Illinois Basketball 2016-2017

[Newman]

Reading through the posts, I still am not understanding how anyone can pick us in the top four of the conference next year. I have questions if Abrams ever plays again and even if he does, certainly don't expect him to step in and pick up where he left off two years ago after the injuries he has sustained. Will Black be back healthy and can he contribute at the level everyone thinks he can?

I don't see that much more depth or collective talent than we have had at any time during the last four years, a period of time that we have not even sniffed the upper echelon of the conference. Still think the bubble is the ceiling for next year's team. Hope I am wrong, but that is my feeling until proven otherwise.

We have gone through this exercise about how great next year's team is going to be for so long that I have been conditioned to temper my expectations. I would love for Illinois basketball to be great and fun again, but do not see the optimism that others do.

Black will be fully healed by then. To be honest, he probably could play this season if we absolutely needed but there's no point trying to rush him back. You can't tell me that a guy that is that active on the sideline couldn't suit up. Even with a safe prediction that he only contributes what he did his freshmen year, that is already a huge improvement in what we have with rebounding while allowing Hill to play his natural position. I feel like people are acting as if Leron's production in Europe was a myth. That actually happened, he played great against legit teams. Add Black with any improvement you get with DJW, and some decent minutes from Kipper, and we should be pretty good at the 4. If we get a 5th year big and play Finke at the 4 then we'll have crazy depth at that position. I don't know what to expect from Abrams but it's already a huge improvement having him suit up, just from a leadership standpoint. The combo of the 3 point guards is a significant improvement over what we currently have. No point in going over the 2 with JCL, Nunn, Jordan.. we're good there. That leaves us with Morgan, Finke, and whatever we get as a transfer. Morgan has shown flashes that he could be a decent guy from here on out, but he needs help at the 4 with defense and rebounding. At the very least, we know what we can expect there and although it's not our best position, it's not as bad as it could have been if MM didn't make the decent jump on offense.

That is a very, very deep team, but not elite by any means. Even with our issues this year, we weren't terribly far away from having good results. The improved production at the pg, help with rebounding, improved defense, and increase in athleticism could go a long way. Is it a top 4 team in the conference? That's a little silly to debate at this point, but if you can't see how this is a deeper team than what we've had in the past 4 years, then I don't think there's really anything you can do but wait and see. There's no way that their ceiling next year is a bubble team. IMO, that's their floor if they're healthy.

 

[blackdog]

Can you give me a link to the video, or is it behind a paywall?

I think the wording of the NCAA regs matters more than what a reporter says, and that wording at least opens the possibility of a medical redshirt here. Still, I'd like to see what Werner says.

http://www.scout.com/college/illinois/story/1635857-medical-redshirt-possibilities-for-illini

Video is from just after the Minnesota game.

 

[WesterveltVictoryCigar]

I'm curious if Thorne will get a 6th year? Either we'll have Thorne or a 5tg year big.

No, Thorne's not coming back next year. I suspect we'll be in the market this spring for another 5th year guy to replace him. And we have to add a big in the 2017 class, too.

 

[Epsilon]

Question: I've seen a number of posts assuming that Kipper will play the four. He seems more suited to a 3 to me, with strength and size to play the four, similar to Malcolm, but I wondered if anyone heard anything from Kipper himself or from coach to make that assumption. TIA!

 

[Adnarel]

I'm considering putting "Mike Thorne will not play next season. Stop asking." in my sig.

 

[icengineer]

A tangent on the Thorne/6th year thing. Has any player ever come back from an injury and played a few games at the end of the year, rather than the beginning, been ruled eligible for a redshirt?

I think this is what is confusing to so many people. Does the rule actually state that the 30% must come in the first half of the year?

 

[WesterveltVictoryCigar]

Can you explain to me why he won't? My understanding is that if a player plays in less than 30% of the teams games, they're eligible for a redshirt (Thorne has played in 8 total games thus far). Or is this more of a hunch that the NCAA won't allow two 6th seniors on the same team?

It's been posted multiple times, even in this thread. Start at post #26.

 

[TCTORNADO]

Thorne's Grandma lives more than 90 miles from Champaign and is not terminally ill, so definitely no 6th year.

 

[illynifan34]

I'm considering putting "Mike Thorne will not play next season. Stop asking." in my sig.

I was thinking about asking on the next page because I think we can't have a page of posts without someone asking.

 

[URH Snyder 490]

Just realized this but we will have no juniors next year...

Seniors: Nunn, Hill, Abrams, Tate, Morgan and a 5th Year big?
Juniors:
Sophomores: DJW, Jordan, JCL, Black and Finke
Freshman: Nichols, TJL

This is me getting sucked back in and I'm sure I'll be sorry, but that re-aligned Soph class adding Black & Finke has the potential to be really great.

Can't help myself

 

[Cubby Blue]

This is me getting sucked back in and I'm sure I'll be sorry, but that re-aligned Soph class adding Black & Finke has the potential to be really great.

Can't help myself

It has the looks of a foundation class. It came together by different means, but it will be Groce's 3rd recruiting class. In this state, it doesn't surprise me that it took 2 to 3 years to get the inroads to have that type of class. It also will be the junior class when the 2017 recruits hit the floor running.

 

[URH Snyder 490]

Reading through the posts, I still am not understanding how anyone can pick us in the top four of the conference next year. I have questions if Abrams ever plays again and even if he does, certainly don't expect him to step in and pick up where he left off two years ago after the injuries he has sustained. Will Black be back healthy and can he contribute at the level everyone thinks he can?

I don't see that much more depth or collective talent than we have had at any time during the last four years, a period of time that we have not even sniffed the upper echelon of the conference. Still think the bubble is the ceiling for next year's team. Hope I am wrong, but that is my feeling until proven otherwise.

We have gone through this exercise about how great next year's team is going to be for so long that I have been conditioned to temper my expectations. I would love for Illinois basketball to be great and fun again, but do not see the optimism that others do.

I think going from worst PGs in (Power 5 conferences || Division I) to somewhere around below average will be a huge benefit to everyone.

Maybe I'm overestimating TJL and Tracy, certainly possible.

 

[Adnarel]

Thorne's Grandma lives more than 90 miles from Champaign and is not terminally ill, so definitely no 6th year.

POTD spotted!

 

[HeartofaChampion]

I think going from worst PGs in (Power 5 conferences || Division I) to somewhere around below average will be a huge benefit to everyone.

Maybe I'm overestimating TJL and Tracy, certainly possible.

+1. And just having a healthy roster with the expected soph leaps of JCL, MF, et al, and re-adding LB as well. IF we're fully healthy (big IF, especially considering TA may end up losing 10-20 percent of his quickness and explosion due to the injuries), we could have a nice squad next year, a top-6 B1G team that earns a top-7 or 8 seed in the Dance IMO.

 

[HeartofaChampion]

BTW, not sure if anyone's posted this, but was just wondering if it's still possible for MT to get a RS year for next year? Or did playing at IU cost him that opportunity?

 

[CoalCity]

BTW, not sure if anyone's posted this, but was just wondering if it's still possible for MT to get a RS year for next year? Or did playing at IU cost him that opportunity?

:smash: LOL

 

[Crazy Joe Davola]

BTW, not sure if anyone's posted this, but was just wondering if it's still possible for MT to get a RS year for next year? Or did playing at IU cost him that opportunity?

Franklin Delano Bluth messaged me that his best friend's sister's boyfriend's brother's girlfriend heard from a guy at a hot dog stand who knows this kid who goes to a certain barber shop who saw Big Mike pass out at 31 Flavors after the season defining victory over Rutgers. I guess it's pretty serious.

Anyway, rumor has it getting the 6th year is just a formality at this point.

 

[Franklin Delano Bluth]

Franklin Delano Bluth messaged me that his best friend's sister's boyfriend's brother's girlfriend heard from a guy at a hot dog stand who knows this kid who goes to a certain barber shop who saw Big Mike pass out at 31 Flavors after the season defining victory over Rutgers. I guess it's pretty serious.

Anyway, rumor has it getting the 6th year is just a formality at this point.

That wasn't supposed to get out



and it was a combination Dunkin Donuts/ 31 Flavors

 

[unimaroon]

Mark my words, Mike Thorne's contribution as a sixth year Illini will be incalculable.

 

[Epsilon]

Mark my words, Mike Thorne's contribution as a sixth year Illini will be incalculable.

Just ask Siri what 0 / 0 is. Seriously, ask her. It's pretty cute.

 

[schnaurt]

Just ask Siri what 0 / 0 is. Seriously, ask her. It's pretty cute.

The cookie monster is indeed sad.

 

[Jabber Jabber]

Black will be fully healed by then. To be honest, he probably could play this season if we absolutely needed but there's no point trying to rush him back. You can't tell me that a guy that is that active on the sideline couldn't suit up. Even with a safe prediction that he only contributes what he did his freshmen year, that is already a huge improvement in what we have with rebounding while allowing Hill to play his natural position. I feel like people are acting as if Leron's production in Europe was a myth. That actually happened, he played great against legit teams. Add Black with any improvement you get with DJW, and some decent minutes from Kipper, and we should be pretty good at the 4. If we get a 5th year big and play Finke at the 4 then we'll have crazy depth at that position. I don't know what to expect from Abrams but it's already a huge improvement having him suit up, just from a leadership standpoint. The combo of the 3 point guards is a significant improvement over what we currently have. No point in going over the 2 with JCL, Nunn, Jordan.. we're good there. That leaves us with Morgan, Finke, and whatever we get as a transfer. Morgan has shown flashes that he could be a decent guy from here on out, but he needs help at the 4 with defense and rebounding. At the very least, we know what we can expect there and although it's not our best position, it's not as bad as it could have been if MM didn't make the decent jump on offense.

That is a very, very deep team, but not elite by any means. Even with our issues this year, we weren't terribly far away from having good results. The improved production at the pg, help with rebounding, improved defense, and increase in athleticism could go a long way. Is it a top 4 team in the conference? That's a little silly to debate at this point, but if you can't see how this is a deeper team than what we've had in the past 4 years, then I don't think there's really anything you can do but wait and see. There's no way that their ceiling next year is a bubble team. IMO, that's their floor if they're healthy.

Agree with the bolded. IMO, a realistic expectation of that team, barring a season-ending injury or two, is a top half finish in the B1G and a 6-9 seed. Anything less than that would be a disappointment from the coaching staff. An 11 or 12 seed (bubble) or an 8th or worse finish in the B1G would be worthy of dismissal if everyone stays healthy*

*barring a Top 10-15 recruiting class in 2017.

 

[unimaroon]

Just ask Siri what 0 / 0 is. Seriously, ask her. It's pretty cute.

:thumb:

 

[Obelix]

I feel like people are acting as if Leron's production in Europe was a myth. That actually happened, he played great against legit teams.

From previous answer on the same subject... I'd take these stats and games with a grain of salt, especially given the lack of live coverage, but more importantly, the level of competition. The days when college teams competed with good club teams in Europe are long gone. International basketball has improved tremendously, and most good club teams will simply beat average college teams with ease.

With the exception of the NT of Netherlands, when we easily lost by 27 (Netherlands is low level basketball in Europe), the rest were local town teams with not much talent.

I think Leron has talent and potential, but he has to first prove he can be a consistent college player in real competition.

 

[Newman]

From previous answer on the same subject... I'd take these stats and games with a grain of salt, especially given the lack of live coverage, but more importantly, the level of competition. The days when college teams competed with good club teams in Europe are long gone. International basketball has improved tremendously, and most good club teams will simply beat average college teams with ease.

With the exception of the NT of Netherlands, when we easily lost by 27 (Netherlands is low level basketball in Europe), the rest were local town teams with not much talent.

I think Leron has talent and potential, but he has to first prove he can be a consistent college player in real competition.

Agreed but it's not like it's a huge assumption that people are making, there's actually some substance behind the reports of improvement. His rebounding numbers were strong and that usually translates well no matter the level.