OTL Report on Michigan State

#101      
It's very disheartening to watch the denial and blind support from a segment of fandom who are generally thought of as fair minded people that has taken place in recent years at Penn State, Florida State, Notre Dame and now MSU, and others, I suspect.

It's a given that there are those among the fandom of our beloved Illini that would most likely do the same thing. I sincerely hope they never have the opportunity to rear their ugly heads due to a situation that should have been handled much, much differently.
 
#104      
It's very disheartening to watch the denial and blind support from a segment of fandom who are generally thought of as fair minded people that has taken place in recent years at Penn State, Florida State, Notre Dame and now MSU, and others, I suspect.

It's a given that there are those among the fandom of our beloved Illini that would most likely do the same thing. I sincerely hope they never have the opportunity to rear their ugly heads due to a situation that should have been handled much, much differently.

See Nunn, Black and Tate situations.Illini fans were being more harsh than anything else. People wanted Tate kicked off the team at the start and he didn't even do anything. Lucas screws up and he's out for 3 games, and that's just for team rule violations, not criminal behavior.
 
#106      

illini80

Forgottonia
It will be interesting to see how long this goes. I believe it happens everywhere to different extents including here. Sad, but it's partly human nature. It certainly happens in the corporate world regularly. There will be a "new" thing to be outraged by eventually and this will die down, but it certainly has more momentum than I thought it would. If it does continue, no institution public or private will be unscathed.

Let's face it. There are a LOT of creeps out there. Men and women.
 
#107      
It’s time for Tom Izzo to stop deflecting and start talking

I exchanged text messages with Izzo on Monday because I was selfishly hoping for something — anything — that might give me more clarity.

Izzo declined to elaborate beyond what he’d already said to Thompson. He texted: “I’ve always appreciated our friendship, yet I understand you have a job to do. Someday I will be able to talk. I am sorry.”

I believe real friendship is the ability to tell a friend something she doesn’t necessarily want to hear. And Izzo’s response just isn’t good enough.

http://theundefeated.com/features/m...h-tom-izzo-stop-deflecting-and-start-talking/
 
#108      
See Nunn, Black and Tate situations.Illini fans were being more harsh than anything else. People wanted Tate kicked off the team at the start and he didn't even do anything. Lucas screws up and he's out for 3 games, and that's just for team rule violations, not criminal behavior.

I fully understand what you're saying and agree with it. However, if an Illini coach built a program that was respected and revered as Paterno once was, and Izzo is (so far) would there be more of a protectionist culture in place at U of I? I truly want to believe that there wouldn't. but reality being what it is I might well be disappointed.

I don't believe Izzo is in any danger............yet. And, I also believe the wagons will stay tightly circled for his protection until there is enough damning, irrefutable evidence as to force him out. However, at this point I will make a modest wager that Izzo survives this deal simply by being who he is but his legacy is obviously sullied to some extent, already.
 
#109      
I have no delusions about nothing scummy ever happening at Illinois, but considering Darius Paul was kicked off the team for various alcohol-related incidents, and Kendrick Nunn was kicked off the team for domestic battery, and the entire football program was nuked from orbit due to Beckman’s misconduct, plus Mike Thomas getting the boot for all of the above plus the issues with softball and women’s basketball, I would guess Illinois hasn’t had the degree of institutional scum that MSU has.

Our players and coaches have certainly done bad things. It doesn’t look like Illinois covers it up.

It creates a real problem of the uneven playing field. Every college sports fan knows it’s there, even if they can’t articulate why it’s there. Certain schools and programs will always be better than others because they get to play by a different set of rules. John Groce would probably still be here if the institution would have just covered up what Paul and Nunn did.

Not saying Illinois has covered things up in any way but the examples you give are of players who were arrested, at least the 2 basketball players were. Once the police get involved with arrests there is no cover up. It's when victims report incidents to only the University and how it's handled afterwards that the real issues start.
 
#110      
Not saying Illinois has covered things up in any way but the examples you give are of players who were arrested, at least the 2 basketball players were. Once the police get involved with arrests there is no cover up. It's when victims report incidents to only the University and how it's handled afterwards that the real issues start.

I often wondered....if a student reported an incident to the proper University officials...coaches, AD, Dept. Chair...etc, and nothing became of it....why haven't more students(an their parents) then gone to the police with their complaint??? Just because the school has done nothing...doesn't mean the police would ignore the report
 
#111      
I often wondered....if a student reported an incident to the proper University officials...coaches, AD, Dept. Chair...etc, and nothing became of it....why haven't more students(an their parents) then gone to the police with their complaint??? Just because the school has done nothing...doesn't mean the police would ignore the report

You would think they would have gone to the police but just look at what we are now finding out about MSU. If it weren't for Nassar finally being arrested and prosecuted we wouldn't know anything about what it seems MSU has been covering up. While watching OTL Report on MSU and the girl is talking about being assaulted (punched twice in the face) by Walton. She went to the police. They dropped it down to littering. Seriously, an assault charge dropped down to littering. I would love to hear from the prosecutors office on how that happened. Anyways, even when the police drop the ball the University should still stand up for the victims and do what's right. Kick them out of the University. And until everyone does what's right for the victims they will continue to not report crimes. Why go through everything and accuse a high profile person if nothing is going to be done about it. That's just victimizing them again.
 
#112      
The prosecutor was quoted as saying he decided to drop the charges after reviewing witness statements provided by the defense counsel. Put another way, other people in the bar told stories that contradicted the story told by the alleged victim. Put yet another way, he dropped the charges because he did not think he could prove them.

Walton was later charged with a far more serious offense. With the benefit of hindsight, would that prosecutor have handled the earlier case differently? I don't know.

Do you believe that? She said she was at the bar with friends and she went to the hospital afterwards on 2 separate occasions and in addition to bruises and scrapes she had a concussion. And here is what is in a police report.

"An East Lansing Police Department report includes statements from two witnesses who confirmed Thompson's account."

And then you have the bouncers who were at the bar throw Walton out.

I guarantee if this went to court and a jury he would have been found guilty. And if a prosecutor doesn't think he can or even want to try to win a case like this he probably needs to seek other employment.

And if there was nothing to charge him with why did they charge him with littering? It says that was a separate issue but that just doesn't sound right to me. Did the people at the bar say they didn't see him punch anyone but they did see him drop a bubble gum wrapper that night?

Wonder who his lawyer was? Think the lawyer was supplied by the University?
 
#113      
You can guarantee that without knowing about any of the conflicting witness statements? I am guessing you have never prosecuted a criminal case. You cannot "guarantee" anything.

I am betting the prosecutor knew more about the case than you did. He did this for a living. You do it on the internet.

You're right, guarantee was too strong of a word, but from what I've read this should have gone to trial and I would bet he would have been found guilty.

But go back to why the prosecutor decided not to press charges against him.

David Meyers, the former assistant city attorney who handled Thompson's case, told Outside the Lines he agreed to a plea deal with Walton after his defense attorney provided witness statements that contradicted Thompson's version of events.

So Walton's attorney says he has some witnesses that contradict the victims statements. Well her friends, the bouncers, who kicked Walton out of the club while she was unconscious, and the police report supported her statement along with the 2 hospital visits and her concussion. So is that how you get off now? Just have your lawyer get some statements that differ from what the victim says and they'll just drop the case?
 
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#114      

Shane Walsh

aka "Captain Oblivious"
Cynthiana, Kentucky
Deadspin coming through again. Here is what happened when one case was reported to the police.

"The first time Larry Nassar was reported to law enforcement—when Brianne Randall-Gay filed a complaint with the Meridian township police department in 2004—the case never made it to the prosecutor. In a newly released police report, it’s easy to see why."

https://deadspin.com/sergeant-in-ch...source=deadspin_twitter&utm_medium=socialflow
 
#115      

Illwinsagain

Cary, IL
Deadspin coming through again. Here is what happened when one case was reported to the police.

"The first time Larry Nassar was reported to law enforcement—when Brianne Randall-Gay filed a complaint with the Meridian township police department in 2004—the case never made it to the prosecutor. In a newly released police report, it’s easy to see why."

https://deadspin.com/sergeant-in-ch...source=deadspin_twitter&utm_medium=socialflow


That is appalling!
 
#116      

KBLEE

Montgomery, IL
Father lunges at Larry Nassar in court before being restrained

The father of three daughters who were abused by Larry Nassar tried to attack the former doctor in an Eaton County, Michigan, court Friday before he was tackled and detained by security.

Randall Margraves said he was a "distraught father" and cursed at Nassar, but Judge Janice Cunningham told him that was not allowed in court.

He then asked the judge for personal time alone with the "demon."

"I would ask you, as part of the sentencing, to grant me five minutes in a locked room with this demon," he asked.

"Would you give me one minute?"

The judge declined, saying, "That's not how our legal system works."

"Well, I'm going to have to," Margraves responded, and he launched into a sprint toward Nassar.
 
#117      

Tacomallini

Washington State
Izzo teary after close win at home vs. Purdue today, and mentions the "survivors" in postgame interview. I think he knows his days are numbered at this point, IMO.
 
#118      

pruman91

Paducah, Ky
Izzo teary after close win at home vs. Purdue today, and mentions the "survivors" in postgame interview. I think he knows his days are numbered at this point, IMO.

I haven't cared much for Izzo since his opinions on us letting BW go....plus , his whiney crying act on the sidelines got old a long time ago...
 
#119      
I think he wants this last deep run with this year's team and then he'll retire before he's made to retire.
 
#121      

illini80

Forgottonia
There is a lot being said without much proof of anything. If all these things are true I hope they come up with the corroborating evidence to make a case and then nail everyone involved. But this idea that because someone is accused of being complicit in any way makes them guilty, I find troubling. Again, I hope anyone who has done wrong is tarred, feathered, and burned.
 
#122      
Seems as though this story has gone awfully quiet...imho Izzo is acting and his mention of the survivors is not genuine
 
#123      
It's very disheartening to watch the denial and blind support from a segment of fandom who are generally thought of as fair minded people that has taken place in recent years at Penn State, Florida State, Notre Dame and now MSU, and others, I suspect.

It's a given that there are those among the fandom of our beloved Illini that would most likely do the same thing. I sincerely hope they never have the opportunity to rear their ugly heads due to a situation that should have been handled much, much differently.

I know people are going to rip me and call me a homer, but I see a lot of misconceptions posted around regarding the football and basketball programs, and if you really look at the facts of the cases and how certain cases have been handled in the past.

1.Payne/Appling. This case was well publicized back when it happened. It actually went to the county prosecution office and the district attorney declared no crime. I have posted snips from the article quoting this. In addition, they released the police report where Payne is questioned, and ESPN totally took what he said that they released in the news piece out of context.

In addition, people say they were covering for MSU. The district attorney was a U of M grad who had prosecuted MSU athletes in the past. Also, this incident happened before they ever played a game at MSU. To conclude, this same woman who wrote this latest news piece also was the same one who wrote an article saying MSU does not give preferential treatment to athletes with sex assault cases

2. Regarding Travis Walton, there have been conflicting accounts by witnesses on the first assault. One other thing that is misconstrued is Travis Walton was not a MSU employee. He was a volunteer under Izzo, which ESPN then painted that they were keeping records from them. No, he wasn't an employee of the university.

Given that the two players were deemed innocent, not sure why Izzo would suspend them. That would actually be saying I don't believe you anyway.


3. The football allegations are more absurd. They brought up an alleged gang rape where not even the parents knew about it until 7 years later they found her diary after she committed suicide. The players were gone from MSU at that point. That's not on MSU or Dantonio. Everything else detailed ranged from a shouting match between a couple to some alleged rapes where the victims did not even press charges.

4. Dantonio just last year kicked four of arguably most talented players at huge positions of need coming off a 3-9 season. I mean come on, if you are going to keep things under wraps, coming off a disastrous year with Michigan, OSU, and PSU all surging all the while you had a lot of additional attrition for other reasons.

5. The claims are all second hand accounts from a sexual assault counselor of 8 years who states she has no idea what they knew nor had even spoken a word to the coaches. Also, why was she not going to the police?

6. To piggy back off number 5, this same woman in 2015 spoke highly of msu sex assault program and accepted an award for it. If that doesn't destroy her credibility, what would? I attached that too.
 

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#125      

Illiini

In the land of the Nittany Lion