Go Back   Fighting Illini Forums > Sports > Fighting Illini Basketball

2017 Coaching Carousel

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old Feb 16, 2017, 09:53 PM   #5776
TEYPAY
Location: Springfield
Posts: 1,371
no guarantee you lose Tilmon or Frazier.... and... what happens if you get a 12 seed and lose in first four... harder to get rid of the coach even though you know he isn't your long term solution.

And... if you do happen to lose Tilmon or Frazier (or someone transfers), the scholarship situation changes in a hurry.

Honest question... how many people sort of hope that Illinois loses one or two more games to make the decision even easier for the people that don't see it yet?
TEYPAY is offline
Old Feb 16, 2017, 10:00 PM   #5777
Bogey99
Posts: 90
Quote:
Originally Posted by TEYPAY View Post
Honest question... how many people sort of hope that Illinois loses one or two more games to make the decision even easier for the people that don't see it yet?
Whitman sees it, that's all that matters.
Bogey99 is offline
Old Feb 16, 2017, 10:01 PM   #5778
BananaShampoo
Captain 'Paign
BananaShampoo's Avatar
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 9,514
Quote:
Originally Posted by thunderwear View Post
A top 10ish recruiting class is spectacular for Illinois. I don't remember the last time we had this high a recruiting class, but I would guess that when we have, it was when the team was winning-- a lot.

Also, I don't think people are arguing what you think they are arguing.

Here are a few reasons that waiting could be worthwhile.
The NBA season is long. JW could have someone in mind that wants the job. He is interviewing them now and must wait until after the NBA season. Recruits and the public won't wait this long for a coach to be confirmed (May/June). In this case, I would want Groce to stay for another year to preserve the recruiting class and wait for the great coach.

We lose Frazier and Tilmon if Groce leaves.

JW is talking with coaches now and they don't like the makeup of the current scholarship situation. Waiting a year buys time with recruiting.

JW believes the new recruiting class would add to the desirability of Illinois to top-tier coaches.

JW doesn't want a debacle and wants to confirm the coach before acting.

The list goes on.

I think this idea that we can't find anyone better is not what people are trying to communicate. I also don't think they are saying all the recruits will leave and we can't find better. New coaches with a 3 year clock will weigh their options before moving their family across the country. The more stacked the pipeline, the better the opportunities. Groce took a high-risk position. By year 2 he had 9 new players, most of the talent on Illinois was not D1 talent and our ties to the major recruiting hubs were severed. I do want Groce out, but I also trust the JW will do what makes the most sense.
You have go all the way back to 2010 to find class ranked as high as this one. Of course it didn't turn out that well...

__________________
C-U/UIUC Historian and Lover of all Things Illini
BananaShampoo is offline
Old Feb 16, 2017, 10:04 PM   #5779
Joestan1967
Posts: 9
Agree. I don't think it's guaranteed that jg is gone. It's probably 50 / 50 JW knows that jg has had sufficient time and has not performed. And that program, fans, players all need a boost, and if finds a new coach that fits that bill, he'll hire him. Recruits coming in or not. But, poster is right to say that a top ten recruiting class after the last ten years of Il basketball, is a big deal. So if the only coaches available for this next season are not in JW's top five, I believe he'll stick with JG.
Joestan1967 is offline
Old Feb 16, 2017, 10:20 PM   #5780
IlliniCaboose
IlliniCaboose's Avatar
Posts: 822

__________________
Agent of Shield
IlliniCaboose is offline
Old Feb 16, 2017, 10:36 PM   #5781
midastouch11
midastouch11's Avatar
Location: New York, New York
Posts: 2,250
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joestan1967 View Post
Agree. I don't think it's guaranteed that jg is gone. It's probably 50 / 50 JW knows that jg has had sufficient time and has not performed. And that program, fans, players all need a boost, and if finds a new coach that fits that bill, he'll hire him. Recruits coming in or not. But, poster is right to say that a top ten recruiting class after the last ten years of Il basketball, is a big deal. So if the only coaches available for this next season are not in JW's top five, I believe he'll stick with JG.
The class of 2017, as currently constructed, has one player in the RSCI top 100. Let's be real when talking about this class.

__________________
"GOT TO Slip away, 33@a diamonds and jackknifes through the air like an amazing star SHOOTING THE NETS WITH EASE AND A FLYING EAGLE ON AN CIRCUS TRAMPEZE"
midastouch11 is offline
Old Feb 16, 2017, 11:02 PM   #5782
PhillyIllini
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 163
Quote:
Originally Posted by midastouch11 View Post
The class of 2017, as currently constructed, has one player in the RSCI top 100. Let's be real when talking about this class.
lol, I think people tend to overweight the impact of Tilmon and everyone (including myself) is guilty of thinking Frazier is getting the short end of the stick when it comes to where he's ranked. I do believe he'll outperform his composite. but yes, your point is noted and probably accurate.
PhillyIllini is offline
Old Feb 16, 2017, 11:57 PM   #5783
cam
Posts: 158
Quote:
Originally Posted by midastouch11 View Post
The class of 2017, as currently constructed, has one player in the RSCI top 100. Let's be real when talking about this class.
Frazier in most rankings is around 100 and I think better than that. Tillmon is a 5 star big and a difference maker. Mark Smith is top 100 and we could still get him, it's a good class and strong at the two most important positions.

Last edited by cam; Feb 17, 2017 at 12:02 AM.
cam is offline
Old Feb 17, 2017, 12:18 AM   #5784
jrichisamazing
Posts: 4,182
Quote:
Originally Posted by midastouch11 View Post
The class of 2017, as currently constructed, has one player in the RSCI top 100. Let's be real when talking about this class.
Throw rankings aside, and you can easily see this is Groce's best class. An athletic rim protector, a speedy scoring guard, a lengthy athletic combo guard, and another lengthy scorer. But the first 2 are most important and something Groce has never had together here.

I'm not confident Groce can do anything with the guys coming in, but I wouldn't be surprised if he did. But I don't think he is going to get that opportunity.

__________________
jrichisamazing is offline
Old Feb 17, 2017, 01:31 AM   #5785
FatGreg
Banned
Posts: 838
I really, really think that a lot of the people saying maybe Groce should get another year were born after 1990 and/or didn't become fans until at least late last decade. WE ARE ILLINOIS BASKETBALL! We're a top-15 all-time program. From the mid 1980s to the mid '00s we were one of the 8-10 most prestigious and successful teams in America. My entire life, from 1981 until a few years after I graduated from UIUC in '04, we were nationally relevant every season. 3 out of every 4 years we were ranked and a single-digit tournament seed. A Sweet 16 appearance was merely an okay year. We were in a group of programs just below the blue bloods--along with Arizona, Syracuse, Michigan State, et al--expected to compete for Elite 8 berths just about every year. We had the nation's longest home winning streak at one point. We were a borderline dominant team for the better part of two decades.

It's one thing to see the records and statistics on paper, but those of us who grew up with the Flying Illini and Lon and Self's teams feel the expectation of greatness in our bones. We should be in the tournament 8-9 out of 10 years. We should compete for Big Ten championships and Final Fours. We should pull in top-20 recruiting classes almost every year. Illinois basketball is a storied program. The fact that many fans have been throttled into accepting mediocrity is maddening. The fact that we're alternately a joke and an afterthought in the national conversation feels like some kind of alternate universe.

I like and respect Groce as a man, but he's gone as soon as the season ends and rightfully so. I feel confident that Josh Whitman has the same expectations for the program as I do: we should be invincible at home, in the tournament constantly, and in the national media cycle on a weekly basis during the season. People should talk about us like they talk about Arizona. That's where we come from. That's where we belong.
FatGreg is offline
Old Feb 17, 2017, 04:21 AM   #5786
OrangeNBrood
Posts: 243
Quote:
Originally Posted by FatGreg View Post
I really, really think that a lot of the people saying maybe Groce should get another year were born after 1990 and/or didn't become fans until at least late last decade. WE ARE ILLINOIS BASKETBALL! We're a top-15 all-time program. From the mid 1980s to the mid '00s we were one of the 8-10 most prestigious and successful teams in America. My entire life, from 1981 until a few years after I graduated from UIUC in '04, we were nationally relevant every season. 3 out of every 4 years we were ranked and a single-digit tournament seed. A Sweet 16 appearance was merely an okay year. We were in a group of programs just below the blue bloods--along with Arizona, Syracuse, Michigan State, et al--expected to compete for Elite 8 berths just about every year. We had the nation's longest home winning streak at one point. We were a borderline dominant team for the better part of two decades.

It's one thing to see the records and statistics on paper, but those of us who grew up with the Flying Illini and Lon and Self's teams feel the expectation of greatness in our bones. We should be in the tournament 8-9 out of 10 years. We should compete for Big Ten championships and Final Fours. We should pull in top-20 recruiting classes almost every year. Illinois basketball is a storied program. The fact that many fans have been throttled into accepting mediocrity is maddening. The fact that we're alternately a joke and an afterthought in the national conversation feels like some kind of alternate universe.

I like and respect Groce as a man, but he's gone as soon as the season ends and rightfully so. I feel confident that Josh Whitman has the same expectations for the program as I do: we should be invincible at home, in the tournament constantly, and in the national media cycle on a weekly basis during the season. People should talk about us like they talk about Arizona. That's where we come from. That's where we belong.
Dog, you should run for office.

This was spoken with conviction and force. Made me want to raise my right fist in the air.
OrangeNBrood is offline
Old Feb 17, 2017, 06:19 AM   #5787
IlliniReb
Location: Dallas-Fort Worth
Posts: 304
Quote:
Originally Posted by FatGreg View Post
I really, really think that a lot of the people saying maybe Groce should get another year were born after 1990 and/or didn't become fans until at least late last decade. WE ARE ILLINOIS BASKETBALL! We're a top-15 all-time program. From the mid 1980s to the mid '00s we were one of the 8-10 most prestigious and successful teams in America. My entire life, from 1981 until a few years after I graduated from UIUC in '04, we were nationally relevant every season. 3 out of every 4 years we were ranked and a single-digit tournament seed. A Sweet 16 appearance was merely an okay year. We were in a group of programs just below the blue bloods--along with Arizona, Syracuse, Michigan State, et al--expected to compete for Elite 8 berths just about every year. We had the nation's longest home winning streak at one point. We were a borderline dominant team for the better part of two decades.

It's one thing to see the records and statistics on paper, but those of us who grew up with the Flying Illini and Lon and Self's teams feel the expectation of greatness in our bones. We should be in the tournament 8-9 out of 10 years. We should compete for Big Ten championships and Final Fours. We should pull in top-20 recruiting classes almost every year. Illinois basketball is a storied program. The fact that many fans have been throttled into accepting mediocrity is maddening. The fact that we're alternately a joke and an afterthought in the national conversation feels like some kind of alternate universe.

I like and respect Groce as a man, but he's gone as soon as the season ends and rightfully so. I feel confident that Josh Whitman has the same expectations for the program as I do: we should be invincible at home, in the tournament constantly, and in the national media cycle on a weekly basis during the season. People should talk about us like they talk about Arizona. That's where we come from. That's where we belong.
Preach on,brother-man

In fact, this should be at the top of every page so when people get on The Carousel they see this. Every time.
IlliniReb is offline
Old Feb 17, 2017, 06:47 AM   #5788
SescIllini
Posts: 418
Quote:
Originally Posted by Swamp Donkey View Post
Not arguing for his retention at all. Love the guy, hate the results. What I am saying is, if JW goes shopping with a list of 4-5 and doesn't find a taker, I would be ok with keeping a lame duck coach to keep this recruiting class. I also believe that if he had a year to concentrate his efforts, he would fill his shopping list in 2018. Just have to wonder what inroads he has made in several months


I shared the same sentiments about two months ago. But it has now become painfully clear that this staff collectively can't compete with top 50-75 coaching. I have seen enough bb this year to say we have some deficits but overall our talent isn't best utilized.


In life we are put in situations where we need to execute to perfection, there is no alternative. Whitman has to do this now, as others have stated kicking the can down the road is not an option. So Whitman will hire option 1, 1a, or 1b.
SescIllini is offline
Old Feb 17, 2017, 07:03 AM   #5789
StateFarmCenter
Posts: 810
Even "worst recruiter ever" Bruce Weber brought in 3 comparable classes to what we have coming in next year. We should basically be bringing in a top 15/20 class 3 of every 4 years. Class like like next year's should be the expectation and not one put on a pedestal.
StateFarmCenter is offline
Old Feb 17, 2017, 07:46 AM   #5790
Sleepy Floyd
Kicking it with Fat Lever
Location: Champaign
Posts: 713
Quote:
Originally Posted by StateFarmCenter View Post
Even "worst recruiter ever" Bruce Weber brought in 3 comparable classes to what we have coming in next year. We should basically be bringing in a top 15/20 class 3 of every 4 years. Class like like next year's should be the expectation and not one put on a pedestal.
Neither Groce nor Weber recruited to system. Groce needed a dynamic pg he might have one but it is 3 years too late. Weber didn't recruit enough shooters with JH. I would value coaching over recruiting because I think the recruiting floor is high I'm not sure if the celling is such that you can have subpar coach.

__________________
Niumatalolo/ Mack- 2016
Sleepy Floyd is offline
Old Feb 17, 2017, 07:54 AM   #5791
DReq
Illinois - Football School??
DReq's Avatar
Location: Central Illinois
Posts: 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by FatGreg View Post
I really, really think that a lot of the people saying maybe Groce should get another year were born after 1990 and/or didn't become fans until at least late last decade. WE ARE ILLINOIS BASKETBALL! We're a top-15 all-time program. From the mid 1980s to the mid '00s we were one of the 8-10 most prestigious and successful teams in America. My entire life, from 1981 until a few years after I graduated from UIUC in '04, we were nationally relevant every season. 3 out of every 4 years we were ranked and a single-digit tournament seed. A Sweet 16 appearance was merely an okay year. We were in a group of programs just below the blue bloods--along with Arizona, Syracuse, Michigan State, et al--expected to compete for Elite 8 berths just about every year. We had the nation's longest home winning streak at one point. We were a borderline dominant team for the better part of two decades.

It's one thing to see the records and statistics on paper, but those of us who grew up with the Flying Illini and Lon and Self's teams feel the expectation of greatness in our bones. We should be in the tournament 8-9 out of 10 years. We should compete for Big Ten championships and Final Fours. We should pull in top-20 recruiting classes almost every year. Illinois basketball is a storied program. The fact that many fans have been throttled into accepting mediocrity is maddening. The fact that we're alternately a joke and an afterthought in the national conversation feels like some kind of alternate universe.

I like and respect Groce as a man, but he's gone as soon as the season ends and rightfully so. I feel confident that Josh Whitman has the same expectations for the program as I do: we should be invincible at home, in the tournament constantly, and in the national media cycle on a weekly basis during the season. People should talk about us like they talk about Arizona. That's where we come from. That's where we belong.


+100 (roughly the number of years I have been an Illini fan)

Amen, FatGreg. Let's get out there and be The Illini!

__________________
Fan forever, lurker mostly
DReq is offline
Old Feb 17, 2017, 08:03 AM   #5792
CoalCity
Location: St Paul, MN
Posts: 815
Quote:
Originally Posted by FatGreg View Post
I really, really think that a lot of the people saying maybe Groce should get another year were born after 1990 and/or didn't become fans until at least late last decade. WE ARE ILLINOIS BASKETBALL! We're a top-15 all-time program. From the mid 1980s to the mid '00s we were one of the 8-10 most prestigious and successful teams in America. My entire life, from 1981 until a few years after I graduated from UIUC in '04, we were nationally relevant every season. 3 out of every 4 years we were ranked and a single-digit tournament seed. A Sweet 16 appearance was merely an okay year. We were in a group of programs just below the blue bloods--along with Arizona, Syracuse, Michigan State, et al--expected to compete for Elite 8 berths just about every year. We had the nation's longest home winning streak at one point. We were a borderline dominant team for the better part of two decades.

It's one thing to see the records and statistics on paper, but those of us who grew up with the Flying Illini and Lon and Self's teams feel the expectation of greatness in our bones. We should be in the tournament 8-9 out of 10 years. We should compete for Big Ten championships and Final Fours. We should pull in top-20 recruiting classes almost every year. Illinois basketball is a storied program. The fact that many fans have been throttled into accepting mediocrity is maddening. The fact that we're alternately a joke and an afterthought in the national conversation feels like some kind of alternate universe.

I like and respect Groce as a man, but he's gone as soon as the season ends and rightfully so. I feel confident that Josh Whitman has the same expectations for the program as I do: we should be invincible at home, in the tournament constantly, and in the national media cycle on a weekly basis during the season. People should talk about us like they talk about Arizona. That's where we come from. That's where we belong.
AMEN BROTHER! I was on campus 73-79 and the game we beat MSU and Magic Johnson, Greg Kelser, et al was such an incredible moment and clearly a turning point for Illinois basketball (even though the rest of the season didn't feel like it). From then on people were worried about playing Illinois not licking their chops when we came up on the schedule.

I'm tired of being a doormat and watching every game hoping that we don't get slaughtered instead of looking forward to watching exciting winning basketball. The last ten years of Illinois basketball have been the worst non sanctioned ten years in the programs history! What does it take for people to accept that a change needs to be made?

Last edited by CoalCity; Feb 17, 2017 at 08:06 AM. Reason: Autocorrect
CoalCity is offline
Old Feb 17, 2017, 08:04 AM   #5793
Illiniguy13
Posts: 560
http://www.cbssports.com/college-bas...ouch-that-job/

Not a good look!
Illiniguy13 is offline
Old Feb 17, 2017, 08:25 AM   #5794
WesterveltVictoryCigar
Posts: 13,272
Pete Thamel of SI weighs in on NCSU and the overall coaching carousel that is forming this season:

Quote:
There is an increasing feeling in the industry that this could be the year that Marshall finally leaves Wichita. He’s gone 254–89 there, reached the 2013 Final Four and appears on track for his sixth straight NCAA tournament. There’s increasing buzz that the American Athletic Conference will make a run at Wichita, which would immediately make it a much more difficult job. There’s also some competition for NC State here, as LSU, Missouri, Washington, Illinois and Arkansas (considered 50–50 to open) could also make a run at him. Compensation is important to Marshall, and someone on that list should be able to compensate him.

Here are six other brand-name coaches that could emerge as intriguing names in the next few weeks:

Cuonzo Martin, California. He’s led both Cal and Tennessee to the NCAA tournament and holds a career record of 183–115. Martin is from East St. Louis, Ill., played at Purdue and got his start as a head coach at Missouri State. His Midwestern roots make it likely Illinois, Missouri or Arkansas could all swoon for him. LSU could be intrigued as well. Expect Martin’s name to be bandied about a lot the next few weeks, as he fits at too many places.

SI.com

Last edited by Dan; Feb 17, 2017 at 08:31 AM.
WesterveltVictoryCigar is offline
Old Feb 17, 2017, 08:26 AM   #5795
LurkLongandProsper
Location: C-U
Posts: 2,077
Quote:
Originally Posted by FatGreg View Post
I really, really think that a lot of the people saying maybe Groce should get another year were born after 1990 and/or didn't become fans until at least late last decade.
No way, man. That age bracket either has apathetic fans due to lack of success in the program from HS and on, or people who want Groce out for ruining their undergrad. The former group isn't going to be posting on IL. There's a group in that age bracket as well that grew up as die-hards, and the vast majority of die-hards want him out as well.

The only remaining "maybe one more year" guys are just a distant minority from all over the place.

Last edited by LurkLongandProsper; Feb 17, 2017 at 08:32 AM.
LurkLongandProsper is offline
Old Feb 17, 2017, 08:30 AM   #5796
LurkLongandProsper
Location: C-U
Posts: 2,077
Quote:
Originally Posted by WesterveltVictoryCigar View Post
Pete Thamel of SI weighs in on NCSU and the overall coaching carousel that is forming this season:
Wow, Underwood is only making 1 mil?
LurkLongandProsper is offline
Old Feb 17, 2017, 08:51 AM   #5797
FishingFool
Posts: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sleepy Floyd View Post
Neither Groce nor Weber recruited to system. Groce needed a dynamic pg he might have one but it is 3 years too late. Weber didn't recruit enough shooters with JH. I would value coaching over recruiting because I think the recruiting floor is high I'm not sure if the celling is such that you can have subpar coach.
This brings up another thing on my mind the last few years when it comes to our recruiting. Now don't get me wrong I have had enough of Groce and his style of basketball coaching. And I will take talent over coaching when it comes down to making a good team. I believe Izzo said a good team is 75 percent talent and 25 percent coaching. But I have seen several top players the last few years that these 2 coaches went after that would have made a big difference to this team that right to the end decided to go else where. But why? Is it politics? Is it just plain dislike for Illinois? This inability to land some of these top recruits even the ones in our home state has to be addressed.
FishingFool is offline
Old Feb 17, 2017, 09:03 AM   #5798
thebizz81
Posts: 31
I guess I don't understand all of the back and forth and absolute statements on here.

In terms of our coaching situation there are several facts present:
1. Groce has significantly under-performed during his tenure
2. Groce has an above average class of recruits coming in next year
3. There is a level of apathy among the fan base
4. Whitman has a list of candidates that would be good hires

Whitman knows all of these facts, he is a bright guy. That being said this is not a binary decision, these are all variables that go into the equation of what to do next. Groce has under-performed and there is an apathy in the fan-base, but if you know that you are going to lose the key parts of the class and not hire someone on your list, do you make the move? On the flip-side if you can secure the class and get someone high on your list, do you pull the trigger then? Very different scenarios to me, none of which any of us know the answer to.

I guess my point is that this is not a binary decision. As angry and as apathetic as i am with the state of the program, I understand there are variables at play. My best guess says that Whitman is both able to find a decent coach and through back channeling find one that he feels good will keep a good chunk of the class intact, and that's what happens. So to me if Groce is fired its a good sign because this is all in place. In the unlikely scenario Whitman can't find a decent coach then he is not going to torpedo the whole class and set up back by hiring someone unproven.

I think and hope he is gone, there is a solid replacement, and the class comes in whole. That being said there are variables in play here and extreme statements don't seem to make much sense to me as I know that's not how Whitman is looking at it.

Just my $.02
thebizz81 is offline
Old Feb 17, 2017, 09:03 AM   #5799
Fighter of the Nightman
Fighter of the Nightman's Avatar
Location: Iowa City, IA
Posts: 374
Quote:
Originally Posted by FatGreg View Post
I really, really think that a lot of the people saying maybe Groce should get another year were born after 1990 and/or didn't become fans until at least late last decade. WE ARE ILLINOIS BASKETBALL! We're a top-15 all-time program. From the mid 1980s to the mid '00s we were one of the 8-10 most prestigious and successful teams in America. My entire life, from 1981 until a few years after I graduated from UIUC in '04, we were nationally relevant every season. 3 out of every 4 years we were ranked and a single-digit tournament seed. A Sweet 16 appearance was merely an okay year. We were in a group of programs just below the blue bloods--along with Arizona, Syracuse, Michigan State, et al--expected to compete for Elite 8 berths just about every year. We had the nation's longest home winning streak at one point. We were a borderline dominant team for the better part of two decades.

It's one thing to see the records and statistics on paper, but those of us who grew up with the Flying Illini and Lon and Self's teams feel the expectation of greatness in our bones. We should be in the tournament 8-9 out of 10 years. We should compete for Big Ten championships and Final Fours. We should pull in top-20 recruiting classes almost every year. Illinois basketball is a storied program. The fact that many fans have been throttled into accepting mediocrity is maddening. The fact that we're alternately a joke and an afterthought in the national conversation feels like some kind of alternate universe.

I like and respect Groce as a man, but he's gone as soon as the season ends and rightfully so. I feel confident that Josh Whitman has the same expectations for the program as I do: we should be invincible at home, in the tournament constantly, and in the national media cycle on a weekly basis during the season. People should talk about us like they talk about Arizona. That's where we come from. That's where we belong.
PREACH! Obviously with each year we are bad, our "all-time stats" (which are still REALLY impressive) will get a little worse compared to our competition, so this isn't just an exercise of going on Sports Reference, folks. You have to dig deep and try to remember where this program TRULY was and where it truly can be again. For me, growing up an Illini fan in Iowa City and having my formative sports years be 2001-2007, that's mighty easy. That was my reality. I didn't have Harv Schmidt in my head or memories of the sanctions, I only knew what Illinois basketball was then. I know a lot of people will say, "Oh, well those were the glory years!" Were they? I think they were a return to the NEW, post-Henson norm. We can do it. We have two decades (most of the '80s and '98-'07) as proof. The potential is bursting at the seams here, and it's sad when opposing fan bases know it more than some of our own fans do.

No number of bad seasons can EVER erase the hard evidence of what this program can achieve with the right coach; let's go get the right coach and return to a proud history.
Fighter of the Nightman is offline
Old Feb 17, 2017, 09:16 AM   #5800
UofI08
Location: Chicago
Posts: 243
Quote:
Originally Posted by thebizz81 View Post
I guess I don't understand all of the back and forth and absolute statements on here.

In terms of our coaching situation there are several facts present:
1. Groce has significantly under-performed during his tenure
2. Groce has an above average class of recruits coming in next year
3. There is a level of apathy among the fan base
4. Whitman has a list of candidates that would be good hires

Whitman knows all of these facts, he is a bright guy. That being said this is not a binary decision, these are all variables that go into the equation of what to do next. Groce has under-performed and there is an apathy in the fan-base, but if you know that you are going to lose the key parts of the class and not hire someone on your list, do you make the move? On the flip-side if you can secure the class and get someone high on your list, do you pull the trigger then? Very different scenarios to me, none of which any of us know the answer to.

I guess my point is that this is not a binary decision. As angry and as apathetic as i am with the state of the program, I understand there are variables at play. My best guess says that Whitman is both able to find a decent coach and through back channeling find one that he feels good will keep a good chunk of the class intact, and that's what happens. So to me if Groce is fired its a good sign because this is all in place. In the unlikely scenario Whitman can't find a decent coach then he is not going to torpedo the whole class and set up back by hiring someone unproven.

I think and hope he is gone, there is a solid replacement, and the class comes in whole. That being said there are variables in play here and extreme statements don't seem to make much sense to me as I know that's not how Whitman is looking at it.

Just my $.02
Actually it is a binary decision. There are only 2 options. Keep Groce or fire Groce. Nothing else matters. We will not lose our entire recruiting class. Even if we lose Tilmon, Groce needs to go. To put Tilmon into perspective, Mav Morgan is averaging 10 and 4. If Tilmon provided the same stats, that would be a GREAT freshman season.

John Groce is a terrible basketball coach and has proven it over the last 5 years. Therefore, he must be fired and replaced.

Last edited by UofI08; Feb 17, 2017 at 09:23 AM.
UofI08 is offline
Closed Thread
Thread Tools

Forum Jump