Indiana 92, Illinois 74 POSTGAME

#76
This team needs a power forward badly who can rebound. I am wondering if this system wares players down by the end of the season.
We don't even really have a legit stretch 4, we have 3 point guards and 3 shooting guards + Giorgi for the most part. At times, Indiana was playing Davis, Morgan, and Justin Smith (at 6'7"? or whatever) at the 3...those are hard matchups for a bunch of guards. But all that said, leaving a cutter with wide open paths to the basket is what killed us, it wasn't even that they were lobbing over a guards head to a big man, we just flat out had nobody there.
 
#77
Yeah, that's a fact without background. Should consider it's one of the toughest schedules ever with one of the most inexperienced teams ever.
It could be that when one plays in the Big 10, mostly cupcakes in the pre-conference season is the way to go. Give us 5 more wins and we might be on the bubble, going into the Indiana and Penn State games and the BTT.
 
#78
I think getting some size will help quite a bit with the defense -- though not sure that would have even made a difference last night. But it has to be disheartening to be pressuring the ball and getting teams out of sync often times, but then they finally get a dump down where the other teams size makes it easy to score. AJ has done a great job all year, but he's just out manned and having to guard guys he shouldn't have to. And it hasn't helped that Kipper has done very little all season long. If Illini can get some explosiveness on the wing and another big beyond Kofi (hopefully that will be January or Higgs, but if not someone else), they will be back in the thick of things next year.
Every position we were out match. It wasn't just about size. Illini have been out sized in almost every game. They just haven't played well since the loss to Wisconsin. Bu said NW the d was great, they were not NW missed shots in the first and second half gave up almost 50 points. Same NW team that could barely score 40 in most bigten games. Just my opinion and what I've seen. Go Illini hope for better days
 
#79
Winged Warrior
It's a disheartening loss to be sure, but lost in all of this hyperbole is very, very few posters here saw more than 2 B1G wins. Not a single poster here saw Giorgi blossoming into a legitimate All B1G/ FOY candidate. Not a single poster here could have predicted Kipper falling off of a cliff in such a manner.

I'm very excited for what BU is doing to this program. If Kofi comes in and comes even close to what Giorgi accomplished this year, add that on top of Leron's success and suddenly we are a legitimate destination for those types of big men.

I'm 90+% sure Ayo returns next season. A full summer with AG and TJ learning the system. Giorgi will be better on the glass and D. Kane gets a full summer in the weight room.

There is more than enough reason for sincere optimism.

:hailtotheorange:
 
#80
I thought, and maybe I’m wrong, that if we learned nothing else from the Groce-era we were taught that “TNT” aka extraordinary effort isn’t enough on its own to consistently win games. Yet whenever we have lost this year, it’s been largely blamed on effort.

You can play hard, and guys should, every game. But this team needs to play smarter. And that means adjusting game plans to opponents strengths and weaknesses. Rob Phenisee is a 30% three point shooter. You don’t drape on him 30 feet from the basket all game and give him driving lanes. It was PSU all over again. And I’d bet you see the same thing this Sunday.
After watching that point guard for Indiana make all those crazy accurate passes under duress, I’d hate to think what sort of assist numbers he’d have had without being harassed by Illinois’ guards.
 
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#81
I missed the Norman Dale Fan Club so much during our run of success. Nice to see you guys back here.

It could be that when one plays in the Big 10, mostly cupcakes in the pre-conference season is the way to go. Give us 5 more wins and we might be on the bubble, going into the Indiana and Penn State games and the BTT.
I agree that taking on this schedule was probably a mistake, especially with a young team. But when you look at it, I'm not sure there's much more you could have done to soften it up. So many mandatory games were on the schedule -- the ACC/B1G Challenge, the Gavitt Games, Mizzou, and 20 conference games were a given. Maybe you pass up Maui, but do you really want to pass up Maui? The UNLV game was a return game set up a couple of years ago, and wound up being the third easiest game on the schedule.

That leaves you with four slots to play with. FAU wound up being a better team than expected, but they're still an easy draw that the team bungled. Next year will be much of the same, minus Maui but plus some other holiday tournament.

This is just kind of the deal as long as the B1G is an elite conference and as long as we play 20 conference games. It's why IU can bumble into the tournament with 17 wins. And it's why our record looks so much worse than it did when we had 16 league games, fewer made-for-TV events, and five more cupcakes to play.

Nothing's gonna change until we get more experienced, more talented, and more athletic.
 
#82
After watching that point guard for Indiana make all those crazy accurate passes under duress, I’d hate to think what sort of assist numbers he’d have had without being harassed by Illinois’ guards.

And to think we harassed Cassius Winston into 9 turnovers. Something doesn't equate.
 
#85
Ind
Don’t know much about basketball but that Indiana kid looked really good to me. How many minutes did he play? He never looked tired.
After watching the game over all Indiana did was ISO ball. They pretty much said are PG can beat your s. Pulled everyone away from him and let him go. Yes Illinois did some zone but for me not enough(hindsight) I know. I believe in this case probably should have stayed off and helped off him and make him make jump shots again (hindsight) by know means am I a coach and just a fan. Just felt blow by after blow by and lay up after lay up there was room to adjust. Rant done on to Penn State. Go Illini hoping for better days
 
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#86
Don’t know much about basketball but that Indiana kid looked really good to me. How many minutes did he play? He never looked tired.
Thanks to injuries, that Indiana kid played only seven B1G games this year. That might be why he never looked tired.
 
#87
Sycamore, Illinois
IMO unless the opposing big man can CONSISTENTLY hit the 3 pointer, there is absolutely no reason for whoever is guarding him to go out any further than the free thow line. Seems to open the lane for back door cuts that too often end up in dunks. Again, just my opinion.
There was one play where ADLR got switched onto a guard and ther seemed to be an opportunity for him to switch back. Either he didn’t recognize the opportunity or refused to and kept trying play perimeter defense. Ended up giving up a 3 I believe. Seems like this happened with Giorgi also where he ended having to defend a guard on the perimeter. So we are kind of putting ourselves in bad positions that way with the size we have being drawn out from the basket.
 
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#89
Phinisee and Green will vye as best backcourt in the B10 in coming years. They showed on Thursday they are currently better than our backcourt,,,,which is pretty good.

Surprisingly Langford wasnt a big factor.
 
#91
A positive - Allan Griffin has a motor & really plays with intensity. He is going to be a really valuab
Phinisee and Green will vye as best backcourt in the B10 in coming years. They showed on Thursday they are currently better than our backcourt,,,,which is pretty good.

Surprisingly Langford wasnt a big factor.
Uhh no. Ask most IU fans and they are not big on Green. He’s been in the dog house and plenty. Phinisee is very good though. We had a bad showing but I’d still take our backcourt next year.
 
#92
Ever since the loss at Wisconsin this year this team has gone downhill. That was the last decent game we played. Giorgi shooting threes?? I can't believe Brad Underwood didn't rip his head off last night. Horrible effort from the players.
Ya, I don't know who's given Giorgi the green light but that needs to stop.
 
#93
So what is more likely.

We practiced too hard and had no legs left?

Boys partied too much and came out flat?

Some combination of Ghorghi‘s illness, Trent‘s injuries and Indiana exploiting matchups?

A combo of the above?
 
#95
the Front Range
I think we were just tired. We shot well, like very well! BUT our defense wasnt good and that indicates to me that we were tired. Plus Indiana seems to be on a bit of a roll.
 
#96
So what is more likely.

We practiced too hard and had no legs left?

Boys partied too much and came out flat?

Some combination of Ghorghi‘s illness, Trent‘s injuries and Indiana exploiting matchups?

A combo of the above?
Or they are just better than us at this point in time? The rest are excuses that are right up there with every Big Ten referee being against us and Steve Bardo ruining games for us because he's an alum that doesn't care for his Alma Mater.

(Sigh)
 
#97
More than enough reason for sincere pessimism too. AJ, Kipper, Frazier, and Damonte had a full summer to learn the system. I don't think any of those guys improved substantially from last year and Kipper is a lot worse. What makes you think the new guys this year are going to improve next year?
C’mon man. For one, I’d argue AJ has gotten better. He’s been more consistent across the board and improved his rebounding and defense. Frazier and Damonte may have not improved substantially, but they haven’t gotten worse and are still underclassman. Griffin has literally gotten better this year already. Tevian is learning to sit down on defense and has a ton of potential. Believe it or not, most freshman get better as they grow up.
 
#99
Winged Warrior
More than enough reason for sincere pessimism too. AJ, Kipper, Frazier, and Damonte had a full summer to learn the system. I don't think any of those guys improved substantially from last year and Kipper is a lot worse. What makes you think the new guys this year are going to improve next year?
I don't see any reason....yet...for any pessimism at all unless you are just looking for it. Trent's defense has improved dramatically. Damonte continues to be a guy that BU singles out for his intangibles each week. AJ absolutely improved substantially. It's obnoxious to suggest otherwise. I have no idea what you are watching or listening to, but if you are only going to point to stats and numbers with those guys you are doing it wrong. Kipper is a strange case and a huge outlier.

What makes me think the new guys this year are going to improve next year? Because everybody (sans Kipper) improved from last year. Especially in the second half of this season. It's pretty obvious actually.

Hell the difference in AG in this last 6 weeks alone is very obvious. The system is working. The kids have bought in. There are going to be bad nights and stretches of regression, but I have zero reason right now to anticipate anything but improvement.
 
I don't see any reason....yet...for any pessimism at all unless you are just looking for it. Trent's defense has improved dramatically. Damonte continues to be a guy that BU singles out for his intangibles each week. AJ absolutely improved substantially. It's obnoxious to suggest otherwise. I have no idea what you are watching or listening to, but if you are only going to point to stats and numbers with those guys you are doing it wrong. Kipper is a strange case and a huge outlier.

What makes me think the new guys this year are going to improve next year? Because everybody (sans Kipper) improved from last year. Especially in the second half of this season. It's pretty obvious actually.

Hell the difference in AG in this last 6 weeks alone is very obvious. The system is working. The kids have bought in. There are going to be bad nights and stretches of regression, but I have zero reason right now to anticipate anything but improvement.
It can't get any worse lol. But I do agree that there has been improvement in some areas say Trent and AJ. Kipper definitely has been a disappointment is it him or Underwood idk? Damonte is the same was a undersized quard who isn't overly athletic who for some reason doesn't shoot, but plays hard and is good on d. Ag biggest improvement is minutes he had moments early look at zags game. But fell into dog house for over sleeping and his lack of understanding the d and still can't hit wide open shots Per(Underwood). I believe the kids have bought into this system but losing has a big impact on kids, pp can say they are tired legs but it's written all over there face and body that it has taken it's toll. Does this system work year two and I still don't know which is y I'd have to question it. I'll still be rooting tomorrow and beyond but next year definitely have to see a big jump in the w/l columns. Just my to cents. Go Illini