Michigan State 76, Illinois 56 POSTGAME

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Giorgi is actually playing to his high school recruiting evaluation. Which really wasn't very good. From what I can remember he only averaged 8pts per game while playing the 4.
We quickly realized he had pretty good foot work and was able out maneuver most opponents in the low post. We had no one else to play the 5 so he got the opportunity to shine. He did! And most importantly we put the ball in his hands where he could succeed.
Unfortunately playing around the perimeter and shooting 3's is not his game. In fact he probably is not P-5 player right now if that's where Underwood continues to play him.

Is Giorgi a better fit to start over Kofi at the 5? I think so.
Then who starts at the 4? Kipper? I'm fine with that as long as Underwood stays off his A@@ and let's him do what he's capable of.
Not sure if Underwood could ever do that.
I still believe that Kipper could put up similar numbers that Black had his last year here.
Wow...what do you see or know about Kipper that I don't. For the last year and a half, he has not been a positive player.
 
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create some turnovers

Well stated post (y) that lineup may produce some offense. Funny thing is we were supposed to turn people over and you would think some pressure defense against sub par teams may work (MSU debatable as far as guards go outside of Winston), but we simply don't?
 
Multiple full games where we haven’t run one possession of spread, and that is with the stuff we do run not really slicing teams up. It’s gotten Underwood this far and to just scrap it like that I don’t get it.
This and no pressure defense all year is what baffles me. You’re basically talking about the team’s identity the last two years and then just scrap it? Makes no sense to me. I understand that Kofi changes some things, but BU needed to find a way to make some needed adjustments to take him into consideration and not scrap the whole thing.

That and forcing the Kofi and Giorgi experiment are BU’s biggest coaching fails this year — or maybe they are the same thing. Just because Giorgi had played a lot of 4 in high school did not mean he was going to be able to do it successfully at the major college level. And to my eyes this year hasn’t shown he can either. They’re both averaging about 25 minutes a game, so why can’t that be done with splitting the two of them up and only 5 minutes of overlap. TJ’s suspension and some injury issues for Dr. Donk might have made it difficult to split the two bigs up, but outside of some assists for Giorgi the twin tower look hasn’t been very successful.
I’m disappointed with things so far but outside of a total collapse I think BU is back next year. I just hope he figures out what the problem is so he can repair it to at worst get the team ready for success next year — and preferably get them playing much better this year.
 
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Absolutely. gutless effort.! Down by 6 at half lose by 20. I'm going to call it as i saw it. These guys choked! What makes a player choke? FEAR! Nobody had the guts to make a shot! I will say Griffin played hard.

I am not sure we choked.
Tillman and Bingham shut down and dominated Kofi and Giorgi (11 points/5 of 22 ) - they are just better players at this point in time
I do not think many teams are going to be able to do this
Whether the extremely poor shooting is a result of "choking" is certainly open question.
 
We don’t normally shoot this bad from 3.
Shooting and lack of feeding our bigs seems to be a problem.
Our guards getting beat off the dribble forcing others to help out seems to hurt us a ton.
Ayo, Feliz and Trent can’t seem to figure out a rhythm.
Frustrating.
All correct, except the 3 point shooting. We do shoot this bad against good competition.
 
I didn't read this whole thread, so I apologize if i repeat or say anything that has been stated. I truly think AG needs to be in the starting lineup. He gives us the scoring/rebounding threat we need and can stretch the floor with his shooting. DW is a guy that comes off the bench IMO. I like what he brings to out there, I do, but I think his game is meant for a bench/role player. Yes, I understand it doesn't matter who starts, it's who plays more minutes and AG is getting much more now, but hes earned them. He just needs that confidence level from BU to fire without the fear of being pulled for one bad shot or pass. It's basketball, it happens. I also wasn't a fan of yesterday when Winston has 3 fouls and early in the 2nd half we have the ball in Ayo's hands and we didn't attack the basket. Next two times down the floor he (Winston) hits a runner and a 3. Could have been on the bench if we attack and possibly draw is 4th foul. Just something I saw that I thought we could discuss.
 
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We shot horribly on the road against a top 10 opponent. Shouldn't come as a surprise that we lost and looked bad doing it. Gotta find a couple of guys who can knock down a perimeter shot with some consistency, don't know who those 2 are right now.
I'm not an XandO guy but BU needs to put in some hi-low sets for Kofi and Giorgi or just play one at a time.

Big one coming up at home.
 
331 out of 353 in division 1 three point shooting. Need shooters. Miller, if he makes it, is one. Hopefully, the stretch four can shoot and the transfers. DaMontes shot doesn't look bad but he misses a couple and crawls into his shell. Don't know what Trents issue is.
 
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I kind of disagree. I actually think we need to play a different offense. How about this:

1. Frazier
2. Griffin
3. Ayo
5. GB
5. Cockburn

GB needs to be inside. Kofi needs to be inside. Figure out a way to play ‘em both inside. GB doesn’t have to play outside at the 4.

I just think we’d be better off playing two big guys inside, and it would make it quite a bit more difficult to defend.
Yeah he doesn’t have to go 4 out 1 in. He could play a motion with both bigs diving in time to time .
 
Iowa City
Why don’t we work on a pick and roll with Ayo/Feliz and Kofi/Giorgi? Would probably get more open 12-15 footers for the guards and might get the bigs rolling for dunks. Sparty seemed to kill us all night with it.
The opposing defense has taken that away. They don't extend on our shooters past the ark. The lanes are crowded and take away a lot of the drives. The pinch post isn't available because there are too many bodies in that area. This team needs to get going from 3 to make this thing work.
 
There is a reason Michigan State is one of the best teams in the country and leads the league at this time. It did not help us that we couldn't hit our shots.
 
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Part of the issue last night was that Kofi had no room to operate. GB's defender didn't even bother with him when he wasn't in the post. I think it is clear they don't fit well together on the court. Start AG for GB, and bring GB off the bench at the 5. Run a 4 around 1 to open up some space.
 
Illinois just legalized marijuana. I am thinking if this 3 point shooting keeps up..............


yoda.jpg
 
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The start of a 4 game win streak. This is a huge game and I think the players will play like it. We come out on fire and never look back.

UI - 77
Purdue - 61

I watched us lose in East Lansing, and I saw the most dejected team I've seen in a while. MSU covered the spread in the first 14 minutes, and the game was over with 10 minutes to go. The body language was terrible. No leadership, no cohesion, no buy-in. We looked like a kid that sat down for dinner and got a plate of broccoli set in front of them.

The scouting report against us is freaking obvious. We're one dimensional, i.e. we need Kofi. If you just look at stats, you could argue that Ayo is a threat, but he gets a chunk of garbage points, can't drive at a high level, and can't shoot at a high level. And as good as we are at rebounding, when it came to hustle and determination on the boards, MSU got the most "effort" rebounds. And MSU knew to go at Kofi, even as good as he is. He was bound to pick up some fouls, and now we're toast. Some of the line-ups we had out there were atrocious. And the ball went through Da'Monte WAY too many times. Izzo is no slouch, for all the hate he gets on this board.

Based on what I've seen, I see the opposite of a winning streak. And this isn't a tournament team. We're very good at pushing around mediocre teams, but don't do anywhere near enough of the little stuff that allows you to compete at a high level. As much as I want these guys to turn it on and play, the analyst in me thinks we're cooked. I think we'll be in every home game. But I think we'll be inconsistent, even at home. When we do have a good stretch, we don't handle success well.

This team needs a major change in attitude, buy-in, and effort to get to the dance. We're too one-dimensional to succeed in conference play without getting the offense right both mentally and effort-wise. If all we do is complain about missing 3s, and can't dial up the defense or probe for better 2p attempts, we won't see the post-season.

In fairness, MSU looked like a FF team. They made mistakes, but most of the time they made smart plays, and had us figured out. They knew when to push down on the pedal, and we rolled over. They're flawed IMO, and not as deep as you'd like, but this is a year where a team like MSU could actually go all the way.
 
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I'm also not a big fan of our dribble hand off offense. It doesn't work. Michigan State was literally showing before the hand off even occurred last night. No where to go and when we can't make a 3, does absolutely nothing IMO.
 
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The cuts in spread make you a threat (in theory) because if you catch the ball for a layup that’s 2 free points (in theory). You can run it to push kofi into a postup too after the first cut. You can still get a lot of looks you want, but I’m not even talking about running it most of the time. I’m talking about running it one time even just as a change up. Not running it at all at any point ever in multiple games is just what’s so strange when it’s what he’s known for.

edit: I’m not sure I’m saying this how I want to say it. I don’t disagree we’re playing 4 on 5 I’m just baffled by choosing to play 4 on 5 in a way that’s not the offense you’re known for and you’ve worked so hard to make part of your identity.

don't you think he gave up running it because the cutters don't actually cut and never look for the ball and no one (besides Jones last night and periodically Damonte) ever looks to hit them? We can't pass, which is almost as bad as "we can't shoot" but given the choice, i'd take shooting. anyway, our guys didn't seem capable of or willing to run his offense. So he gave up and now we're not actually running any offense.
 
Giorgi is actually playing to his high school recruiting evaluation. Which really wasn't very good. From what I can remember he only averaged 8pts per game while playing the 4.
We quickly realized he had pretty good foot work and was able out maneuver most opponents in the low post. We had no one else to play the 5 so he got the opportunity to shine. He did! And most importantly we put the ball in his hands where he could succeed.
Unfortunately playing around the perimeter and shooting 3's is not his game. In fact he probably is not P-5 player right now if that's where Underwood continues to play him.

Is Giorgi a better fit to start over Kofi at the 5? I think so.
Then who starts at the 4? Kipper? I'm fine with that as long as Underwood stays off his A@@ and let's him do what he's capable of.
Not sure if Underwood could ever do that.
I still believe that Kipper could put up similar numbers that Black had his last year here.
Did you watch any games last year? Giorgi was pushed around and gave up layup after layup. He cant gaurd big ten 5's at all.
 
Did you watch any games last year? Giorgi was pushed around and gave up layup after layup. He cant gaurd big ten 5's at all.
In fairness to GB, last year some of the time when the trap and deny defense did not work, he was left defending the basket alone playing 1 on 2 or 1 on 3 defense.
 
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There is such a thing as a double-post motion offense. If you have two players fairly good at the 5 position but poor perimeter shooters, what have you got to lose ? Of course, under such an offense you can't expect perimeter players to drive the lane, but how efficient has that been ? Moreover, such an offense presents a pretty novel offense and match-up problem for opponents. Why not give it a few possessions and see what happens and how opponents react ?

Just a thought.
 
Part of the issue last night was that Kofi had no room to operate. GB's defender didn't even bother with him when he wasn't in the post. I think it is clear they don't fit well together on the court. Start AG for GB, and bring GB off the bench at the 5. Run a 4 around 1 to open up some space.

Trent Lead Guard
Ayo Off Guard
Griffin Wing Guard/Slasher
Nichols PF (small)
Kofi Center

I know I know positionless my arse!

Off Bench-2nd tier if you will minutes.

Feliz Lead Guard
Trent Off Guard
Ayo Wing Slasher
Williams PF (really small-but rebounds well)
Giorgi Hybrid Center-PF

Play 8 deep and rotate evenly with exception of a hot hand going off...leave him in until at least 2 heat checks expire. Oh wait, okay by hot hand I mean better than 35% for the night...or maybe 15% nowadays?
 
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