2019-20 Coaching Discussion/Carousel

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We had a head coach from a small school, didn't work.
We had a head coach from the NFL, isn't working.

I want a coach with experience and success with a big time college program, if that's a coordinator so be it. We want to become a big time program, so we must take from a big time program. I want our Kirby Smart.
 
We had a head coach from a small school, didn't work.
We had a head coach from the NFL, isn't working.

I want a coach with experience and success with a big time college program, if that's a coordinator so be it.
Tim Beckman was a DC at Oklahoma State when they emerged as a powerhouse under Mike Gundy.
Ron Zook was DC on some enormously successful Florida teams.
Ron Turner had been OC at USC, albeit briefly
Lou Tepper was an awesome, hugely successful DC under both Bill McCartney at Colorado and under Mackovic at Illinois
John Mackovic had been the OC at Arizona during the period of success that got them invited to what became the Pac 10.
Mike White was OC at Stanford during the most successful run that program had ever had pre-Harbaugh
Gary Moeller was Bo Schembechler's right hand man at Michigan both before and after Illinois.

It cannot be overemphasized: there is not One Weird Trick to coaching resumes that Illinois hasn't tried that would solve everything.
 
I really doubt they can beat NW. No way the offense will be able to score points. And Purdue is a toss up imo.

The day after the NW loss I expect an announcement from Whitman.
I personally don't think we can win anything outside of Rutgers at this point. I'm just saying that technically there is time to improve. I am going to root them on even though I don't have confident this coaching staff is going to get that done. But there is time
 
Likes: OrangeSoda
Glen Mason is tanned, rested and ready. He already broadcasts half of our games, he could step in seamlessly!

(I googled Glen Mason in preparing this post, and it is my urgent duty to alert you to the following shirt:



That is all.)
Glen Mason is the type of coach we need to hire. Not Glen himself, as he's getting a bit up there in years now, but someone with that sort of personality. He can be a bit annoying, but he's enthusiastic, and a decent game-day coach. His teams had a real identity. MN was nuts to fire him.
 
Plainfield
Well I think you guys are cherry picking. A great coordinator does not equate a great head coach and more often than not does not, although he has a better chance of success if he has lots of talent (like at tOSU)

The only proven head coach we hired that won was Mike White (took Cal to the Rose Bowl and don’t say he only won because of cheating as that is BS).

Mackovic was a great in game coach but started losing and bailed once he ran out of Mike White talent.

since then we have not hired a proven head coach - Beckman had a couple of good years at an upper tier MAC school. He was not proven and Thomas did not do his homework.

Zook proved he wasn’t a great coach by going 7-4 at Florida. Any former head coach from a strong program who failed there is likely to fail here as well

Examples of proven head coaches: Brohm, Fleck, Herman, et al. nothing is guaranteed but they have a higher chance of success and you have a head coaching history to evaluate. Any coordinator looks like a genius when he’s blessed with talent. The guys I listed as proven built programs from the ground up.

I also don’t believe Feldman or any other media person’s opinion of who would be interested. This is just lazy journalism - Illinois sucks so no one will be interested. Bs. Each individual is different and there are all sorts of other factors involved like if they like the AD or where their family is from etc.

I trust that if a change is made, Josh will surprise Mr. Feldman. Who would have predicted we’d poach Underwood from OSU?
 
Glen Mason is the type of coach we need to hire. Not Glen himself, as he's getting a bit up there in years now, but someone with that sort of personality. He can be a bit annoying, but he's enthusiastic, and a decent game-day coach. His teams had a real identity. MN was nuts to fire him.
Mason was a pretty unique situation for those who may not remember. He took the Georgia job after going 9-2 at KU in 1995, only to have a change of heart a week later and go back. There were hurt feelings all the way around, Kansas slumped to 4-7 the next season, and Mason slunk off to a Minnesota regarded at the time as the worst program in the Big Ten.

The list of coaches who were on the list for that job is quite something to look back on:

Bob Stoops, then Florida DC, interviewed and visited campus but decided to turn it down.
Frank Solich interviewed and didn't get it, he would go on to be Tom Osborne's successor a year later.
Marc Trestman (!) an alum who was then 49ers OC, withdrew from consideration.
 
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The only proven head coach we hired that won was Mike White (took Cal to the Rose Bowl and don’t say he only won because of cheating as that is BS).
Mike White did not take Cal to the Rose Bowl (they tied for the then-Pac 8 title in 1975 and UCLA went to the Rose Bowl), and he may have won for many reasons, but he was definitely cheating, which is why he got fired there, and he continued cheating here.

I remain resolutely pro-cheating, but part of that is being honest about it.

since then we have not hired a proven head coach - Beckman had a couple of good years at an upper tier MAC school. He was not proven

Examples of proven head coaches: Brohm, Fleck, Herman, et al.
Any difference between Beckman and the three you named is one of degree, not of kind.
 
What are your guys thoughts on Mike MacIntyre? Turned around two dismal programs at the time in San Jose St and Colorado. Now a dc at Ole Miss he’s a former head coach with success and someone you’d think would have serious interest in Illinois
 
What are your guys thoughts on Mike MacIntyre? Turned around two dismal programs at the time in San Jose St and Colorado. Now a dc at Ole Miss he’s a former head coach with success and someone you’d think would have serious interest in Illinois
9 years as a head coach, 7 losing seasons. Very much took the Lovie route rebuilding a flat-on-their-back Colorado, didn't recruit amazingly, but played those guys young and built a very experienced team that finally broke through and really succeeded in 2016. Then those guys graduated and it fell back into mediocrity immediately, and it didn't help that Jim Leavitt, the defensive mastermind of the project, left for Oregon.

The best of the retread pile is still Todd Graham, for me.
 
What are your guys thoughts on Mike MacIntyre? Turned around two dismal programs at the time in San Jose St and Colorado. Now a dc at Ole Miss he’s a former head coach with success and someone you’d think would have serious interest in Illinois
I'm not sure I'd say he turned around Colorado. Yes, they improved overall -- 23-60 record for two previous coaches (7 seasons) versus his 30-44 record in 6 seasons, but he only had one season over .500. And as an Oregon State fan, I'm fully aware that he lost to the Beavers last year at home -- giving them their only Pac-12 win over two seasons.
 
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Little Rock, Arkansas
I’m still of the camp that the only true indicator of a potential head coach’s future success is their ability to put together the appropriate staff.

And that comes with the school’s commitment to the program and the amount of money the coach has to play with.

Now, it might not be the DECIDING factor but I think it’s the biggest. And it might explain why “hire the next up and comer HC from a smaller school” has a slightly higher success rate than the other categories Gritty laid out. (Retreads, coordinators, NFLers, Div III...etc)
 
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9 years as a head coach, 7 losing seasons. Very much took the Lovie route rebuilding a flat-on-their-back Colorado, didn't recruit amazingly, but played those guys young and built a very experienced team that finally broke through and really succeeded in 2016. Then those guys graduated and it fell back into mediocrity immediately, and it didn't help that Jim Leavitt, the defensive mastermind of the project, left for Oregon.

The best of the retread pile is still Todd Graham, for me.
Only problem with Graham is how big of a toolbag he seems to be. What he did at Rice and Pitt as far as leaving how he did really rubs me the wrong way.
 
Only problem with Graham is how big of a toolbag he seems to be. What he did at Rice and Pitt as far as lea, but he'llving how he did really rubs me , butthe wrong way.
I think Graham's learned his lesson and will be grateful for an opportunity in CU if he has some success, and stick around until retirement. The guy knows how to coach, can attract top assistants and understands that recruiting and momentum are the biggest factors in rebuilding a program. Here's a link to the guy's background https://coachingtreehotseat.com/what-is-todd-graham-doing-now/ . I read another article where he's really "chomping at the bit" to get back into coaching, although he's still getting some big bucks from his ASU settlement.

He doesn't need to be enticed like Lovie who was quite happy fishing and enjoying life in Tampa...
I think he's about the best fit for Illinois out there. He won't win a national championship, but he'll regularly get us to bowls and the occasional major bowl. A lot of Edwards best players are his recruits, and Herm is developing the recruiting network Graham set up very well. Two of my kids recently graduated from ASU (they graduated in 2017) so I'd been following it pretty closely.
 
The best of the retread pile is still Todd Graham, for me.
Yeah, the retreads that are available don't seem to hold a candle to the up-and-coming assistants and HC's that are available. And that's probably a good thing for the fan base, since we're all a bit fatigued with the retreads.

We made a mistake with Beckman, but that doesn't make me worried about MAC coaches, including the one at Toledo. The interview process (with a competent guy like Whitman in the mix) should be able to sort the wheat from the lasagna.
 
Mike White did not take Cal to the Rose Bowl (they tied for the then-Pac 8 title in 1975 and UCLA went to the Rose Bowl), and he may have won for many reasons, but he was definitely cheating, which is why he got fired there, and he continued cheating here.

I remain resolutely pro-cheating, but part of that is being honest about it.



Any difference between Beckman and the three you named is one of degree, not of kind.
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He turned around Colorado, and then the program collapsed again. Very similar to Turner and Zook.
MacIntyre had one winning season at Colorado. I believe that should be credited to Jim Levitt coming in 2015/2016 and the Defense started to perform. Levitt leaves to be the Oregon DC and they crumbled.
 
Plainfield
Mike White did not take Cal to the Rose Bowl (they tied for the then-Pac 8 title in 1975 and UCLA went to the Rose Bowl), and he may have won for many reasons, but he was definitely cheating, which is why he got fired there, and he continued cheating here.

I remain resolutely pro-cheating, but part of that is being honest about it.



Any difference between Beckman and the three you named is one of degree, not of kind.
well I won’t debate Mike White and sidetrack this discussion but Beckman was more than a matter of degree. He simply was not a PROVEN head coach. He had two relatively good seasons at Toledo. Unlike Fleck for example, he did not rebuild a program from the ground and corny as it is, his row the boat/rah rah attitude built student enthusiasm. Fleck has something special about him as did Mike White. Mike White created a buzz and enthusiasm among the students that was impossible to resist. Under White you felt guilty if you weren’t at Memorial on a Saturday. He was visible on campus and constantly engaging the students to build the program. That is part of the job at downtrodden Illinois - selling the program to students and alums.
 
Austin, TX
We had a head coach from a small school, didn't work.
We had a head coach from the NFL, isn't working.

I want a coach with experience and success with a big time college program, if that's a coordinator so be it. We want to become a big time program, so we must take from a big time program. I want our Kirby Smart.
What if we get any coach and let us assume for a moment that talent for some odd reason flows into CU. Will that work?

Or a great coach and no talent?

The trick is to get both. So, which great coach from any level can attract great talent?
 
Austin, TX
What if:

Lovie is NOT fired. Other coaches are let go.

Josh hires an HC anyways and hands the keys to the new coach?

Granted the financials will be .........
 
Captain 'Paign
Phoenix, AZ
I'd be okay with Graham, too, fwiw. As also an ASU alum who watched a fair amount of their games, I thought he kind of got a raw deal.
 
Tim Beckman was a DC at Oklahoma State when they emerged as a powerhouse under Mike Gundy.
Ron Zook was DC on some enormously successful Florida teams.
Ron Turner had been OC at USC, albeit briefly
Lou Tepper was an awesome, hugely successful DC under both Bill McCartney at Colorado and under Mackovic at Illinois
John Mackovic had been the OC at Arizona during the period of success that got them invited to what became the Pac 10.
Mike White was OC at Stanford during the most successful run that program had ever had pre-Harbaugh
Gary Moeller was Bo Schembechler's right hand man at Michigan both before and after Illinois.

It cannot be overemphasized: there is not One Weird Trick to coaching resumes that Illinois hasn't tried that would solve everything.
Based solely on this list OC>>DC and I’d go with Matt Canada.
 
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