I think the game will be determined by how many Rutgers folks are on the court vs our 5.
Pregame: Illinois at Rutgers, Saturday, December 2nd, 3:00pm CT, BTN
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sacraig
- The desert
For a few years, it was an NBA arena!
Good post. This was a really tough one for me as some of these teams just haven't been good in forever. But over the past 40 years, I'd probably separate them into tiers like this:
Most intimidating B10 home venue for national championship contenders:
Tier 1: Welcome to Hell
Illinois- The House of 'Paign is a house of horrors when Illinois is at their best. Loud, energetic, imposing, and one of the tougher places in the nation to play
Maryland- I remember when Maryland was a Champ contender. That place is loud, downright nasty, and intimidating as hell as when you hear that crowd you wonder whether you're walking out alive.
Indiana- The other assembly hall is an awful venue, but has a lot of history, the fans can get loud and look almost like a sea- they appear far more imposing than they are. Plus, you know going in that you're playing 5 on 8 all game. Indiana is all about making you realize you've lost before the game has even started.
Iowa- This may surprise the younger fans on here, but back when Iowa was good, there were few venues more imposing than Carver Hawkeye. More like a bunker or underground fighting ring than a basketball arena, this place gets loud, the fans were absolutely certifiable, and you are teetering on the edge of a fight taking place at any time
Tier 2: The tough venues
Wisconsin- Loud fanbase, not as imposing as it is a tough place to play
Purdue- Very loud primarily because of how the arena was built. Energetic fans. But I've never though of Mackey as imposing as much as tough.
MSU- Energized fanbase that makes for tough games. Not as loud or imposing as it should be but a tough place to play
Rutgers- Just a tough place to play. Fans aren't super imposing or loud, and we haven’t seen this team as a contender, but considering this is already a very tough venue, it's easy to see them in this tier if and when they become one.
Tier 3: Should be more imposing than they are
Michigan- This place is not imposing even when Michigan is good. They can get a decent crowd, but for whatever reason, it almost feels like the energy is damped in this place
OSU- Another place that seems like it should have an imposing crowd but doesn't. Could be a fan support issue.
Tier 4: The I don't know what to do with them as I have no memory of them being good tier but it in theory could be an imposing venue.
Minnesota - Lol@Minnesota. Yes, they were technically good for a short stretch in my lifetime, but I still have no recall of the Barn during that time. I've heard people say it gets loud? The raised floor is imposing because it's a death trap I guess and the fans are uncomfortably weird, but has any team ever feared playing there?
Nebraska - This venue probably could get loud and imposing, but I wouldn't know because this team has never been good.
Tier F: Might as well give opposing fans welcome baskets:
PSU- Not an imposing venue at all. Even if PSU were good, it likely would still be a good place to nap
Northwestern - It is a high school gym after all
Drink something! Cheers!
The Galloping Ghost
- Washington, DC
Honestly, the best thing about our schedule this year might be that we don't play the Gophers away so we don't have to worry about TSJ launching himself off that damn raised floor at 100mpr. I hate that place.
altgeld88
- Arlington, Virginia
That they've had that raised floor in there for nearly a century and no player, to my knowledge, has ever been seriously injured, let alone paralyzed, is a miracle.
This Indiana player falling off Minnesota's raised floor shows it's pointlessly dangerous
Get rid of the raised floor.
ftw.usatoday.com
80 years after original construction, Williams Arena still going strong
Many legends played on the hardwood at Williams Arena, but perhaps none of them are as legendary as the hardwood itself. Construction on what was originally known as the University of Minnesota Field House began 80 years ago in January 1927. The Barn is currently the fourth oldest Division I...
mndaily.com
Cannot agree with this more. And for what seems like over 20 consecutive seasons I'll again ask this year how has neither the NCAA or the B10 has told them to destroy that thing and replace it with a ground level court? The thing hurts multiple athletes a year on average, some seriously. One day someone will either die or get paralyzed falling off that thing. There is absolutely no reason it should still exist.
Captain 14
- The Last Best Place
Rivals Chernobyl in architectural appeal
altgeld88
- Arlington, Virginia
Brutalism is an aptly named architectural style.
Fighter of the Nightman
- Chicago, IL
Thank you for sharing this! It is very difficult to separate how good a team has been (and thus how passionate/numerous its fans are) with the unique characteristics of each venue. For example, flip the program histories, and is Memorial Stadium a tougher place to play than the Big House? Almost certainly, as MS gets shocking loud for having 50k fans and the Big House is famously not that loud for 110k+ with its gradual slope.
So, I think the way I tried to look at it is this ... if you transferred a given Big Ten arena to the exact location of SFC for our 2005 home game against Wake Forest and OUR fans/student section/team were still the ones inside, what arena provides the best home court advantage? I think certain ones (PSU/NU) very clearly would have detracted from the atmosphere we had, while some (IU/Purdue) could have also delivered an electric atmosphere.
The Barn rivals Chernobyl in terms of cleanliness.
Wanted to burn my shoes after visiting the rest room.
altgeld88
- Arlington, Virginia
The article I posted earlier today in the thread (from the UM student newspaper regarding its history) notes that The Barn is plagued with rats and cockroaches.
And, at least for Illinois games, it's half-full of Illini fans
Also, I seem to remember that way back in the dawn of time (the 60s) whatever gym NW played in at that time also had a raised floor.
danielb927
Orange Krush Class of 2013
- Rochester, MN
KenPom has a "home court advantage" statistic on his site. It looks like it's based on the difference in a team's home vs. away performance over their last 60 conference games (so right now, that would be the last 3 seasons).
The overall advantage is the leftmost column. What you can glean from that is that the difference between the biggest and smallest advantage is less than one point per game. Not a lot, but over 3 seasons, that could probably amount to one extra win or loss.
The other columns are the inputs to his model. From skimming a past blog post, it looks like foul differential is by far the biggest aspect of home-court advantage. I think that's the "PF" column. It stands out to me that the biggest "homer" ref gyms are Wisconsin and Iowa, which tracks with my subjective/selective memory. SFC is tied for the lowest foul advantage, which also tracks. I'm curious if Purdue will climb in this ranking as Edey's 2nd season as a full-time player continues.
"Pts" is points (not sure what exactly that means), while "NST" is non-steal turnovers (i.e., offensive mistakes) and "Blk" is obviously blocks. Of course, any non-noise trends there would be a mix between crowd impact on the opposing team, and comfort/rest level for the home team.
The overall advantage is the leftmost column. What you can glean from that is that the difference between the biggest and smallest advantage is less than one point per game. Not a lot, but over 3 seasons, that could probably amount to one extra win or loss.
The other columns are the inputs to his model. From skimming a past blog post, it looks like foul differential is by far the biggest aspect of home-court advantage. I think that's the "PF" column. It stands out to me that the biggest "homer" ref gyms are Wisconsin and Iowa, which tracks with my subjective/selective memory. SFC is tied for the lowest foul advantage, which also tracks. I'm curious if Purdue will climb in this ranking as Edey's 2nd season as a full-time player continues.
"Pts" is points (not sure what exactly that means), while "NST" is non-steal turnovers (i.e., offensive mistakes) and "Blk" is obviously blocks. Of course, any non-noise trends there would be a mix between crowd impact on the opposing team, and comfort/rest level for the home team.
Raised floors were all the rage back in the 50s and 60s. I can assure you with 100% accuracy that the Indiana University Fieldhouse had one in 1963. I could never understand why, other than for multi-use facilities. Due to the danger of severe injury and the rule of the universe....if it can happen, it will happen.
For some unknown, and foolish reason, my HS gym had a drinking fountain directly under the basket at one end only about 8-10 ft. from the end of the court. I will also assure you that I saw a couple of heads cracked and bleeding after layups. Fortunately, though I played there for 8 seasons and was never injured, I did have some battles with that fountain a time or two. How anyone could put a water fountain under a basket and defend it as a good idea is beyond me. It was recessed into the wall and did not protrude, but of course it had to be big enough for the head to fit in in order to drink from the stream. The wall into which it was built was tiled concrete and was never padded. The gym overall is famous and a great place to play otherwise. That water fountain is still there after 80 years, though the gym is seldom used but still maintained while the attached High School is now apartments.
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We will struggle to score in this one, unless someone like TSJ goes unconscious on shooting contested 3's. Their paint defense is stout. And our half court offense is....not good. Definitely need to be on point defensively too so we can stay in it. Im expecting an L here.
skyIdub
Winged Warrior
I would say it's more of a work in progress. I've already seen several examples of it working much better than last year. If they just.... MOOOOOOOOVE....everything will be fine!
I disagree with the assessment for the "House of Paign." I'm at nearly every home game and it is like a roller coaster. We are not overall loud for 90% or more of most games. The fans are "older" and don't get as loud as venues with more student and rabid fans. Most nights it is a very calming environment and the remodel I feel took away some opportunities to get up close and personal for the younger more rabid fans.
altgeld88
- Arlington, Virginia
IMO the shallow bowl of the AH affects the amplification of crowd noise negatively. I noticed this immediately at my first Illini game back in the '80s as a student. While growing up I'd seen a lot of games in a different BT arena having a steeper lower section and overhanging balconies on all four sides. Same indictment there: older fans who sat on their hands. However, when noise began, it ramped up steeply.
I adore the AH, and it's an architectural gem, but even when loud it doesn't match arenas where fans, particularly in upper sections, are closer to the floor because of the arena's pitch. A low ceiling that reflects sound aggressively helps, too. Mackey comes to mind, Carver-Hawkeye as well.
I'll be interested to see how the RAC is on Saturday. Am expecting to be impressed with the interior configuration.
Our half court offense was much better against Western. Actually saw some ball movement and team play. I'm worried with CHawk coming back, his uncertainty will wipe out any fluidity they have developed. Ugly defensive slog fest .....
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I don't feel "older" fans have much to do with it. It's hard to keep the energy level up as free throws are being missed at an alarming rate, silly turn overs are being thrown to phantom players, and the coaching staff is not on the same page as the players. Fans young and old want to see winning teams that play hard and play as a team. Last year was almost un watchable. This year's team is so much easier to cheer for. Hope it continues in this positive direction!!
I agree, I love the AH, my grandfather worked on it and that is a big reason for my love of it! I just wish we had a more intense home crowd for ALL games, not just a handful, or "at times." We can go from 100 to 50 in the blink of an eye with noise level.
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