11/14 News & Notes - Jonathan Brown out vs Purdue

[Dan]

LB Jonathan Brown out for Senior Day vs. Purdue. Coach Beckman says he was in film room at 6:45 this morning w/ Freshman LBs. #Illini

http://twitter.com/MattLoveless

Beckman said Jonathan Brown is definitely OUT for Saturday's game vs. #Boilermakers. Will make decision on NW game next wk

Beckman said despite injury, Jonathan Brown was is the film room with freshman LBs Mike Svetina and Mason Monheim at 6:45 a.m. today

Beckman said CB Terry Hawthorne is taking more reps at WR and DT Akeem Spence is playing in some goal-line packages.

Beckman on Spence: "He's a big boy. He can do some things. ...Just trying to find some more girth, some big boys that can help us."

Beckman: Wanted to get Hawthorne at WR earlier but injuries prevented that.

http://twitter.com/WernerESPNCU

[illynifan34]

Feel badly for JB, but I'm guessing he's back next year now.

I doubt Hawthorne plays WR in either of these games.

[IlliniOllie]

Originally Posted by illynifan34

Feel badly for JB, but I'm guessing he's back next year now.

I doubt Hawthorne plays WR in either of these games.

I hope Hawthorne gets to play WR as much as he can the last two games. Wasn't the promise of playing WR instead of CB how we got him away from Oklahoma? Same as we promised Justin Green that he'd get to play RB instead of CB to get him away from Ohio State?

[wileyl02]

Originally Posted by IlliniOllie

I hope Hawthorne gets to play WR as much as he can the last two games. Wasn't the promise of playing WR instead of CB how we got him away from Oklahoma? Same as we promised Justin Green that he'd get to play RB instead of CB to get him away from Ohio State?

you are right on, IlliniOllie! i also remember hearing the above reasons for Hawthorne and Green, yet, as usual, our best athletes never get to touch the freaking ball!!!

[AHSIllini32]

Originally Posted by wileyl02

you are right on, IlliniOllie! i also remember hearing the above reasons for Hawthorne and Green, yet, as usual, our best athletes never get to touch the freaking ball!!!

1) Justin Green was tried at RB and failed.

2) Green was also moved to CB because he's better suited there (OSU was going to have him play there) and we needed him there after injuries and a lack of depth

3) TH has never been healthy enough to play WR

4) He was also needed more on the defensive side of the ball

5) If he can't stay healthy playing CB then he won't stay healthy playing WR

That is all.

[quhawks12]

Originally Posted by AHSIllini32

1) Justin Green was tried at RB and failed.

2) Green was also moved to CB because he's better suited there (OSU was going to have him play there) and we needed him there after injuries and a lack of depth

3) TH has never been healthy enough to play WR

4) He was also needed more on the defensive side of the ball

5) If he can't stay healthy playing CB then he won't stay healthy playing WR

That is all.

Technically Green didn't fail at RB. We just had 2 CB's at the time due to injury and went to him out of need.

[IlliniOllie]

Originally Posted by AHSIllini32

1) Justin Green was tried at RB and failed.

2) Green was also moved to CB because he's better suited there (OSU was going to have him play there) and we needed him there after injuries and a lack of depth

3) TH has never been healthy enough to play WR

4) He was also needed more on the defensive side of the ball

5) If he can't stay healthy playing CB then he won't stay healthy playing WR

That is all.

I know those are the reasons why Hawthorne and Green ended up playing CB (although I think Hawthorne has been healthy enough to play at least some WR). I just feel bad for these guys because they've had very little chance to play the positions that they came here to play. If Terry knew going in that he'd only be playing CB no matter what, does he come here or go to Oklahoma? Does Justin Green opt to play CB here or at Ohio State?

[DrewD007]

It's absolutely ridiculous to say that Justin Green "failed" at running back. The fact is that we had plenty of depth at running back with Leshoure, Ford, and Pollard and hardly any at CB. His Freshmen year Daniel Dufrene was also there so of course he wasn't going to have an opportunity at too many carries to even prove himself.

[TooHot4Tots]

Yeah Green was asked to move to CB due to injuries and welcomed the challenge and immediate PT.

[Groundhogday]

Originally Posted by DrewD007

It's absolutely ridiculous to say that Justin Green "failed" at running back. The fact is that we had plenty of depth at running back with Leshoure, Ford, and Pollard and hardly any at CB. His Freshmen year Daniel Dufrene was also there so of course he wasn't going to have an opportunity at too many carries to even prove himself.

Remember that in Green's freshman year LeShoure didn't emerge until the latter part of the season and the other guys all had weaknesses. Green was given ever opportunity to earn a larger role, and if he was something special he would have played. Even through spring ball of that year he was stuck behind a logjam of mediocre backs (other than LeShoure) and not moving up. Green is fast, but wasn't a very good RB: no vision, minimal elusiveness.

[TooHot4Tots]

http://www.sj-r.com/sports/x16163218...han-Ohio-State

[DrewD007]

Originally Posted by Groundhogday

Remember that in Green's freshman year LeShoure didn't emerge until the latter part of the season and the other guys all had weaknesses. Green was given ever opportunity to earn a larger role, and if he was something special he would have played. Even through spring ball of that year he was stuck behind a logjam of mediocre backs (other than LeShoure) and not moving up. Green is fast, but wasn't a very good RB: no vision, minimal elusiveness.

http://espn.go.com/college-football/...ighting-illini

He had 19 carries in 2009. Hardly much of a chance to prove himself. I'm not saying he was a world beater by any means, but Ford and Leshoure both averaged over 6 yards a carry and Dufrene had the experience. Just saying it's ridiculous to say he was a failure.

[SCillini]

Originally Posted by AHSIllini32

1) Justin Green was tried at RB and failed.

Originally Posted by Groundhogday

Remember that in Green's freshman year LeShoure didn't emerge until the latter part of the season and the other guys all had weaknesses. Green was given ever opportunity to earn a larger role, and if he was something special he would have played. Even through spring ball of that year he was stuck behind a logjam of mediocre backs (other than LeShoure) and not moving up. Green is fast, but wasn't a very good RB: no vision, minimal elusiveness.

I'm not sure how you can be so certain, and you certainly can't say, that Green failed or was not going to be a good RB. He had 19 carries as a backup to a future highly drafted NFL back. With this line of thinking, we could have said Mendenhall was a failure because he only carried 48 times as a Frosh, and Leshoure was too, because he only had 35 carries, and neither were standouts that first year. If we had moved those guys to LB where would we have ended up? Just ridiculous to determine Green's potential or success based on 19 carries.

[Groundhogday]

Originally Posted by DrewD007

http://espn.go.com/college-football/...ighting-illini

He had 19 carries in 2009. Hardly much of a chance to prove himself. I'm not saying he was a world beater by any means, but Ford and Leshoure both averaged over 6 yards a carry and Dufrene had the experience. Just saying it's ridiculous to say he was a failure.

He carried the ball all the time in practice: fall camp, during the season, and in the spring. If he had demonstrated an ability to beat out Ford, Pollard, etc... (none special), he would have gotten a lot more snaps in games.

Originally Posted by SCillini

I'm not sure how you can be so certain, and you certainly can't say, that Green failed or was not going to be a good RB. He had 19 carries as a backup to a future highly drafted NFL back. With this line of thinking, we could have said Mendenhall was a failure because he only carried 48 times as a Frosh, and Leshoure was too, because he only had 35 carries, and neither were standouts that first year. If we had moved those guys to LB where would we have ended up? Just ridiculous to determine Green's potential or success based on 19 carries.

The difference is that it was clear right from the start that Mendenhall was special. Coaches and players saw in in practice. We saw flashes of it in games. Rashard needed to learn to hang onto the ball before he could be trusted in games, but he was going to play. The difference was that Green was also way behind Ford and Pollard... hardly NFL backs. The difference was that the coaches knew he didn't have a chance of moving up the depth chart at RB and asked him to move to CB.

It is just ridiculous to continue this delusion that Green had potential at RB. After spring ball, Green was so upset about being buried at RB that he explored a transfer to Kentucky. But guess what? They ALSO wanted him to play DB, not RB, so he ended up staying at Illinois.

Everyone who was anyone recruited Green to play DB out of high school. We offered him a chance to play RB because that gave Zook a recruiting edge, but it was a bait-and-switch sales job all along.

[TooHot4Tots]

Originally Posted by Groundhogday

He carried the ball all the time in practice: fall camp, during the season, and in the spring. If he had demonstrated an ability to beat out Ford, Pollard, etc... (none special), he would have gotten a lot more snaps in games.

He did not fail at RB. Was going to OSU as a CB. Ranked 9th best CB. Staff felt he would be best at CB once injuries happened and knew he would get the job done and play immediately. Personally I was glad he did move there as we needed all the help we could get.

[TexasIllini]

Sorry if I missed this already posted somewhere else..does anyone know what type of injury Jonathan Brown sustained?

[quhawks12]

Originally Posted by TexasIllini

Sorry if I missed this already posted somewhere else..does anyone know what type of injury Jonathan Brown sustained?

Shoulder is all we know.

[DrewD007]

Originally Posted by Groundhogday

He carried the ball all the time in practice: fall camp, during the season, and in the spring. If he had demonstrated an ability to beat out Ford, Pollard, etc... (none special), he would have gotten a lot more snaps in games.


The difference is that it was clear right from the start that Mendenhall was special. Coaches and players saw in in practice. We saw flashes of it in games. Rashard needed to learn to hang onto the ball before he could be trusted in games, but he was going to play. The difference was that Green was also way behind Ford and Pollard... hardly NFL backs. The difference was that the coaches knew he didn't have a chance of moving up the depth chart at RB and asked him to move to CB.

It is just ridiculous to continue this delusion that Green had potential at RB. After spring ball, Green was so upset about being buried at RB that he explored a transfer to Kentucky. But guess what? They ALSO wanted him to play DB, not RB, so he ended up staying at Illinois.

Everyone who was anyone recruited Green to play DB out of high school. We offered him a chance to play RB because that gave Zook a recruiting edge, but it was a bait-and-switch sales job all along.

April 2010: Green suffers broken ankle

Maybe him having a broken ankle in Spring Ball had something to do with him being "buried"...

[Groundhogday]

Originally Posted by DrewD007

Maybe him having a broken ankle in Spring Ball had something to do with him being "buried"...

And then again, maybe he was way behind the other buys before and after the ankle. Then again, maybe he was still buried in fall camp, which is why he JUMPED at the chance to play CB.

But nice try.:rolleyes: Good to know that young people are still being trained in revisionist history.

[quhawks12]

Truth is he was a better CB. That's why we were the only ones who agreed to give him a "shot" at RB. So who cares...he's probably going to play at the next level for someone. He's a solid CB with good size and speed.

[DrewD007]

Originally Posted by Groundhogday

And then again, maybe he was way behind the other buys before and after the ankle. Then again, maybe he was still buried in fall camp, which is why he JUMPED at the chance to play CB.

But nice try.:rolleyes: Good to know that young people are still being trained in revisionist history.

It says right in the article...

"A highly touted recruit, Green's limited role in 2009 is likely to increase in 2010. Mikel Leshoure and Jason Ford are ahead of Green on the tailback depth chart."

Also looking through IlliniHQ archives, nothing about him being behind anyone besides Ford and Leshoure.

Here's a bit from him after he moved to CB after the injury to Sanni.

Playing behind Mikel Leshoure and Jason Ford at tailback, Green was looking for more time. So, he went to Zook and asked to move to defense.

"I saw an opportunity," Green said. "Any way I can help the team, I'm willing to do it."

http://www.illinihq.com/sports/illin...nnis-void.html

He was clearly the 3rd back before moving to CB(hardly a failure), but wanted to be on the field more.

[Groundhogday]

Originally Posted by quhawks12

Truth is he was a better CB. That's why we were the only ones who agreed to give him a "shot" at RB. So who cares...he's probably going to play at the next level for someone. He's a solid CB with good size and speed.

Do you think he might be moved to FS in the NFL? Green has good size and speed, but isn't the most natural CB in coverage. As a FS, his blazing speed could take over and I suspect he could be really good.

[DrewD007]

I'll also second the notion that he's a better CB than RB. I was merely disputing the notion he was a failure at RB.

[Groundhogday]

Originally Posted by DrewD007

It says right in the article...

"A highly touted recruit, Green's limited role in 2009 is likely to increase in 2010. Mikel Leshoure and Jason Ford are ahead of Green on the tailback depth chart."

You are going to cite an IlliniHQ article pointing to his high school recruitment as authoritative? :laugh:

Originally Posted by DrewD007

He was clearly the 3rd back before moving to CB(hardly a failure), but wanted to be on the field more.

You obviously think more highly of Ford than I do. He was a capable backup RB, but if Green had something he would have been LeShoure's backup. Instead he was clearly behind LeShoure and Ford, fighting for snaps with Pollard. I guess if you think being a 3-4th string RB at Illinois is success, then Green wasn't a failure. It was pretty clear to anyone paying attention that he was never going to be starting material as a high major RB. That is why even Kentucky wouldn't promise him playing time at RB.

[quhawks12]

Originally Posted by Groundhogday

Do you think he might be moved to FS in the NFL? Green has good size and speed, but isn't the most natural CB in coverage. As a FS, his blazing speed could take over and I suspect he could be really good.

I actually see him more as a nickel than anything. Not sure he has the size or plays physical enough to play free in the NFL.