn about playing down low and particularly how to get him self open and position himself for success in the paint. It sure sounded to me like he was suggesting that it would be wise for Leonard to continue to learn and develop at the college level.

Im a huge Leonard fan but it is so obvious that as of now he is being out matched physically down low when teams focus on him. He does have a huge amount of potential because we see it when he is not the focus of our opponents. He lacks awareness down low and really does think he is open for a pass. The guards dribble and stop to attempt a pass but they can see he really isnt open. That actually slows our motion to a stand still. The guards sometimes force a pass and it turns out bad most of the time.


Well he will need to learn how to play with a double team on him and it is far more easier in college than in the NBA. He would be mentally destroyed and wouldnt have a clue on how to react to it if he was in the NBA right now. He looks to handle single defenders pretty well but if I was an opponents coach I would take advantage of the situation and get easy turnovers. That would hurt his development in other areas from the lack of playing time.

I really would understand why he would leave for the NBA if he really truely needs a quick payoff but if he was MY little brother, even playing for KU, as of now I would advise him to stick around in college for another year.

I would think about all his potential and where he had the best chance to develop it. I would tell him that if he does not develop that potential that he would lose out in 2nd contract money in the long run if money really motivates him. If he becomes the next D. Howard he would possibly make D. Rose money in his 2nd contract if he was on the right team. If he does not develop he could be cut and playing in Europe after the guaranteed years of his 1st contract.

Of course he did, that's the company line. You're unlikely to hear anything else on the BTN.

I like ML as much as the next guy, but he will never be Dwight Howard, or even close to it. He doesn't have the body for it.

I'm not sure he will ever be a prototypical center in the NBA ala Andrew Bynum, Shaq, Howard, or those types. At the next level I think he'd be more of a Pau Gasol. Not that that's anything to sneer at.

Regardless of what he can be in the NBA, he's not near ready. His footwork is atrocious sometimes. His biggest problem is he's very very weak without the ball. He positions poorly for passes and he doesn't position well for O rebounds.

The good news for him is that with a good coach all of those things can be corrected. I don't think Illinois has a trainer/coach/assistant that's very good with big men, but judging by his time with Team USA he's motivated to go out and make it happen himself.

I see big things coming from him someday, just not quite D Howard big.

I'm all the more convinced he'll go after this year. To his obvious ability and upside, I'd add the issues you mention and the tensions to which he'll continue to be exposed by the coaching staff and the limits of his teammates. If he can make a huge payday, and get busy with the more effective teaching and coaching he'll receive at the next level, why stick around and endure frustration and the risk of potential injury?

Who wants to think about what Illinois will look like next year without ML and without SM (even as restricted and limited as he now is)?

I said very early in the season I thought he would make the jump, but if this is truly a large frustration for him, it should be a clue to him of how much work he still needs. Purdue took him out of the game by having a freshman and a soph getting physical with him. That was childs play compared to what he is looking at in the NBA.

He still has much to learn and I hope he learns it this year at Illinois, rather than next year in the NBA. I hate to think of spending 2 years on him without getting to experience some of the benefits too.

I can understand his reasoning, but as you said, it should be an indication of how much he has to learn. The fact is Meyers still has a lot to work on in the post. It is by far his greatest weakness. Unfortunately the other thing Purdue showed was how easy it is to get under his skin. I think we all agree he really needs another year from a maturity standpoint too. Again, I love what can bring to the game. He just needs to channel his emotions better and be more decisive in the post.

If you are a BIG in the NBA - unless you are a prolific scorer - you better play solid defense and be able to defend the pick-and-roll plays and provide solid weak side help defense and close down the lane.

ML will NEVER be a Dwight Howard.
I watch Noah and Asik play for the Bulls and both can attack the glass for offensive rebounds, defend the pick-and-roll, set screens, have good hands and can roll to the basket, move their feet to take charges, are good passers, and are willing to dive for loose balls.
I keep thinking ML could be a more offensive minded Noah, but I don't see ML move his feet very well on defense. He continually gets lost on what to do on pick-and-roll-plays (the bread and butter play of the NBA)

IF ML comes out next year - someone will draft him in the first round.
But if he is not an immediate starter - then most likey he will be a bench player the rest of his career. As a BIG sitting on an NBA bench - you DO NOT develop your game very much. Chances are - you will always be a bench player.

I cannot even think of a BIG that was drafted on potential, did not have a solid low-post game, was not a solid defensive presence, and was able to develop his game to become a starter in the league.

Good point. There are no long term projects in the NBA. If you don't make a major move in your 1st 2-3 yrs they move on to someone else. No question he would be a better NBA player long term if he stayed another year. Having the maturity and the family background and support to recognize that will be the deciding factor.

He has made some big strides for no help from trainers/coach/assistants. By the way, Weber got ML to play on the us team. I have read contingency plans were being made back then also, for ML's possible early departure.

ML is a very solid defensive presence, as solid as numerous previous first-round draft picks at center.

Chandler, Okur, Milicic, JaVale McGee, Ibaka, Biedrins, Amir Johnson, Joel Anthony, Brendan Haywood and Chuck Hayes start at center right now. None were low-post scorers or solid defensive presences above ML in college or HS. Tyson was a defensive force when drafted out of HS, but so was ML in HS.

Nor do they ever. This guy has some sorta creepy vendetta against Meyers Leonard. It's perplexing.

Yeah, he'll just get punked by guys much tougher and mature than him.

Nah no Vendetta - just call it like I see it.

positives: He is a tall guy that has athletic capabilites
(good coordination for a person his size,
decent/hands/passer/shooter and runs floor well) - He has
a high ceiling if he works hard

negatives: Poor offensive post footwork and rudimentrary, at best, post
moves - Poor post defensive player, gives up ground and is
pushed around by beefier players - does not defend pick/roll
well often dropping back in lane instead of closing in on man
for which pick was set - slow to switch; often leading to
conceding open jumpers - spends too much time away from
post which has led to only averaging 2.27 offensive
rebounds per game - current coach openly comments on his
maturity issues; tendency to openly project being rattled

Let's not get too carried away with Meyer's defensive presence in the Apollo Conference. There were no Blab's or Kujawa's on his schedule, not to mention anyone near the size or skill of Tyson Chandler.

If Leonard leaves he is dumb. There is no shortage of 7' people in the NBA and Leonard has a ways to go before he can make an impact in the league. Leonard seems to play lazy. His picks are half-a$$, he doesn't pay attention to three seconds, and his post game can be improved. The good news is that 2/3 of these are mental mistakes and can very easily be corrected. If he works hard during the off season he could maybe leave after his junior year and be a 1st round pick but right now I don't think he is anything but maybe a second rounder

Every mock draft I've seen, as well as the NBA people that Klee has talked to, disagree with you.

If Meyers game is so terrible, why would you even want him to come back?

Every mock draft sees him as a big time work in progress with a high ceiling - Every mock draft says he has a big upside IF he works his tail off and improves a great deal.

Every mock draft says he is a unique athletic specimen that has potential - get it....... potential - meaning he has a ways to go. Every NBA center would tear him a new one right now

As they will every early entrant. You don't think Anthony Davis, or Drummond or Terrance Jones or Lamb isn't going to get eaten up early? How many finished products come out of college anymore?

Chandler also had no offensive game whatsoever coming out of HS. He was drafted purely on athletic potential and height. ML's offensive skills are much more polished than his were and still are.

ML's stats this season are better or as good as at least a third of the NBA's starting centers and most backup league centers when they were in college. Center is the weakest position in the league right now. There are a dearth of good centers, which is yet another reason that NBA scouts and GMs think he'd go in the lottery or at least upper half of the first round of this year's draft. The league needs true big men like ML. Lots of teams desperately need a 7-foot-1 player with his mix of athleticism and skill. He'll also receive 1 on 1 instruction from NBA assistant coaches who specialize in teaching big man skills. The average league team has 4-5 assistants who played NBA ball and work with players individually a la Patrick Ewing in Dwight Howard's early years in Orlando as an example. If he wants to start collecting a guaranteed multi-million-dollar contract this summer that will set him up for life and allow him to live out his dream of playing on the world's biggest basketball stage, more power to him. One extra year in college isn't going to turn him into a polished big man who's ready to take the NBA by storm. He'll sit the bench early regardless but also has a bright future as an eventual starter or long-time contributing backup imo.

Pretty much none. But we should take the word of anonymous posters over those of NBA GMs and scouts who think he'll be a lottery pick. The fans know so much more about the NBA than they do. ;) He should forego millions of dollars, stay in college for 6 years like Jess Settles and polish his game so brightly that he can step in and make the all-star game as a rookie.

Agree with every part of your last 2 posts

I think all those players are much more refined and skilled than ML right now.

Seriously?!!?! how many "finished"players come out of college anymore? Thats a trick question because all players have some ups and downs. but cmon man You think time stands still? Most of the immediate impact players come out of college

David Robinson - Shaq - Tim Duncan - Blake Griffin - Derrick Rose - Jimmer Freidette -Kevin Love - Mike Beasley - Kevin Durant -Russell Westbrook - John Wall - Steph Curry - Rajon Rondo - Chris Paul - Carmelo Anthony - and maybe someone you heard of Deron Williams to name but a few off top my head in about ten seconds.