Illinois Football Recruiting Thread

Status
Not open for further replies.

Deleted member 631370

D
Guest
I'm sure there is a chance we can flip him...but I'm far from buying that we win 6 games and he flips.

Agree. This is becoming an assertion that, if repeated enough, becomes taken as fact.

Is there validity to the notion that recruits like Mookie want to see how we progress, and might be open to flipping if we have a strong year? Sure. Is there some 5-win or 6-win threshold that suddenly triggers a flip? I'd be stunned if that's the case.

Beat the three crappy OOC teams early, and then score some wins over Rutgers and maybe NW. That's 5 wins, and probably a reasonable expectation for this team. But that's a pretty underwhelming resume, and you don't see kids leaving national title contender programs for 5-win teams beating the likes of EMU, UConn, and Rutgers.

I don't buy it. But then, I'm no insider. So I guess we'll see.
 
Just North of the Southern border!
Nothing wrong with being optimistic. I certainly hope you're right.

But take a look at the WR/TE corps at Ohio State, Penn State, and Michigan. We're not even close, talent-wise. Even with Luke Ford and the USC transfer. Those schools literally have 4* WRs on their 3-deep.......particularly Ohio State and Penn State. And they have WRs putting up big numbers and actually living up to their rankings.

The two USC transfers are our only 4* WRs (per 247 composite), and neither of them have done anything yet.

There's reason for optimism, but we have nobody in the WR room with Mookie's talent. The problem is, the big boys have plenty of Mookies on their roster.
At UoI optimize is 5*.

And it is 5 deep.
 
Is there validity to the notion that recruits like Mookie want to see how we progress, and might be open to flipping if we have a strong year? Sure. Is there some 5-win or 6-win threshold that suddenly triggers a flip? I'd be stunned if that's the case.
Consider the possibility that Mookie Cooper or someone in his camp told a member of the coaching staff that he really prefers Illinois to OSU, but he just doesn't have confidence in the Illinois situation, or that Lovie can keep the job long term, and this is what he has to do to make sure he's got a spot with OSU, and he's very open to flipping to Illinois if they show major progress on the field.

Consider that that communication absolutely 1000% happened in real life.

You tell me, would you believe that you're gonna get that player if you have a big turnaround? Or would you think the player is letting you down easy, so to speak?

A coaching staff that is secure in their position and thinking 3 years ahead is going to have a fundamentally different viewpoint on a question like that from one that desperately needs a miracle right stinking now. That's the reality distortion field.
 
I bet mookie had the conversation with Patterson. And the coaching staff, I’m sure isn’t waiting. And, if mookie wants a spot, they will make room.
 
Little Rock, Arkansas
Consider the possibility that Mookie Cooper or someone in his camp told a member of the coaching staff that he really prefers Illinois to OSU, but he just doesn't have confidence in the Illinois situation, or that Lovie can keep the job long term, and this is what he has to do to make sure he's got a spot with OSU, and he's very open to flipping to Illinois if they show major progress on the field.

Consider that that communication absolutely 1000% happened in real life.

You tell me, would you believe that you're gonna get that player if you have a big turnaround? Or would you think the player is letting you down easy, so to speak?

A coaching staff that is secure in their position and thinking 3 years ahead is going to have a fundamentally different viewpoint on a question like that from one that desperately needs a miracle right stinking now. That's the reality distortion field.
I feel like both of those coaching staffs would want Mookie and completely go along with this “plan” even if it never comes to fruition.

Now if you mean that the 3-years-ahead staff would say something like “cool, we will see where this goes but I’m not holding my breath” and the miracle-now staff would say “pleaseohpleaseohplease let this happen” then yeah, I agree there would be a difference in response.

Lovie knows he needs to win this year...but I feel like he will never sell long term benefits to receive short term gain. Even as his ship sinks he will be thinking 2-3 years out. It’s just the vibe I get from the guy.
 
Feel like a broken record saying this but we have a lot more to sell recruits if we Win. Look how Purdue and NW's doing with their recent success. In my unbiased opinion we have a hell of a lot more to sell than other programs with Lovie at helm if we get it done this yr
 
Lovie knows he needs to win this year...but I feel like he will never sell long term benefits to receive short term gain. Even as his ship sinks he will be thinking 2-3 years out. It’s just the vibe I get from the guy.
I think you are right. Lovie just naturally takes a long term view and he won't get anxious or change his spots.
Heck, why should he? He has plenty of money and even more importantly, he knows who he is and he's true to it.
I have my problems with Lovie, but this is absolutely not one of them.
 
I bet mookie had the conversation with Patterson. And the coaching staff, I’m sure isn’t waiting. And, if mookie wants a spot, they will make room.
I believe Corey's tweet the other day that I posted was in response to his conversation with Mookie. "it really isn't that hard FOE" or something like that. I didn't get the vibe that Corey was confident in a flip. It is what it is.

Just win baby
 
Likes: Fr8trn16
Who is this lathan ransom kid?? Ayo tweeted to him "you know the move come join Us... looks like a two way player . His commitment will be on the 16th
 
I believe Corey's tweet the other day that I posted was in response to his conversation with Mookie. "it really isn't that hard FOE" or something like that. I didn't get the vibe that Corey was confident in a flip. It is what it is.

Just win baby
I'm also not confident we get Mookie to flip. It is what it is at this point and he's a Buckeye.

But the bolded is all that matters now for the 2020 class. As has been discussed, summer recruiting has been a major flop. The staff already had a ton of pressure to perform on the field this season. Now, with the lack of recruiting success, that has increased exponentially. It's crazy how my view has changed regarding our major revenue programs in the span of a few months. I had football "ahead" for this year, but now, not so much.
 
But the bolded is all that matters now for the 2020 class.
The trouble is, the first date on which we can win a game that means anything is Sept 21. The first date on which we can gain bowl eligibility is Oct 12. And the games that are the likeliest to define our season, to provide the "it's working, Lovie's here to stay, Illinois is back" spark are even later than that. And signing day is December 19. We have three players.

We're in a tight spot here. But the question that overrides every other consideration is whether we're going to move forward with Lovie, and that is a product on the field question at the end of the day. It would be nice to just add some bodies to this class to give us a bit more flexibility one way or another come November, but we have bigger fish to fry.
 
I'm also not confident we get Mookie to flip. It is what it is at this point and he's a Buckeye.

But the bolded is all that matters now for the 2020 class. As has been discussed, summer recruiting has been a major flop. The staff already had a ton of pressure to perform on the field this season. Now, with the lack of recruiting success, that has increased exponentially. It's crazy how my view has changed regarding our major revenue programs in the span of a few months. I had football "ahead" for this year, but now, not so much.
Well he is tweeting at other recruits to "join us" with a buckeye symbol. For my own personal health, that ship has sailed in my eyes
 
Paris Campbell from Ohio State was drafted in the second round 59th pick overall. He played the position Mookie will play. There isn't a conspiracy theory. Mookie is interested in going to the NFL as soon as he can get there. There isn't much to discuss. 2 wins, 5 wins or 10 wins are irrelevant. Can he become the 59th pick or better going to Illinois? That is the question this staff has to answer with confidence before signing day.
 
.4 percent is still in it kids
Virginia
The trouble is, the first date on which we can win a game that means anything is Sept 21. The first date on which we can gain bowl eligibility is Oct 12. And the games that are the likeliest to define our season, to provide the "it's working, Lovie's here to stay, Illinois is back" spark are even later than that. And signing day is December 19. We have three players.

We're in a tight spot here. But the question that overrides every other consideration is whether we're going to move forward with Lovie, and that is a product on the field question at the end of the day. It would be nice to just add some bodies to this class to give us a bit more flexibility one way or another come November, but we have bigger fish to fry.
We play both Nebraska and Michigan by Oct 12 - beat both of those team and I would guess (unless total meltdown) Lovie is in an ok spot.
 
Likes: Fr8trn16
We play both Nebraska and Michigan by Oct 12 - beat both of those team and I would guess (unless total meltdown) Lovie is in an ok spot.
I think Gritty was alluding to Purdue, Rutgers, and Northwestern, as they've been more on our level. If we beat Nebby and scUM, we're going bowling. If we don't bowl after winning those games, Lovie should be fired on November 30th.
 
Little Rock, Arkansas
*adds more transfers to a class already so big it's self-imposing scholarship losses two years from now*
So would you have turned them down? I know getting on this grad transfer train isn’t exactly what we want, but sometimes you take pie while pie is passing.

Luckily, most of these guys are 2 year transfers and not 1 year stop gaps.
 
Likes: Fr8trn16
.4 percent is still in it kids
Virginia
I think Gritty was alluding to Purdue, Rutgers, and Northwestern, as they've been more on our level. If we beat Nebby and scUM, we're going bowling. If we don't bowl after winning those games, Lovie should be fired on November 30th.
My alternative view was that we may not have the win totals yet - more that if we beat 'major' opponents like those two - it's pretty key in keeping him around unless we lose out. e.g. win those two and losses to Rutgers and Northwestern while concerning, would not necc. be tragic to Lovie's prospects. Kinda like beating MSU and Maryland in BBall. We could lose early based on newcomers learning the system and then start to meld after the first three games.
 
So would you have turned them down? I know getting on this grad transfer train isn’t exactly what we want, but sometimes you take pie while pie is passing.

Luckily, most of these guys are 2 year transfers and not 1 year stop gaps.
Two year transfers are great in theory, the trouble is just that our junior class already exceeds the 25 player limit for adding new players. I think it's only at like 28, which is far from the end of the world, but those are moves that reward 2019 at the expense of 2021, just inherently.

Hot seat coaches are a principal/agent problem, there's no way around it. I don't think Lovie has managed the roster selfishly or irresponsibly, far from it, but his incentives and the incentives of the program vis a vis recruiting are divergent right now. Lovie needs two Dondi Kirby's, the program needs eight Teddy Karras'
 
Likes: thunderwear
Status
Not open for further replies.