Obviously impossible to tell because we haven’t seen him play yet, but wonder if Hutch would have had any impact on this game. At the very least, would have provided more wing depth and maybe we wouldn’t have gotten gassed as easy.
Illinois Hoops Recruiting Thread (December 2020)
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Ubermensch
BOOM! Feed my ego.
The currently #5 ranked team was built after one missed recruit after another. BU and staff were left scrambling just to fill roster spots. UI is going to be just fine. BU doesn't need our excuses. His track record speaks for itself. If someone can't see that, that's their issue, not BU's or anyone else's on the staff. If this group has shown us anything it's that they will find talent, even when it isn't there. I remember when some scrub without any game footage scored 35 points in a Big Ten game as a freshman. I remember when some kid from Cuba was questioned for having an offer. Now he's sorely missed. I remember myself being very skeptical about Alan Griffin. We sure could use him.
Recruiting misses have been devastating for previous staffs. Not this one. They'll figure it out. Part of this current staff's issue is they have actually secured too much talent. Kids know Curbelo & Miller have playing time locked up for the foreseeable future. They know Ayo & Kofi are not NBA locks. That's a problem for a lot of coaches, but UI isn't Kentucky or UCLA. So we have to prove it for a while longer. Kids want to play. You can view that as an excuse or you can accept it as reality. This staff got guys like Mark Smith, Ayo, Kofi, Miller & Curbelo to sign up when they didn't have a whole lot to sell. And when they missed on other guys they filled the roster up with good players. I think it's safe to say they know exactly what they're doing.
The missing piece right now to this team is EJ Liddell. In my opinion he was a must get for this program and we missed. Add him right now and we have very few weaknesses.
Downstate kid that checked literally every box in our greatest position of need and he goes to tOSU.
Downstate kid that checked literally every box in our greatest position of need and he goes to tOSU.
Disagree. Just look at Baylor. They have multiple proven transfers in their rotation. BU and team will still have options to put together an excellent recruiting class for next year assuming Ayo and Kofi are gone.
Agreed couldn't have said better myself.....see post #107.....great minds think alike.
I agree he would have been a great get that checked all the boxes for the Illini. Unfortunately, it seems Illinois didn’t check all his boxes. Which brings me to a serious question. We talk about misses and bad misses, but do recruits think that way? What I mean by that is was EJ thinking well if the Illini had done this or that differently (and not talking money), I would have gone there? From outside looking in it sure seems like we made him a priority and I’m sure we tried to sell him on playing time and home state school, etc., but all that evidently wasn’t enough. So do you think from his perspective, he thinks Illinois “missed” or does he think I just felt more comfortable at OSU or liked what they have to offer more? Not sure if that makes sense or not.
Yeah, but every recruitment is different. Lessons learned may not apply to the next guy. You are judging people - very young ones with other people who are influencing their decision. Some will be relatively honest with you, others won't. Some of the dishonest ones will be obvious, others won't. I would hate to have to make a living recruiting to a non-blueblood school.
... and so do logjam’s and Ubermensch’s.
Not sure what your point is. BU can't recruit. The sky is falling. We need a coaching change. What is your point? Do you have one or are you just venting?
This has previously been a topic of discussion - Obelix was making these same statements two years ago. Then we landed Kofi. Since then we have landed Miller and Curbelo and Hawkins (think he was a steal - based on what I saw last night, he has a bright future). If you are landing players in the 100-200 range, you can't afford to miss out any single year because a significant percentage are not going to be successes. If you are landing top 50 players, you need to land fewer. You can also be a very good team with a weak link in your rotation (Baylor wasn't particularly strong on the inside but they made it work with great guard play). Even if Ayo and Kofi leave and we get no additional recruits, we will have a very good team next year - we will be fine. But if we can add a key transfer or two....
It could be any umber of things that aren't necessarily quantifiable from an outsider's perspective. Maybe he just really clicked with the personalities on the OSU team and staff? He played against Ayo and Ace a few times. Maybe they had some bad blood? Familiarity can breed contempt just as easily as friendship, sometimes more readily. Maybe he wanted another shot at beating those guys, rather than joining them? Maybe he just thought OSU had a better squad, and a better chance at a deep run in March? I guess he is the only one who knows the actual answer. At any rate, it hardly matters now. I just hope we make him regret it on the court.
That’s what I’m getting at. If it is any of those things, what could BU and/or staff have done. I know it’s a “miss” because he didn’t sign, but really how much blame does BU deserve and how much is just really a recruit wanting something else and nothing he could have done really. Tough way to make a living.
And I just used EJ as example since someone posted about him, but it is applicable to any recruit the Illini have prioritized.
In most cases I don't think you can blame the staff for any one specific miss. There are probably exceptions where a specific mistake is identifiable, but that's rare. I think you have to read it on a more macro level - Is the staff hitting on at least some of their high priority targets? Are they filling positions of need? Do the guys the staff values in recruiting perform at, above, or below expectations once they're on the team? I don't think you can answer any of those questions based on one or two recruitments.
illini80
- Forgottonia
There have been comments about BU specifically, not the staff, not being as involved as he could be. Liddell commented very late in the process that he didn’t really know Underwood that well. I have no idea if that’s true with other recruits or not, but it’s still out there and I’ve heard it said. I’m sure they will uncover some guys and fill the class, but it would be nice to close on more top priority guys early.
Stars don’t matter in recruiting near as much as coaching and ability to develop. Don’t believe me? Go back and look at the top 100 from each year and write down how many had even mediocre NBA careers. Josh Jackson was the number 1 overall recruit in 2016 and couldn’t hack it in the league. Harry Giles was number 2 that year and is also reheated dog turds. You can run through the exercise on your own.
We don’t necessarily NEED a top ranked big guy. We’d almost actually be better served to find someone like Maverick Morgan, but that can develop much quicker.
We don’t necessarily NEED a top ranked big guy. We’d almost actually be better served to find someone like Maverick Morgan, but that can develop much quicker.
On that note, what’s the deal with a guy like Harold Yu? Plays on a good high school team (Sierra Canyon with Lebron James Jr) and is 7-3, 280 pounds (averaging what I’ve seen as 260 and 300). Sure he’s the number 205 player overall, but you can’t coach size like that.
We have that guy - Brandon Leib. He has skills, only needs weight and strength. I like his hustle, could be tough in a couple years.
Tacomallini
- Washington State
Motion to add “like a quicker developing Maverick Morgan” to the Loyalty canon of recruit comparisons.
Ubermensch
BOOM! Feed my ego.
We sure could use him to battle Purdue's huge guy. That would be fun to see.
GrayGhost77
- Centennial, CO
Seconded.
Think we may have mediocre covered with current roster with Jermaine, Brandon, BBV, Cole and Giorgi. Probably even solid. Just don’t know as we haven’t seen most of them but Giorgi is solid if we have a four that can defend and rebound and Hawk will cover that next year if not this. Don’t want anything but a stud in either a HS or transfer.
When it comes down to it, this, will always be the ultimate decider on if a coach is successful.
I don't know which came first, the chicken or the egg, but I do know that player development comes before long term success. if players regardless of how high or low they are ranked, don't develop into better players while in your program, you won't be a successful Power 5 coach
Haha, good one!!. Morgan is a terrible benchmark, he was a below average Big 10 center all 4 years and we never finished in the upper half of BIG during his tenure. We need to do much better.
But...he was pretty big.
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