Northwestern 73, Illinois 60 Postgame

[Goillinikobd]

Trent Frazier will always be special to me with what he endured and how hard he worked to become a great representative for the Fighting Illini......

5 years of petal to the metal trying to improve the team and also himself into a fine young adult man.......I hope he enjoys his days of being paid to play the sport he loves ......I really hope he comes back to UI after his playing days are over .....seems like a coach in waiting .................JMHO

100 %.

I also think Ayo will make a great coach post NBA

IDK, but maybe Trent, DMW, and Ayo should come to CU and have a closed door, players only meeting with the current team.

 

[OnlyOrange]

Scary thing is we're not really even close in these big ten games either.

Question will be whether we can beat Nebraska & Minnesota, but this year seems over.

 

[PasadenaIllini]

I agree with your assessment of coaching responsibilities. They have done this well with past teams. Are you saying that the coaches suddenly forgot how to or decided not to perform as required? Which side is most likely going to accept responsibility for their actions? Mature men or teenagers. I have a son who suddenly (and despite the love and direction my wife and I provided) stuck his head up his a** at 14 and didn't pull it out until he was 19. Now he's an stand up guy, a happily married father of 2 with a college degree and a successful professional career. There's no accounting for the teenage mind.

"Are you saying that the coaches suddenly forgot how to or decided not to perform as required?" I have absolutely no idea why things are playing out as they are. I don't attend practices. I'm not in the locker room. I'll repeat what I do know. Our coaches are being paid handsomely to prepare our team to play good defense and efficient offense and to recruit the players and decide who gets a scholarship. Our coaches control who plays and the schemes our team runs offensively and defensively. Our team has not showed up playing well/looking prepared to play either offense or defense. That's on our coaches. They need to perform better.

"Which side is most likely going to accept responsibility for their actions? Mature men or teenagers." I don't understand why this is relevant. Whether or not someone accepts responsibility has no bearing on whether or not that individual is responsible for a given state of affairs.

Unless you're in the locker room or attending practices, I have no idea how anyone can go beyond what is plainly evident. Our team isn't showing up prepared to play well. Our coaches need to do a better job getting them prepared to play well.

 

[IMPE ALL STAR]

Things I’ve read/heard today from I’m this board and elsewhere that I’m having a hard time reconciling:

1. Underwood “loves” what we are doing on defense?

2. Coleman needs to shoot more?

3. Our primary offensive plan is dependent on being able to beat your man one-on-one?

 

[IlliniKat91]

100 %.

I also think Ayo will make a great coach post NBA

IDK, but maybe Trent, DMW, and Ayo should come to CU and have a closed door, players only meeting with the current team.

This assumes TSJ, MM, and the freshmen give a damn what Ayo has to say. He doesn't mean anything to them in terms of a teammate or role model.

In fact, MM could just look at him and say, "I've won a natty. You never did." Hard to get buy in there

 

[HailtotheChief]

A lot of poor choices tonight but Hawkins really killed us with his turnovers. So many empty possessions. I love his heart but he’s playing way outside himself.

He was tied for the lead with 3 which was less turnovers than other games. However he took a few awful shots that were about as bad as a TO. While he often passed on clean looks. Hummel commented on his inconsistent decisions throughout the game.

 

[Birdus]

Things I’ve read/heard today from I’m this board and elsewhere that I’m having a hard time reconciling:

1. Underwood “loves” what we are doing on defense?

2. Coleman needs to shoot more?

3. Our primary offensive plan is dependent on being able to beat your man one-on-one?

We have no primary offensive plan. Hawkins is a turnover machine.

 

[Se Il Illini]

Watched the Penn- State - Michigan game
Penn State has 2 or 3 players without the ball constantly moving
We have 2 o 3 players constantly waiting
Maybe we will recapture the 3 point shooting which enabled the UCLA and Texas victories
But with each passing game that is looking less likely.

I have a similar point. There were a couple of times in the first half when Illinois had the ball on the right side of the court with 2 players on that side: both beyond the arc. At the same time there were 3 players on the opposite side of the court behind the 3 point line standing with their hands outstretched waiting for a skip pass. No movement. No one cutting to the basket. No picks away from the ball. No ball pick.

 

[IMPE ALL STAR]

I have a similar point. There were a couple of times in the first half when Illinois had the ball on the right side of the court with 2 players on that side: both beyond the arc. At the same time there were 3 players on the opposite side of the court behind the 3 point line standing with their hands outstretched waiting for a skip pass. No movement. No one cutting to the basket. No picks away from the ball. No ball pick.

Yeah we seem to ball screen a lot less than most teams.

 

[Baskins Tiger]

A couple of things. Worst Illini offensive performance in years. No movement, no driving to the rim, no pick and roll action. Five guys standing outside the 3-point line incapable of creating there own shot (MM excepted), lousy ball handling - looks like they are playing with a lopsided ball, total YMCA gym rats lack of coordination.

Defense is OK, but too many reaching fouls, no commitment to guarding with your feet.

Lastly, somebody needs to explain to me why the portal and NIL hurts our team, and not our opponents. Hmmm?

I believe it's the constant changing of gameplan, not transfers.
It's not an even comparison, but Coach Green from WBB had a meeting when she cam in with each player and told them, I have a specific defense and this style of offense, can you perform to the level I expect on both, the coach didn't feel most could and there was an and that's why so many left.
While waiting to fill the roster she realized with the few players that remained how poor the fundamentals were amongst the players. That's all the team worked on for months, and you see how that turned out.

Maybe Coach Underwood is trying to spend hundred dollar bills on a nickle problem. Go back to fundamental Basketball and keep it simple. The "scrub" teams that beat us, all as basic as could be.

 

[Ga65]

Seems like it all started going downhill when BU described their performance with a fart sound. It looks like he has lost this team. Toughness isn’t built by how loud you yell or how profane your language is. If he wants them to react like adults he needs to respect them. They don’t appear to be having fun anymore and they did in those early games.

 

[The Sprouting Divot]

Seems like it all started going downhill when BU described their performance with a fart sound. It looks like he has lost this team. Toughness isn’t built by how loud you yell or how profane your language is. If he wants them to react like adults he needs to respect them. They don’t appear to be having fun anymore and they did in those early games.

At minimum, it all started going downhill an hour or two before he made the fart noise.

 

[HailtotheChief]

Eh, Mayer’s made some shots but he’s also played more than his fair share of hero ball, had lazy passes/turnovers (had his lunch money taken twice by audige tonight just by not valuing the ball), tends to gamble and take plays off on defense.

Still think he’s an overall positive but he makes a lot of non winning plays on the court too.

Mayer had 2 TOs. However if the other guys played and shot like him we win these games. Mayer, Epps, Dain, and Harris are playing well. TSJ has had his moments. The rest of the guys need to get their heads on straight and play smarter and like they are capable of consistently.
Mayer is playing well, not perfect but well. Mayers stat line last night was solid once again. Also whenever he does go one on one it doesn't bother me because he hits more than his fair share when others do not. Harping on him is not fair when other returnees are struggling emensly compared to what he is doing to win.

 

[jason88cubs]

Seems like it all started going downhill when BU described their performance with a fart sound. It looks like he has lost this team. Toughness isn’t built by how loud you yell or how profane your language is. If he wants them to react like adults he needs to respect them. They don’t appear to be having fun anymore and they did in those early games.

It started going downhill when the Penn St game tipped off and no one showed up to play

 

[727ill]

Yeah we seem to ball screen a lot less than most teams.

Not ball screens, screens away from the ball are key. Watch the replay of the game and see how many off-ball screens Northwestern was running each time down the floor. It was really pretty to watch (granted I thought we defended it very well for the most part).

The thing those off-ball screens do is put pressure on a defense to grab and hold you (which our young guys did as expected). The on-ball screens don't do much for you when you don't have an Ayo-type player that can do X different things off the screen.

 

[RockfordIllini]

There were a couple of good things. I thought RJ looked good. Played hard. Cut well. Got on the floor. Coleman at times showed some assertiveness offensively. Jaden had some good buckets. We had about a 5-6 minute stretch to start the second half when we built our lead where we ran good offense.

The bad was just about everything else. We just can’t get out of our own way right now. With our length and athleticism we should be killing teams in turnover and free throw ratios. Somehow it’s reversed. We make bad/lazy passes that lead to transition layups and we foul. We play sound defense, but then someone gambles or loses their man which leads to scrambles and we foul. We chuck 3’s which lead to transition layups. It’s all interconnected and it’s like an anchor pulling us down.

Ultimately I think it comes down to focus, effort, and toughness to execute on offense and do your job on defense. 0 FTs and 0 offensive rebounds in the first half against Northwestern (!) screams lack of toughness and tells me they just didn’t play very hard. But I don’t know how you fix it. If you bench CH, Mayer etc for lackadaisical play you likely lose them. Will see if they can get up to play a ranked Wisconsin team on Saturday, but they are one of the best teams in the country at not beating themselves.

 

[john1952]

Seems like it all started going downhill when BU described their performance with a fart sound. It looks like he has lost this team. Toughness isn’t built by how loud you yell or how profane your language is. If he wants them to react like adults he needs to respect them. They don’t appear to be having fun anymore and they did in those early games.

I do not suspect it is much fun missing 20 three point shots and getting beat like a drum by a mediocre NW team

I do agree "getting in players faces" isn't working with this team, needs to be flexible, tone it down, and use a different approach

 

[BBIQ]

I think we're arguing semantics to some extent. He clearly said they were not executing sets and actions that they ran 100 times in practice once they were in the flow of the game. That's execution. That's on the players. His offense is not some random iso or random stepback three gibberish. There is supposed to be a methodical approach in there and it's not happening when they get on the floor. The fact that we're seeing that happen is, as he said, on him in terms of instilling discipline to the approach and grit to do something for somebody out there other than yourself.

Here is the quote "The lack of discipline, that's on me. I just don't have these guys doing anything that resembles basketball on the offensive end. Nothing." if that's "semantics" to you then so be it.

 

[IMPE ALL STAR]

Not ball screens, screens away from the ball are key. Watch the replay of the game and see how many off-ball screens Northwestern was running each time down the floor. It was really pretty to watch (granted I thought we defended it very well for the most part).

The thing those off-ball screens do is put pressure on a defense to grab and hold you (which our young guys did as expected). The on-ball screens don't do much for you when you don't have an Ayo-type player that can do X different things off the screen.

Few teams have a player as good as Ayo, yet they still screen for the ball handler at the top of the key.

Epps or Clark couldn’t function in this role? Seems better than having Coleman, TSJ, or Mayer do some dribbling and then chucking from there.

 

[ChiefGritty]

Few teams have a player as good as Ayo, yet they still screen for the ball handler at the top of the key.

Epps or Clark couldn’t function in this role? Seems better than having Coleman, TSJ, or Mayer do some dribbling and then chucking from there.

The biggest basketball reason this team is falling apart is that we are now living in that risk scenario everyone identified before the season where we have no point guard. It's just that Clark's knee has nothing to do with it.

Epps is a true freshman playing out of position and giving us more than we could have possibly expected, but floor generalship isn't his game, he's a slasher/scorer.

Clark is just lost and his defense limits how much he can be out there.

And then that leads Hawkins to be in too much of a playmaking role, which clearly screws with his head and makes us a worse rebounding team, and it all tumbles downhill from there.

We needed another PG. Never get caught short of PG's or C's. Roster construction mistake.

 

[Aldy1955]

LOL! There ain't none. What can they possibly do? Maybe Perine and Goode coming back? But, I am not hopeful at all.

I say time for new haircuts -new look.

 

[GoodePodzMelendez]

I feel Hawkins needs to go back being a role player--he's much better at it. I don't like MM's play--he's got a Jeckel and Hyde thing going on there. Might as well bench him. Melendez should only be a role player, too. I'm running out of options here. LOL. Play all the Freshmen, Goode (when healthy), DD and that French guy.

We did that in 99 and got the kids to buy in and it git us to the championship game. I am all for DD, Hawkins at the 4 and posting up. None of this running the show anymore, Rogers, Epps and Harris. Rogers should have had more tick last night. Mayer and Shannon need to understand team instead of showing off for the scouts. Work the ball and get a good look. Goode will be a great piece once he gets back. Brad changed too much and its showing.

 

[Big Jack]

Ok what I will.never understand with our offense is why we can't open the post up and post up our guards and Dain against their opponents. Our guys can constantly get backed down and scored on why not turn the tables. It also seems to me that we waste Rains ability down low by having him try and set horrible screens at the top of the key that fail.to.free up our guards or create a pic and roll for him.

This 5 out offense is not creating any opportunities presently, so how about we try the old double post hi lo game... We dribble way to much and create no space at all.

I think last night's game got skewed from the start with Harris getting into foul trouble but the rest was pure lack of execution and effort.

 

[EyeoftheIllini]

I think there is more than enough blame to go around among BU, staff and players — and to be honest I really don’t care who is to blame the most. Can they get it fixed is all I care about, and to do that will take changes by everyone. The other thing is I wonder who the players blame for this. Do the players who aren’t the issue or are “less” of the issue blame BU or do they blame the newcomers and supposed leaders for playing for themselves and not playing like every day guys? We know 2 players are gone due to eligibility and I can certainly see at least 1 if not 2 whose leaving would not surprise me at all. It’s the other players and how they assign blame that I care more about then who the board blames.

This has not been BU’s finest hour by a long shot, but there have never been these kinds of issues prior as far as I know. Can things turn around this year? I hope so but not feeling confident. But I think if he can maintain a good portion of roster then future isn’t dark. Just needs to do better due diligence when bringing in transfers.

 

[727ill]

Few teams have a player as good as Ayo, yet they still screen for the ball handler at the top of the key.

Epps or Clark couldn’t function in this role? Seems better than having Coleman, TSJ, or Mayer do some dribbling and then chucking from there.

That’s my point. Unless you have an elite on-ball pick and roll player you are better off getting open via off-ball screens.