Illinois Hoops Recruiting Thread (Week of July 5th, 2021)

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#526      
What is the million dollar figure being bandied about? Is there actually someone suggesting that a transfer to UNC is actually being told he's going to land that?
 
#527      
We have no idea what that widget spit out or if it is lowball. On the contrary, it's just as likely or more so that others are overpromising. Overpromising and underdelivering is not something you can do for too long without a serious reputation hit among your clientele.
Literally every other player Kentucky and Duke have recruited in recent memory has been over promised (e.g., with pro development and/or playing time) relative to their high school rankings. It has had no impact on their ability to continue to stockpile top 3 recruiting classes and coveted transfers. Why would NIL change that? It’s just another form of overpromising that hasn’t hurt blue bloods at all.

edit: Point-Illinois beat me to it.
 
#528      
The desert
I get people having high expectations and wanting to close on recruits. I feel the same.

But the fact that I've seen murmurs of "hot seat" from fans on social media is wild. We just made the tournament since who knows when and were a 1 seed. Things didn't end well, but there's a lot to be optimistic about. I'm not saying we're gonna be a top 10 team season, but I'm hopeful to end a top 25 team. Let's see how the season pans out before we start making bold statements.

How quick we forget where we were before Brad got here... I don't think these expectations would be as crazy if it wasn't for the fact he propelled us up so fast.
lesson GIF


(Hint: Stay off social media.)
 
#529      
You may well have better information, but it’s been said that endorsement fees have to be “reasonable”. TIFWIW The specific example I heard was a guy can’t earn $100,000 for getting a picture taken with a booster/donor/sponsor. Right now it seems that is happening. Legal or not. My opinion is whatever limits are set, if any, will be broken by the usual suspects.
I agree on them breaking rules if they exist but where have you heard the "reasonable" limit? I've looked numerous times and haven't found any such reference.
 
#530      
Literally every other player Kentucky and Duke have recruited in recent memory has been over promised (e.g., with pro development and/or playing time) relative to their high school rankings. It has had no impact on their ability to continue to stockpile top 3 recruiting classes and coveted transfers. Why would NIL change that? It’s just another form of overpromising that hasn’t hurt blue bloods at all.

edit: Point-Illinois beat me to it.
I'm still waiting on Mark Alstork's 20ppg.
 
#531      
The desert
Literally every other player Kentucky and Duke have recruited in recent memory has been over promised (e.g., with pro development and/or playing time) relative to their high school rankings. It has had no impact on their ability to continue to stockpile top 3 recruiting classes and coveted transfers. Why would NIL change that? It’s just another form of overpromising that hasn’t hurt blue bloods at all.

edit: Point-Illinois beat me to it.
Have they been overpromised? Kentucky and Duke have sent a much higher proportion of their players to the NBA than the overwhelming majority of other schools. If the promise was to help players get to the NBA, it seems they've done a decent job. Now, you'd be correct to point out that a lot of this comes down to the high level of recruits they are able to pull in that would have gone straight to the NBA in an earlier era, but I don't think that is in any way relevant to issue. What is important is that they have the appearance of being a factory for NBA players, at which point it becomes self-fulfilling on the recruiting trail.

So yeah, I don't think these programs have carte blanche to just promise any number of dollars if they can't back it up. Maybe they can, but until they prove that, they are running a risk. It's also possible that they can right now but their "sponsors" will cool after a few years and want to spend more judiciously on players that maximize return for their businesses.
 
#535      
You may well have better information, but it’s been said that endorsement fees have to be “reasonable”. TIFWIW The specific example I heard was a guy can’t earn $100,000 for getting a picture taken with a booster/donor/sponsor. Right now it seems that is happening. Legal or not. My opinion is whatever limits are set, if any, will be broken by the usual suspects.
Reasonable is determined by the person paying. I don't really think it's reasonable to pay $25,000 for a vacation. But someone with $10,000,000 dollars might.
 
#536      
Reasonable is determined by the person paying. I don't really think it's reasonable to pay $25,000 for a vacation. But someone with $10,000,000 dollars might.
Yeah. Somebody might even offer one of these guys a space flight.

And, as a non-sequitur, where does Title 9 fit into all this? Lawyers and accountants (the real beneficiaries) and bears, oh my!
 
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#537      
Cary, IL
I get people having high expectations and wanting to close on recruits. I feel the same.

But the fact that I've seen murmurs of "hot seat" from fans on social media is wild. We just made the tournament since who knows when and were a 1 seed. Things didn't end well, but there's a lot to be optimistic about. I'm not saying we're gonna be a top 10 team season, but I'm hopeful to end a top 25 team. Let's see how the season pans out before we start making bold statements.

How quick we forget where we were before Brad got here... I don't think these expectations would be as crazy if it wasn't for the fact he propelled us up so fast.
That's just stupid! Sorry, I don't use that term often, but this justifies it's usage.
 
#539      
Yeah. Somebody might even offer one of these guys a space flight.

And, as a non-sequitur, where does Title 9 fit into all this? Lawyers and accountants (the real beneficiaries) and bears, oh my!
I'd be surprised if Title 9 had any bearing on any of this. This is $ from third parties. The university's opendorse system, or the equivalent at other schools, is open to all stident athletes. The third parties paying the students are not subject to Title 9.
 
#540      
I'd be surprised if Title 9 had any bearing on any of this. This is $ from third parties. The university's opendorse system, or the equivalent at other schools, is open to all stident athletes. The third parties paying the students are not subject to Title 9.
Yeah, you’d think … but the colleges are providing the platform for all this. Liars… er, I mean lawyers … are salivating over this for all kinds of reasons. Accountants not far behind.

(wondering when Dan will merge the recruiting and NIL threads)
 
#541      
I'd be surprised if Title 9 had any bearing on any of this. This is $ from third parties. The university's opendorse system, or the equivalent at other schools, is open to all stident athletes. The third parties paying the students are not subject to Title 9.
I'm not sure if you didn't phrase this well, but Opendorse is a private company. they facilitate endorsements for lots of pro athletes and now are adding the colleges into their platform. They get a cut. Students can cut their own deals outside of Opendorse if they so choose.

I think the university is going to require them to use the platform for disclosure.
 
#543      
I'm not sure if you didn't phrase this well, but Opendorse is a private company. they facilitate endorsements for lots of pro athletes and now are adding the colleges into their platform. They get a cut. Students can cut their own deals outside of Opendorse if they so choose.

I think the university is going to require them to use the platform for disclosure.
Thanks for the info, thought that might be the case but wasn't sure. All the more reason Title 9 wouldn't be implicated.
 
#544      
You may well have better information, but it’s been said that endorsement fees have to be “reasonable”. TIFWIW The specific example I heard was a guy can’t earn $100,000 for getting a picture taken with a booster/donor/sponsor. Right now it seems that is happening. Legal or not. My opinion is whatever limits are set, if any, will be broken by the usual suspects.

Custom pricing that effectively allow boosters to pay what they want would violate NCAA guidelines. Whether that's absurd in the face of NIL is irrelevant --that's just the way the NCAA thinks about trying to control the labor market, and we aren't going to change that.

While they can say that, and might be able to police it if it were that obvious, in practice, it will be easy for boosters to avoid that problem. Most that have deep pockets have business interests, or are themselves business owners who can throw around marketing money. Those of us that were around 'back in the day, remember certain flyin Illini driving certain forms of transportation (cough, cough). Those kinds of people donate to athletic funds all the time, and now they'll be directly involved. Might even be more fun that way.
 
#545      
I'm still waiting on Mark Alstork's 20ppg.
I’m of the opinion we need to appreciate Alstork and we shouldn’t be disappointed in his tenure here...
He was one of the first to believe in Underwood and see what the program would become. I think we might have gotten 20 ppg out of him if he didn’t have to play in Underwood’s extended pressure defense that wore his legs out.
Also, the pressure d gave the other teams so many easy buckets it killed the kid’s’ confidence....
I think Alstork was a key piece on Underwood’s learning and growth as a coach. I’m forever appreciative that he chose to help get this all started and get us back to relevance again....
 
#548      
This. Illinois is using Opendorse. Everything is above board and fully disclosed with realistic numbers. That should be a solid long term strategy.
That's a local startup here in Lincoln that I've been following for a long time. This NIL change is going to make them a lot of money very very quickly.
 
#549      
Reasonable is determined by the person paying. I don't really think it's reasonable to pay $25,000 for a vacation. But someone with $10,000,000 dollars might.
If there is a "reasonable" standard somewhere, I'm sure it's an objective standard, not a subjective one. For those of you who aren't lawyers, that means it would need to be reasonable to some imaginary, average person.
 
#550      
For all those saying we can’t compete in the BIG, won’t be “elite”, can’t bring home the Natty until we compete with the “blue bloods” for the 5 * talent….consider this from Rivals rankings:
2016: 3 commits (3*, 4*, 4*)
2017: 2 commits (3*, 4*)
2018: 5 commits (NR, NR, 3*, 4*, 4*)
2019: 1 commit (3*)
2020: 3 commits (4*, 4*, 4*)
2021: 3 commits (5*, 4*, 4*)
2022: 1 commit thus far (3*)
What team? The same team that just won the Championship…..Baylor
Look at last years Baylor team. They had 3 bigs that cumulatively totaled around 12 points per game and 10 rebounds.

Of course many will critique this post and talk about this, that, and the other and how this doesn’t compare with our beloved Illini. Whatever……blowhards are blowhards and some people just live in a world of pessimism, negativity, and argue to argue. Go argue with someone at the local tavern…..
The point is this….Brad is creating a team of interchangeable parts with athleticism, length, speed, slashers, shooters, and defenders. I personally love it.
Yep, I’d still like to get Kofi back, or another big….but Baylor just showcased what can be done with a bunch of three star and four star recruits without five star players and dominant bigs.
 
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