Illinois Football Recruiting Thread

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#1,051      
I understand that this is about building a winning program. I not close to the situation and don't have the inside info you have. That said, color me skeptical when he professes the need to be closer to his daughter. That seems like a convenient ploy which bothers me as a father.

Personally, I think he feels he is better off at Miami, but it didn't work out. Despite his ability, they stopped using him. Given that he is trying to get to the NFL, he said, "if you don't want to play me, then I'd rather be home with my daughter" and I will transfer back toward home. If he didn't want to be closer to his daughter, he could have had his choice at schools (to some extent). He came, checked out Illinois and Mizzou. He chose Illinois. However, when the Miami coach got fired, he probably felt vindicated and wanted to see if it could work at Miami. I don't fault him for that. A year at Miami guarantees him a year in a P5 conference.

The thing about Estes is still a little fuzzy. Estes committed, which means something was communicated to someone. Who knows who or what was communicated. That is much less important than perceptions. The staff's apparent commitment to the players' word is warranted. A mis communication like this can easily derail a successful turnaround. I don't blame anyone. But if this turnaround is going to work, this has got to be handled.
 
#1,052      

Joel Goodson

respect my decision™
The thing about Estes is still a little fuzzy. Estes committed, which means something was communicated to someone. Who knows who or what was communicated. That is much less important than perceptions. The staff's apparent commitment to the players' word is warranted. A mis communication like this can easily derail a successful turnaround. I don't blame anyone. But if this turnaround is going to work, this has got to be handled.

Spot on, except for the "I don't blame anyone." Quite likely, a staff member told Estes he'll have a ride. Is it possible that Estes just made it up? Sure, but not likely. Doubtful we'll ever know the facts on this one. This mess up is decidedly no bueno. Can't torpedo our newly established tight bond with ESL.
 
#1,053      
Spot on, except for the "I don't blame anyone." Quite likely, a staff member told Estes he'll have a ride. Is it possible that Estes just made it up? Sure, but not likely. Doubtful we'll ever know the facts on this one. This mess up is decidedly no bueno. Can't torpedo our newly established tight bond with ESL.

If I were to guess, Estes didn't talk with anyone other than Jeff Thomas (and Thomas probably spoke with someone on staff about it). My concern was that it wasn't clear that Estes entered the transfer pool and that the coaches spoke to Minnesota about talking with Estes. It seemed like he committed without going into the transfer pool. So the whole thing seems a bit unclear.
 
#1,054      

FT35

Naperville
Personally, I think he feels he is better off at Miami, but it didn't work out. Despite his ability, they stopped using him. Given that he is trying to get to the NFL, he said, "if you don't want to play me, then I'd rather be home with my daughter" and I will transfer back toward home. If he didn't want to be closer to his daughter, he could have had his choice at schools (to some extent). He came, checked out Illinois and Mizzou. He chose Illinois. However, when the Miami coach got fired, he probably felt vindicated and wanted to see if it could work at Miami. I don't fault him for that. A year at Miami guarantees him a year in a P5 conference.

The thing about Estes is still a little fuzzy. Estes committed, which means something was communicated to someone. Who knows who or what was communicated. That is much less important than perceptions. The staff's apparent commitment to the players' word is warranted. A mis communication like this can easily derail a successful turnaround. I don't blame anyone. But if this turnaround is going to work, this has got to be handled.

The Estes aspect to this story is what bothers me the most. I'm not even close to an insider but under this staff there were at best communication gaffes in the recruitments of James Knight, Cordel Littlejohn, Kevyon Davis and Kerby Joseph. That's just off the top of my head.

The fact that Estes went as far as publicly committing to Illinois tells me that someone on the staff screwed up here.

The guys responsible for the issues with some of the above botched recruitments are gone (McGee and P. Williams). However, these are problems we should not still be seeing and makes the entire staff look bad. I'm guessing CP just got excited and wanted to tell JT anything that would get him on campus. However, we're supposed to have a professional staff here and I don't like the fact that they are playing games with these kids. We're long past the point where we should no longer be seeing issues like this.

I thought this story was over but it will be interesting to see if Lovie can clean this all up. I know he stepped in and said that Illinois would accept the commitment from James Knight a couple of years ago.
 
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#1,055      

FT35

Naperville
If he truly wants to be closer to his daughter, I bet he could find a Juco nearby if the waiver doesn’t go through. Its not like he won’t be able to get to the NFL if he drops down a level for what would be his sit out year at Illinois.

If being at Miami and on a team much better than Illinois is the priority, he should stay. Especially now that the situation has changed.

Whether he plays here, there, or Juco is irrelevent. The only thing keeping JT out of the draft next year is a football career ending injury. (Knock on wood that doesn’t happen) The guy is just too good.

The Estes thing just feels like a good “reason” to back out of Illinois without looking like a villain. He can say “they promised me this and didn’t deliver” and then our staff is left with the blame when, had Richt stayed, JT would transfer away regardless of Estes.

It’s all speculation and we only have one side like someone said. Let’s hope the best thing works out for all parties involved. (Including JT’s daughter who is far from her father right now)

There are no JUCOs anywhere close to East Saint Louis where he can play so that's a ridiculous suggestion. Where would he play? The College of Dupage? The Jayhawk Conference?

The real answer to this problem could have been an FCS school like SIU, Illinois State or Missouri State where he would be immediately eligible and closer to East Saint Louis. There are plenty of guys who get drafted from the FCS and all Jeff really needs is more film. I wonder why this option wasn't explored more by Jeff?
 
#1,056      
And what I am saying is, he is not going to sit out the year regardless. It has been reported that if he didn't get the waiver, he was just going to play down a level where he wouldn't be required to sit. He then would still go in the draft.

And it’s now obvious he’s strongly considering one of his non-waiver options to be staying at Miami.
 
#1,057      
The Estes aspect to this story is what bothers me the most. I'm not even close to an insider but under this staff there were at best communication gaffes in the recruitments of James Knight, Cordel Littlejohn, Kevyon Davis and Kerby Joseph. That's just off the top of my head.

The fact that Estes went as far as publicly committing to Illinois tells me that someone on the staff screwed up here.

The guys responsible for the issues with some of the above issues are gone (McGee and P. Williams). However, these are problems we should not still be seeing and makes the entire staff look bad. I'm guessing CP just got excited and wanted to tell JT anything that would get him on campus.

I thought this story was over but it will be interesting to see if Lovie can clean this all up. I know he stepped in and said that Illinois would accept the commitment from James Knight a couple of years ago.

I actually wonder if it was something less obtuse than someone intentionally saying yes to something they couldn't back up. I wonder if JT said something like, "if I come there, I want to room with rey estes." and someone on staff said, "we can make that work" not realizing he was asking something about someone that wasn't at Illinois.

It is hard to know what happened, but I am sure we can all imagine a different type of conversation, which leaves too much room for interpretation. In the end, this will hurt us if it doesn't get cleaned up.
 
#1,058      

FT35

Naperville
I actually wonder if it was something less obtuse than someone intentionally saying yes to something they couldn't back up. I wonder if JT said something like, "if I come there, I want to room with rey estes." and someone on staff said, "we can make that work" not realizing he was asking something about someone that wasn't at Illinois.

It is hard to know what happened, but I am sure we can all imagine a different type of conversation, which leaves too much room for interpretation. In the end, this will hurt us if it doesn't get cleaned up.

I'm guessing that CP was involved since he is the St. Louis area recruiter and he doesn't seem like the type to intentionally mislead kids. I really don't know though (obviously).

I think you are on the right track that he or someone else on the staff just got excited and started telling Jeff things that they thought Jeff would want to hear in order to get him on campus. I don't think there was malicious intent however I can see why JT would now have trust issues with the staff.

You're right that we'll never get the whole story but there's enough out there to at least piece together bits and pieces of what happened. I hate to say that this is another learning moment for this staff because they've been in place for three years now.
 
#1,060      

the national

the Front Range
I’m not ready to crucify the staff over this. We really don’t know what was said. When Miami hired Diaz, I figured it would be a dogfight to actually get him on campus. I think Miami is pulling out all the stops they can to keep him and that is no fault of our staff. He is a talent for sure and it’s awesome that our staff was even able to get him to consider us. If it was a simple as giving Estas a scholarship, I’m sure Lovie would do it. There is more to this thing than anyone can speculate right now. We’ll just have to wait.
 
#1,062      
He was so good at Miami, but then the coaches stopped playing him. Let that sink in for a minute. You get your playing time reduced or eliminated because someone else is better or you have attitude/commitment issues. Any time a player transfers it's because they want a new start, and rarely will you see the player blame himself.

He would have been the best WR here assuming he would be ready to contribute as part of the the team. If he goes back to the U best of luck and I hope it works out for him.
 
#1,063      
He was so good at Miami, but then the coaches stopped playing him. Let that sink in for a minute. You get your playing time reduced or eliminated because someone else is better or you have attitude/commitment issues. Any time a player transfers it's because they want a new start, and rarely will you see the player blame himself.

He would have been the best WR here assuming he would be ready to contribute as part of the the team. If he goes back to the U best of luck and I hope it works out for him.

Or the coach let his ego get in the way and he stopped throwing to his best playmaker. Either way, the coach was clearly overmatched and lost his job.
 
#1,064      
I understand that this is about building a winning program. I not close to the situation and don't have the inside info you have. That said, color me skeptical when he professes the need to be closer to his daughter. That seems like a convenient ploy which bothers me as a father.
I’m just saying every top program takes kids that aren’t the greatest students or even people for that matter and the school understands that they are only going to be there for a year and they are OK with it. As for Thomas wanting to be closer to his daughter I’m sure he does but he comes from nothing and his ultimate goal is to get to the nfl after this next season so he can get some sort of money for his daughter/family.
 
#1,065      
This is unlikely to be a shared or popular opinion but with the transfers we’ve already added and the targets that I believe are realistic recruits in 2020, I’m happy with where we are at the offensive skill positions currently. Losing Thomas will sting but it won’t last but a short time. If for some reason FSU sways Shammond Cooper, that hurt would be long lasting.
 
#1,066      

Hoppy2105

Little Rock, Arkansas
There are no JUCOs anywhere close to East Saint Louis where he can play so that's a ridiculous suggestion. Where would he play? The College of Dupage? The Jayhawk Conference?

The real answer to this problem could have been an FCS school like SIU, Illinois State or Missouri State where he would be immediately eligible and closer to East Saint Louis. There are plenty of guys who get drafted from the FCS and all Jeff really needs is more film. I wonder why this option wasn't explored more by Jeff?

Tone it down a notch. I left out FCS schools but basically all I was saying was there are options for him to play if he goes down a level. If there are FCS schools much closer than Jucos he could go there.
 
#1,067      

Joel Goodson

respect my decision™
I’m just saying every top program takes kids that aren’t the greatest students or even people for that matter and the school understands that they are only going to be there for a year and they are OK with it. As for Thomas wanting to be closer to his daughter I’m sure he does but he comes from nothing and his ultimate goal is to get to the nfl after this next season so he can get some sort of money for his daughter/family.

Yep. #1-1000 with Thomas is get to the league ASAP. Everything else doesn't much matter. FWLIW, am perfectly fine w/his reasoning.
 
#1,069      
Would love to have Thomas next year, but Illinois added Ford (who hopefully will be eligible), have Corbin returning, a transfer WR from Oklahoma (hopefully contributes) and Williams. So, i'm optimistic about the offensive side of the ball.
 
#1,070      

ChiefGritty

Chicago, IL
Ford (who hopefully will be eligible)

Guys, we've all gone a bit crazy after the Mark Smith thing. Ford will not be eligible and Thomas very likely would not have either. There's actually a relatively low chance Thomas was going to ever play a snap for us, frankly.

We got kinda-sorta blackmailed into supporting Smith's waiver. Miami and Georgia have absolutely no reason to do the same, nor should they be pressured into doing so, frankly.
 
#1,071      
Guys, we've all gone a bit crazy after the Mark Smith thing. Ford will not be eligible and Thomas very likely would not have either. There's actually a relatively low chance Thomas was going to ever play a snap for us, frankly.

We got kinda-sorta blackmailed into supporting Smith's waiver. Miami and Georgia have absolutely no reason to do the same, nor should they be pressured into doing so, frankly.

I still am and have been from the beginning quite pessimistic as to the waiver eligibility odds of Ford and Thomas but I would be careful making definitive statements like “He will not be eligible” as this process is anything but clear cut.

And I’m still of the opinion that we’re in good shape at the offensive skill positions either way. As a whole, I think we’re at least one recruit light on the line (Jakai Clark’s situation was disheartening for me) but the offense overall is talented, well coached and holds a very bright outlook beyond 2019. The problem lies with the defense. We need to hold onto Shammond Cooper, desperately.
 
#1,072      

Ryllini

Lombard
I think JT wants to be in the league ASAP and the higher the pick the better for him and his family. I think we are making way more out of this miscommunication piece. He just may have legitimate concerns on learning a whole new system with some very green QBs getting him the ball. He stays at Miami, he is on the field this season and maybe getting his body ready for the combine this time next year.
 
#1,073      
Guys, we've all gone a bit crazy after the Mark Smith thing. Ford will not be eligible and Thomas very likely would not have either. There's actually a relatively low chance Thomas was going to ever play a snap for us, frankly.

We got kinda-sorta blackmailed into supporting Smith's waiver. Miami and Georgia have absolutely no reason to do the same, nor should they be pressured into doing so, frankly.

I'm don't think we can know either way, especially with the NCAA. According to the NCAA they approve about 60% of the waivers and the biggest issue is the mental health of the student.

Schnase said the most common issue regarding the waivers is the mental health of the student. In some cases, the waiver request is made citing the need to escape toxic behavior from within the previous program. In some, the athlete is “run off” by the prior coach, made to feel unwelcome or unnecessary to the team. A family illness is another possible issue, if the student “either needs to go home to be with that person as his or her life comes to an end, or maybe as a primary caregiver,” Schnase said.

http://www.sportingnews.com/us/ncaa...coaches-its-a-farce/306x12duyq9w1km8k5mcy1xdq

Each Ford and Thomas have a case. Will they get them? Time will tell
 
#1,074      
I think JT wants to be in the league ASAP and the higher the pick the better for him and his family. I think we are making way more out of this miscommunication piece. He just may have legitimate concerns on learning a whole new system with some very green QBs getting him the ball. He stays at Miami, he is on the field this season and maybe getting his body ready for the combine this time next year.
I hope he has a rational voice in his circle if these are his concerns given all that is going on at Miami right now. They just hired Dan Enos to run the offense, so the system will be new for JT no matter what. And based on what I saw out of N'Kosi Perry this year at QB for the U, you could probably make the argument there are more talented arms in the Illinois locker room... especially given a potential grad transfer. If he wants to showcase his talents for one more season, I'm not sure going back to Miami is even his best option.
 
#1,075      

mhuml32

Cincinnati, OH
If he truly wants to be closer to his daughter, I bet he could find a Juco nearby if the waiver doesn’t go through. Its not like he won’t be able to get to the NFL if he drops down a level for what would be his sit out year at Illinois.

He's already exhausted two years of eligibility. Playing at a junior college is not a possibility. Or am I missing something obvious?
 
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