Illinois 85, The Citadel 57 POSTGAME

#77
Champaign
For those who are a little more informed with schemes and all that, what do you guys think about the new focus on offense and defense? Were these good changes?
The defense has been better the last couple games. Sure not playing the best teams but haven't been giving up the massive amounts of open looks we did last year. A lot more good contests and making them shoot over someone, less open layups and backdoors, wayyyyy less fouls but also a lot less turnovers forced. I haven't looked at the numbers but I would guess our opponents fg% is much improved from early last season. The switch away from the constant high pressure and denial of the passes seems to be paying off so far.
 
Likes: TheGMan
#78
If I’m Ayo I’m not as thrilled with AF running the point. Personally I’d rather get another guy in there and bring AF off the bench like last year.
Not disagreeing about Feliz off the bench, I think Ayo/TF/Kipper actually wouldn't be bad as a group. Kipper doesn't need the ball to fit in that group, Feliz does. Feliz can bring energy off the bench, add Griffin sharp shooting, and DaMonte spelling Kipper with either Trent or Ayo with them. I think that rotation makes alot more sense....however,

TF asst-TO says he should be running point-Feliz asst/TO ratio says he should be is 2nd...care to hazard a guess on 3rd. Based on 30 min per game pt. Curbelo will come in very handy next year.

Really hoping Ayo kicks it in gear by conference time...14.pts per game even asst-TO ratio basically and 20% from 3pt range?
 
#79
Kofi is much more athletic than Leonard
Kofi is at this stage more athletic, less cumbersome than Meyers was same age...Meyers was drafted based on what he could become athletically, his frame is much more inline with the NBA idea of what an athletic BIG should be:

https://www.nbadraft.net/players/meyers-leonard/.

https://247sports.com/college/illinois/Article/Illinois-Fighting-Illini-basketball-2020-NBA-Draft-Ayo-Dosunmu-Kofi-Cockburn-133028247/

https://www.thestepien.com/2019/04/18/2019-nike-hoop-summit-notes-world-team/

In due time though, in due time...
 
Likes: Double ACL
#80
long time reader, first time poster! I just wanted to bring up a fun conversation I've had with some friends recently. I remember missing out on oscar tshiebwe to west Virginia...i was especially excited about his strength and rebounding abilities. When we missed out I was super bummed. I was like we need a brute to crash the boards. Time went on and we signed a BIGGER GIANT but lesser rated (not by too much) Kofi Cockburn...my excitement returned, and in retrospect, I think we came out with the better deal.

Oscar is nearly averaging a double double at west Virginia thru 3 or 4 games...and he did have a 20 point 15+ board game himself, but he's either been dominant or relatively quiet. Kofi on the other hand doesn't seem to even be doing as much as he can and last time I checked dude was averaging 15 and 12 (don't think that's factoring in lastnight). Anyway...its like picking apples over oranges and I'm sure oscar turns up the gears as the season progresses but I think I'm extremely happy we got kofi over oscar. Again speculating what he would be doing in an illini uniform is pretty pointless, but just worth showing the side by side comparsion of the start of each respective freshmen and their start to the season is a feel good realisation that we may have lost the 5 star oscar, but we gained what we were initially looking for AND tHEN SOME with kofi Anyway.....not hating ooscar...not trying to say anything besides based on strictly numbers kofi has turned out to be the better deal. I also say it because I would see all over kofi high school highlights after he committed to Illinois these W.V. fans saying Big O. is the better and stronger big lol.
 
#81
long time reader, first time poster! I just wanted to bring up a fun conversation I've had with some friends recently. I remember missing out on oscar tshiebwe to west Virginia...i was especially excited about his strength and rebounding abilities. When we missed out I was super bummed. I was like we need a brute to crash the boards. Time went on and we signed a BIGGER GIANT but lesser rated (not by too much) Kofi Cockburn...my excitement returned, and in retrospect, I think we came out with the better deal.

Oscar is nearly averaging a double double at west Virginia thru 3 or 4 games...and he did have a 20 point 15+ board game himself, but he's either been dominant or relatively quiet. Kofi on the other hand doesn't seem to even be doing as much as he can and last time I checked dude was averaging 15 and 12 (don't think that's factoring in lastnight). Anyway...its like picking apples over oranges and I'm sure oscar turns up the gears as the season progresses but I think I'm extremely happy we got kofi over oscar. Again speculating what he would be doing in an illini uniform is pretty pointless, but just worth showing the side by side comparsion of the start of each respective freshmen and their start to the season is a feel good realisation that we may have lost the 5 star oscar, but we gained what we were initially looking for AND tHEN SOME with kofi Anyway.....not hating ooscar...not trying to say anything besides based on strictly numbers kofi has turned out to be the better deal. I also say it because I would see all over kofi high school highlights after he committed to Illinois these W.V. fans saying Big O. is the better and stronger big lol.
space

space

space....j/k, Welcome aboard, I think the 2 are complimentary to the systems in which they play. Huggy has always liked the big, physical PF types, not so much center types. BU needed the muscle and rim protector that Kofi is and can be.

I think when it is all said done, BOTH guys will have done exactly what the coaches and schools needed them to do when they recruited them. Coin toss really at this point, but I am really glad we have Kofi.
 
#83
I think it would be better for the program if Ayo does go this year and we get Miller with Trent and Andre next year?
I don’t really see this as a question. If we can put Ayo in the NBA and then get Miller there in 1-2 years we should be able to keep the top 35 CG train rolling.

If we can send Kofi to the NBA in 2 years AND develop Giorgi into an NBA talent in 4 years then I’d hope that would encourage some more top 35 big men to come our way as well.

If we have too 35 talent at the guard and big level, it’s not too hard to imagine recruiting top wings to go with them.
 
Likes: PlayAZ
#84
Enjoy Kofi while you can, he may only have about 30 games left with us.
BBV is an incredible find, maybe my favorite player on the team.
I saw someone ask if Feliz is the best rebounding guard in the country but he's not even the best on the team. DaMonte is.
I trashed Ayo earlier and feel bad about it but he can be so much better and we all know it.
I would say arguably Alan also has to be in that conversation.
 
Likes: Ga65
#85
Can someone explain to my why Williams is seeing so much playing time, 22 minutes this past game and basically the same as the starters. And yet, other than a handful of rebounds, he doesn't score, rarely assists, not a defensive stopper, I just don't get it what he contributes to get that much time. I would rather have one of my younger up and coming players in there gathering those numbers and gaining experience for the future. What am I missing ?
 
Likes: pruman91
#86
Can someone explain to my why Williams is seeing so much playing time, 22 minutes this past game and basically the same as the starters. And yet, other than a handful of rebounds, he doesn't score, rarely assists, not a defensive stopper, I just don't get it what he contributes to get that much time. I would rather have one of my younger up and coming players in there gathering those numbers and gaining experience for the future. What am I missing ?
9 Rebound means 9 more possessions, possibly more for the opponents, means 0-18-36 more points for them as well. That is more than a mere handful of rebounds. He bodies up against better players, he plays the game fluid, because he understands the game more nights than not. Is ha an offensive juggernaut....NO, but he is as basketball player and a good fit for the minutes that BU gives him. He produces in other ways, Griffin cannot yet, Kipper gets lost trying to do, and Jones isn't mature enough to handle yet?
 
#87
9 Rebound means 9 more possessions, possibly more for the opponents, means 0-18-36 more points for them as well. That is more than a mere handful of rebounds. He bodies up against better players, he plays the game fluid, because he understands the game more nights than not. Is ha an offensive juggernaut....NO, but he is as basketball player and a good fit for the minutes that BU gives him. He produces in other ways, Griffin cannot yet, Kipper gets lost trying to do, and Jones isn't mature enough to handle yet?
He also had 3 steals which was more than the rest of the team combined.
 
#88
Damonte is frustrating at times because he isn't more of an offensive threat, I get that. But he more than makes up for it on the defensive side and with his all-around hustle at both ends of the floor. I don't get the angst over his minutes, he is 6th on the team in minutes, which is typical for???? You guessed it! A 6th man! Not many teams have 5 starters averaging double digits (we have 4) and every good team needs good to great role players and/or glue guys, he is that for us! Damonte has not started a single game this year, and some want to complain about what he brings from the bench ??????
 
Likes: FiveStar
#89
Shaq is insane. Literally never been another like him. He is so agile and fluid for such a large man. I mean, Kofi is huge and athletic, but he is Shawn Bradley stiff compared to Shaq, imo.
 
Likes: PlayAZ
#90
D. Will is not averaging 9 rebounds a game but only 4 per game. Not 3 steals but less than 1 per game. Averages only 1.5 pts per game and averages less than 1 assist. When we begin playing taller squads, I can almost guarantee his rebounding numbers going down. Sorry I can't see production like that garnering that many minutes.
 
#91
D. Will is not averaging 9 rebounds a game but only 4 per game. Not 3 steals but less than 1 per game. Averages only 1.5 pts per game and averages less than 1 assist. When we begin playing taller squads, I can almost guarantee his rebounding numbers going down. Sorry I can't see production like that garnering that many minutes.
So what exactly do you expect from our 1st or 2nd player off the bench? 10pts, 5reb, 2asst? Is there a single player in the B1G that averages 3 steals? Our entire team only averages 4.4 steals per game. Out of 22 steals for the entire team on the season, Damonte has 4 of them.... Coach U isn't just throwing him out there cuz he is a polite young man who walks old ladies across the street. There has to be a reason..... Are you not watching any of the numerous videos where Coach Underwood tells us exactly why Damonte sees the floor?

Bottom line, 5 games into the season is way too early to be getting down on any of our players. I fully expect Damonte's numbers to improve to the point that most everyone is happy.

My memory could be totally off. But wasn't Damonte a starter at the 3 for us all or most of last season? I am confidant Underwood is figuring out the best usage for him.
 
#93
I think we need to still see Kofi against Teske, Wesson, Haarms, etc before we worry about the NBA. If he can play them even we are in good shape and if he dominates ?? Arizona is what was expected but they have been the only size he has been against.
 
#94
D. Will is not averaging 9 rebounds a game but only 4 per game. Not 3 steals but less than 1 per game. Averages only 1.5 pts per game and averages less than 1 assist. When we begin playing taller squads, I can almost guarantee his rebounding numbers going down. Sorry I can't see production like that garnering that many minutes.
First, no one said he was averaging those amounts of rebounds and assists, you mentioned the 22 minutes he played last game and those numbers are why he got that time, because DW is also not averaging 22 mpg. He is averaging 17.2 mpg, and a large chunk of his minutes cane in last game and against GCU. In other 3 games he averaged 12.3 mpg.

Second, I’m not sure who these young players from whom he is stealing minutes. AG is getting consistent minutes. Sure they could go up some and I an see that, but how much more is optimum? DW isn’t stealing minutes from TJ And I don’t think BU sees BBV in same role as DW right now, so I don’t see him as stealing minutes.

The thing is that when someone says “can anyone tell me” it usually means they just don’t agree with the decision and likely won’t be swayed. BU has said multiple times what he values in DW and those are the reasons DW gets minutes. And it just so happens that some of those things don’t show up in the box score. If you assign the highest value to points then DW is always going to lack in your eyes. If you value defense (and steals aren’t the only part of good defense), rebounding, being in the right place on both offense and defense so that it runs well, and doing the lunch pail/glue things that make the overall team better than the value of DW is easy to see. I fall in the latter group because there is only one ball and DW positively impacts the game without having to have it in his hands on offense. Does his offense frustrate me sometimes? Yes, of course it does, but not to the point I can’t value all his other contributions. Think of it this way. If DW was showing AG’s offensive skill set, AG would barely see the floor. And if AG did all the tings DW does well than DW would barely see the floor. Until one of those things happens BU will continue to employ them as the game dictates to hopefully maximize total team performance not just one individual’s stats.
 
#95
Yonkers, NY
opposing teams don't need to guard damonte in the half court, which clogs up the lane and makes scoring harder for the other guys out there.

that's the problem.
 
Likes: pruman91
#96
Kofi to the NBA in 2 years AND develop Giorgi into an NBA talent in 4 years
This is more the key than the guards imo....guards for most part should develop from sheer playing time and handling the ball, bigs take longer and or may never develop.
 
#97
Can someone explain to my why Williams is seeing so much playing time, 22 minutes this past game and basically the same as the starters. And yet, other than a handful of rebounds, he doesn't score, rarely assists, not a defensive stopper, I just don't get it what he contributes to get that much time. I would rather have one of my younger up and coming players in there gathering those numbers and gaining experience for the future. What am I missing ?
If you get rebounds you are a defensive stopper by definition because you stop the other teams offensive possession
 
#98
opposing teams don't need to guard damonte in the half court, which clogs up the lane and makes scoring harder for the other guys out there.

that's the problem.
This just isn’t happening. Go back and watch the games and post screenshots of defense sagging off DMW. You’re not going to find many examples.
 
Likes: MULEDOG35
#99
If you get rebounds you are a defensive stopper by definition because you stop the other teams offensive possession
I think of "defensive stopper" as you putting him on a guy who is averaging 18 pts per game and you hold him to 10-12 points that game. That is extremely valuable.