Transfers Thread

#101      

ChiefIllini

C
ChiefIllini
TEYPAY said:
not sure -- but can you limit graduate transfers?
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I question this and I also question the validity of reports that schools restrict players. Can't remember exact situations, but Howland got put on blast for limiting a guy the past few years. This got quickly resolved and the player was allowed to go whereever, but not before Miss St's reputation was tarnished. I think Occamm's razor in this case would be that school dont actually restrict players, its just media/fan buildup. Of course, there are probably instances, and I know it's a much bigger thing in football than basketball (I've heard kids actually getting denied releases in FB, never in BB), but then again maybe im a cynic and these universities do do intensive limitations consistently.

My vote is kids aren't normally restricted, but it probably does happen occasionally.
 
#102      

ILL in IA

ILL in IA
Iowa City
ILL in IA
ChiefIllini said:
I question this and I also question the validity of reports that schools restrict players. Can't remember exact situations, but Howland got put on blast for limiting a guy the past few years. This got quickly resolved and the player was allowed to go whereever, but not before Miss St's reputation was tarnished. I think Occamm's razor in this case would be that school dont actually restrict players, its just media/fan buildup. Of course, there are probably instances, and I know it's a much bigger thing in football than basketball (I've heard kids actually getting denied releases in FB, never in BB), but then again maybe im a cynic and these universities do do intensive limitations consistently.

My vote is kids aren't normally restricted, but it probably does happen occasionally.
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I think the national media is starting the push back on coaches restrictions on players. Bo Ryan got crushed on the blocks he put on Uthoff.
 
#103      

CoalCity

C
St Paul, MN
CoalCity
Peoria Illini said:
What about Bielfeldt? He went to Indiana from Michigan as a grad transfer, didn't he?

I think it's been done before.

I have no problem with Finke to PSU. I think he'd be better off at Vandy or Stanford, though.
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One thing notable about PSU is the toughness and athleticism that they play with. Is Michael Finke really a fit for that team?
 
#104      

jmilt7

J
Waukegan
jmilt7
Okay, it sounds as if you can block a transfer unless the press finds out about it?
 
#105      

Greensboro

Greensboro
Greensboro
Obelix said:
You can still block graduate transfers but coaches and programs are catching a lot of heat for doing so. Beilein tried to block Spike Albrecht from transferring to other B1G programs (although he had already recruited over him) but he was forced to remove such restrictions after receiving much criticism. Albrecht eventually transferred to Purdue.



https://www.freep.com/story/sports/.../michigan-basketball-transfer-rules/82508986/
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This + Biefeldt + Cam Johnson from Pitt are all recent examples that went awry for the school trying to block


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#107      

Deleted member 631370

D
Guest
Deleted member 631370
Peoria Illini said:
What about Bielfeldt? He went to Indiana from Michigan as a grad transfer, didn't he?

I think it's been done before.

I have no problem with Finke to PSU. I think he'd be better off at Vandy or Stanford, though.
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And the Dakich kid.

Not only did he transfer within the conference, but he went from Michigan to Ohio State.
 
#108      

Newman

N
Newman
Greensboro said:
This + Biefeldt + Cam Johnson from Pitt are all recent examples that went awry for the school trying to block


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Twitter pretty much took away a coaches ability to block schools. I'm not even exaggerating.
 
#109      

Ransom Stoddard

Ransom Stoddard
Ordained Dudeist Priest
Bloomington, IL
Ransom Stoddard
Newman said:
Twitter pretty much took away a coaches ability to block schools. I'm not even exaggerating.
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Which is fine with me. Coaches can jump for greener pastures with little to no consequence, but they want to dictate where a player can or cannot wind up?

The funny thing is that these coaches appear to have no compunction with the possibility of coaching against their former players if the coach is the one to move, but don't want to allow it if it is the player that leaves. Massive double standard, and I'm always happy to see a coach get roasted on the interwebs for it.
 
#110      

kaptain80

kaptain80
STL
kaptain80
Ransom Stoddard said:
Which is fine with me. Coaches can jump for greener pastures with little to no consequence, but they want to dictate where a player can or cannot wind up?

The funny thing is that these coaches appear to have no compunction with the possibility of coaching against their former players if the coach is the one to move, but don't want to allow it if it is the player that leaves. Massive double standard, and I'm always happy to see a coach get roasted on the interwebs for it.
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For me it's not the double standard of coaching-against vs. playing-against, it's more that the coaches will still get paid 6-7 digits annually to do it. Say what you will about the value of a college education for a player to stick around but that salary is cash in hand, not a hope for future cash.
 
#112      

jmilt7

J
Waukegan
jmilt7
Ransom Stoddard said:
Which is fine with me. Coaches can jump for greener pastures with little to no consequence, but they want to dictate where a player can or cannot wind up?

The funny thing is that these coaches appear to have no compunction with the possibility of coaching against their former players if the coach is the one to move, but don't want to allow it if it is the player that leaves. Massive double standard, and I'm always happy to see a coach get roasted on the interwebs for it.
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Just to play devil's advocate because I agree with you but isn't blocking not just for the coach's sake? Not that a coach necessarily takes fans opinions into account but how many people here wished Mark Smith the best unless he transferred to Missouri? Or just plain did not want him to transfer to Missouri. Heck, we have a whole thread detailing our angst on his transfer to Missouri. Although my guess is that most of Illini fandom wish him well, or don't care where he ended up. Just kind of throwing it out there.
 
#113      

Newman

N
Newman
jmilt7 said:
Just to play devil's advocate because I agree with you but isn't blocking not just for the coach's sake? Not that a coach necessarily takes fans opinions into account but how many people here wished Mark Smith the best unless he transferred to Missouri? Or just plain did not want him to transfer to Missouri. Heck, we have a whole thread detailing our angst on his transfer to Missouri. Although my guess is that most of Illini fandom wish him well, or don't care where he ended up. Just kind of throwing it out there.
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A coach should block a school because the fans might turn on the player.. Really?
 
#114      

jmilt7

J
Waukegan
jmilt7
Newman said:
A coach should block a school because the fans might turn on the player.. Really?
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Yeah, after I posted that I thought it sounded, well, to put best, ill advised. But like I said, I was just playing devil's advocate. Best to ignore it.
 
#115      

Newman

N
Newman
jmilt7 said:
Yeah, after I posted that I thought it sounded, well, to put best, ill advised. But like I said, I was just playing devil's advocate. Best to ignore it.
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I can certainly see why a school would want to block a conference opponent but I understand why coaches were getting criticism. I'm all for player freedom now but they need to have some rules so it doesn't become such a chaotic process. I'm just not sure what rules would work out in favor of players.
 
#116      

t7nich

t7nich
Central IL
t7nich
PtownIllini8 said:
Don't care where he went, he's a good kid, tried hard, no attitude, just don't care. I actually root for Mizzou when they aren't playing us. I want that win in the Braggin' Rights game to be a big win.
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:hurl:
 
#117      

haasi

haasi
New York
haasi
I think the only possible rationale for blocking a player is that he knows your system and could provide valuable intel to a regular opponent. But (a) probably not much info he can give that coaches can’t figure out from film and other publicly available stuff; (b) whatever other info he has probably has limited shelf life; and (c) the much greater interest is the interest of the player to live his life and go to school and play where he wants.


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#119      

HTime

H
HTime
It would be interesting to see how players that transfered from one P5 school to another Comparable school have performed over the last several years. What percentage excel or at least improve?
 
#121      

Peoria Illini

P
Peoria, IL
Peoria Illini
coryfor3 said:
He really would be wise to hitch his wagon to Bradley and Brian Wardle.
Although if Wojo loses that Marquette gig, Wardle might be gone...
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Agree. Wardle is doing a good job rebuilding the Bradley program. They have one of the Brummitt brothers from Decatur MacArthur coming this fall and just picked up a 6-6 JUCO wing that looks pretty athletic.

Is Wojo on the hot seat at Marquette? I would assume that would be Wardle's next move up the ladder.
 
#122      

Illiini

Illiini
In the land of the Nittany Lion
Illiini
haasi said:
I think the only possible rationale for blocking a player is that he knows your system and could provide valuable intel to a regular opponent. But (a) probably not much info he can give that coaches can’t figure out from film and other publicly available stuff; (b) whatever other info he has probably has limited shelf life; and (c) the much greater interest is the interest of the player to live his life and go to school and play where he wants.


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Even if the transferring player takes "intel" to the opposing team, it will be, as you say, will be two years old. HOWEVER, the coach who once had him on his team will know more about him--even with growth on the part of the transferring player--and how to neutralize him on the court. The transferee's value on the court isn't as great as it might be, even if he knows more about his teammates.

It's probably a wash.
 
#123      

haasi

haasi
New York
haasi
Illiini said:
Even if the transferring player takes "intel" to the opposing team, it will be, as you say, will be two years old. HOWEVER, the coach who once had him on his team will know more about him--even with growth on the part of the transferring player--and how to neutralize him on the court. The transferee's value on the court isn't as great as it might be, even if he knows more about his teammates.

It's probably a wash.
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IMO coach’s detailed knowledge of one player is much less significant than one player’s detailed knowledge of coach, personnel, system etc. but that’s not the ultimate point since we don’t disagree - all your point would do is strengthen the argument for players transferring freely- which I agree with.


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