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Old Dec 3, 2017, 04:35 PM   #326
champaignchris
My issue with regard to Pace and the Bears is that I trust Pace to do a better job going forward more than I trust those above Pace to choose someone else to do Pace's job.

What's going to happen is that the Bears brass will essentially give Pace a one-year ultimatum that will effectively kill his coaching search. (Since no one wants to take a job with a GM on the way out.) The subpar coach that gets hired will perform subpar-ly and the predictable will happen.

Then they'll bring in a new GM, but mandate that the new GM has to keep the subpar coach for at least another year or two because there's too much money left on the coach's contract since they had to offer a big guarantee to get anyone to take the job at all. So that will limit their ability to find a GM. Cycle repeats. Wash, rinse, etc. We've seen this movie before.
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Old Dec 3, 2017, 04:48 PM   #327
IlliniJim20
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Originally Posted by champaignchris View Post
Expensive Iíll give you. Ineffective? Heís 36 for 38 since leaving the Bears.
Big difference from when he was with the Bears.

As I said, I like him, but he was not the same.

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Old Dec 3, 2017, 04:53 PM   #328
IlliniJim20
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Originally Posted by champaignchris View Post
My issue with regard to Pace and the Bears is that I trust Pace to do a better job going forward more than I trust those above Pace to choose someone else to do Pace's job.

What's going to happen is that the Bears brass will essentially give Pace a one-year ultimatum that will effectively kill his coaching search. (Since no one wants to take a job with a GM on the way out.) The subpar coach that gets hired will perform subpar-ly and the predictable will happen.

Then they'll bring in a new GM, but mandate that the new GM has to keep the subpar coach for at least another year or two because there's too much money left on the coach's contract since they had to offer a big guarantee to get anyone to take the job at all. So that will limit their ability to find a GM. Cycle repeats. Wash, rinse, etc. We've seen this movie before.
I'm guessing you have been a Bears fan for quite some time

You nailed it. More evidence, if this comes to fruition, of an inept franchise.

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Old Dec 4, 2017, 11:51 AM   #329
Illwinsagain
Location: Cary, IL
Quote:
Originally Posted by champaignchris View Post
My issue with regard to Pace and the Bears is that I trust Pace to do a better job going forward more than I trust those above Pace to choose someone else to do Pace's job.

What's going to happen is that the Bears brass will essentially give Pace a one-year ultimatum that will effectively kill his coaching search. (Since no one wants to take a job with a GM on the way out.) The subpar coach that gets hired will perform subpar-ly and the predictable will happen.

Then they'll bring in a new GM, but mandate that the new GM has to keep the subpar coach for at least another year or two because there's too much money left on the coach's contract since they had to offer a big guarantee to get anyone to take the job at all. So that will limit their ability to find a GM. Cycle repeats. Wash, rinse, etc. We've seen this movie before.
Yes, we have seen this scenario just a couple of turns ago. I agree with Pace thoughts, I heard on the radio that he is still the youngest GM in the league. Let him bring in a coach with a 5/6 year deal and have his contract last at least 3 more years. He has had some decent FA pickups, and drafts. Unfortunately, when you take a chance on players with injury concerns and they get injured, it generally does not look good. Over the past 3 years, the Bears have been injured far more than average teams. Believe it or not, this year has been better than years past, and the team still blows.
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Old Dec 10, 2017, 01:25 PM   #330
Illiniaaron
Location: Geneseo, IL
The Bears have over 250 yards of offense in first half...and 12 points
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Old Dec 10, 2017, 05:05 PM   #331
IlliniFaninHoosierLand
So finally back at my hotel after attending today's Bears-Bengals game. Pretty cold game to be at as it was overcast and the temps hovered around the mid-30s.

I was really impressed with Trubisky's performance today. He made quite a few throws that are good to see being made. Though I will admit that the Bengals being down as many defensive players as they did (6 I believe including Pacman Jones who went on IR this week) certainly helped Trubisky's cause.

Kendall Wright had his best game in a Bears uniform. Jordan Howard looked like the player we're used to seeing going for 148 yards rushing and 2 TDs.
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Old Dec 10, 2017, 05:07 PM   #332
IlliniJim20
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Originally Posted by Illiniaaron View Post
The Bears have over 250 yards of offense in first half...and 12 points
At least one dropped TD pass though iirc.

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Old Dec 11, 2017, 10:09 AM   #333
Illwinsagain
Location: Cary, IL
Have the Bears wrapped up the AFC Central yet? 3-0, waiting on a pesky Browns team in a couple weeks.
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Old Dec 12, 2017, 12:00 PM   #334
Illinoise
Call me goofy but I’m starting to feel like an off-season where the Bears seriously upgrade the WR position and add a few new pieces through the draft could have this team in the playoffs next year. I’m seeing a lot of positives.
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Old Dec 12, 2017, 12:58 PM   #335
IlliniJim20
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Call me goofy but Iím starting to feel like an off-season where the Bears seriously upgrade the WR position and add a few new pieces through the draft could have this team in the playoffs next year. Iím seeing a lot of positives.
You're goofy

Fair point, but tough to make lots of improvement in the off season. Needs plenty of help at wr, ol, K.

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Old Dec 12, 2017, 07:26 PM   #336
IlliniFaninHoosierLand
Devin Hester officially announced his retirement today.

There's a serious argument that could be made for him having a bust in Canton in 5 years. It wasn't just his stats in the return game. It was how he impacted field position with his return ability.
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Old Dec 13, 2017, 02:47 PM   #337
champaignchris
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Originally Posted by IlliniJim20 View Post
You're goofy

Fair point, but tough to make lots of improvement in the off season. Needs plenty of help at wr, ol, K.
, head coach, offensive coordinator...
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Old Dec 13, 2017, 05:21 PM   #338
IlliniJim20
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Originally Posted by champaignchris View Post
, head coach, offensive coordinator...
Agree, but might also set back improvement a year.

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Old Dec 14, 2017, 08:51 AM   #339
Illiniaaron
Location: Geneseo, IL
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Originally Posted by Illwinsagain View Post
Have the Bears wrapped up the AFC Central yet? 3-0, waiting on a pesky Browns team in a couple weeks.
The flip side to that is that they are an unbelievably bad 1-10 against the NFC.
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Old Dec 16, 2017, 07:07 PM   #340
champaignchris
Rough way for Trubisky to get the first 300-yard passing game of his career.

A couple of those interceptions were pretty bad. But on that first one, Wright gave up on the ball. He puts a hand up, and it's an incompletion at worst.

Trubisky isn't getting much help out there. He was 31 for 46 passing, and I'm positive there were at least 7 drops in those 15 incompletions.

Trubisky passed Steve Romanik and Matt Barkley to become #31 on the Bears all-time passing yardage list. He's 1 yard away from tying Steve Fuller to move into the top 30. Brian Griese, Chris Chandler and Steve Walsh are all in his sights in the next two games. (This is how I amuse myself when watching the Bears.)
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Old Dec 16, 2017, 07:52 PM   #341
Illiniaaron
Location: Geneseo, IL
Quote:
Originally Posted by champaignchris View Post
Rough way for Trubisky to get the first 300-yard passing game of his career.

A couple of those interceptions were pretty bad. But on that first one, Wright gave up on the ball. He puts a hand up, and it's an incompletion at worst.

Trubisky isn't getting much help out there. He was 31 for 46 passing, and I'm positive there were at least 7 drops in those 15 incompletions.

Trubisky passed Steve Romanik and Matt Barkley to become #31 on the Bears all-time passing yardage list. He's 1 yard away from tying Steve Fuller to move into the top 30. Brian Griese, Chris Chandler and Steve Walsh are all in his sights in the next two games. (This is how I amuse myself when watching the Bears.)
You must be a self-masochist.
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Old Dec 16, 2017, 07:57 PM   #342
IlliniFaninHoosierLand
Quote:
Originally Posted by champaignchris View Post
Rough way for Trubisky to get the first 300-yard passing game of his career.

A couple of those interceptions were pretty bad. But on that first one, Wright gave up on the ball. He puts a hand up, and it's an incompletion at worst.

Trubisky isn't getting much help out there. He was 31 for 46 passing, and I'm positive there were at least 7 drops in those 15 incompletions.

Trubisky passed Steve Romanik and Matt Barkley to become #31 on the Bears all-time passing yardage list. He's 1 yard away from tying Steve Fuller to move into the top 30. Brian Griese, Chris Chandler and Steve Walsh are all in his sights in the next two games. (This is how I amuse myself when watching the Bears.)
The worst thing about today's game was that Jordan Howard ran the ball 10 times. 10 FREAKING TIMES!!!! With how bad Detroit's run D is and how well he did against Cincinnati last week, there's no reason he shouldn't have gotten the ball more today.
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Old Dec 17, 2017, 01:36 PM   #343
IlliniJim20
Quote:
Originally Posted by champaignchris View Post
Rough way for Trubisky to get the first 300-yard passing game of his career.

A couple of those interceptions were pretty bad. But on that first one, Wright gave up on the ball. He puts a hand up, and it's an incompletion at worst.

Trubisky isn't getting much help out there. He was 31 for 46 passing, and I'm positive there were at least 7 drops in those 15 incompletions.

Trubisky passed Steve Romanik and Matt Barkley to become #31 on the Bears all-time passing yardage list. He's 1 yard away from tying Steve Fuller to move into the top 30. Brian Griese, Chris Chandler and Steve Walsh are all in his sights in the next two games. (This is how I amuse myself when watching the Bears.)
His second int, the one in the end zone, also looked like the receiver cut short his route. Hard to tell exactly, that's something the staff will know in film study.

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Old Dec 17, 2017, 06:34 PM   #344
IanKEvans2
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Originally Posted by champaignchris View Post
Expensive Iíll give you. Ineffective? Heís 36 for 38 since leaving the Bears.
and 6/6 tonight (38, 47, 28, 50, 48) including a game winner.

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Old Dec 17, 2017, 06:37 PM   #345
IlliniJim20
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and 6/6 tonight (38, 47, 28, 50, 48) including a game winner.
If he did that in Chicago, he'd still be here.

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Old Dec 17, 2017, 11:10 PM   #346
champaignchris
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If he did that in Chicago, he'd still be here.
He hit 33 of 39 in his last year in Chicago. That's 84.6%, which was right on his career 85.4% for his time in Chicago and included 7 for 9 from 50+ yards.

84.6% is very, very good and would be top 12 all-time in the NFL if carried for a whole career. It was marginally worse than Gould's career average, which is now at 86.8%, which is good for 5th all time, with Gould having at least 100 more attempts than anyone in front of him other than Gostkowski. That's a percentage point and a half over a season of about 30 kicks. That's a completely insignificant statistical variance. That's one and a half fewer makes over 3+ seasons. It's simply not evidence of a tail-off, nor a reason to cut an elite kicker.

Are you sure you're not confusing his 2014 season (his second to last with the Bears) where he was injured and only attempted 12 field goals for the year? (Made 9 - 75%.)

Gould was cut as a cost saving measure. And I understand the reasoning. There's no point in paying a premium for an elite field goal kicker. The difference between him and a merely average NFL kicker might be three makes, or 9 points spread out over a 16 game schedule.

IF you replace him with a merely average NFL kicker and IF you use the money saved to improve your team in other places, it's a smart move to move on from him. I think the frustration many fans like me have is the Bears certainly didn't fulfill the first condition and - with the bevy of free agent whiffs during the Pace era - don't appear to have fulfilled the second condition either.
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Old Dec 18, 2017, 07:24 AM   #347
IlliniJim20
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Originally Posted by champaignchris View Post
He hit 33 of 39 in his last year in Chicago. That's 84.6%, which was right on his career 85.4% for his time in Chicago and included 7 for 9 from 50+ yards.

84.6% is very, very good and would be top 12 all-time in the NFL if carried for a whole career. It was marginally worse than Gould's career average, which is now at 86.8%, which is good for 5th all time, with Gould having at least 100 more attempts than anyone in front of him other than Gostkowski. That's a percentage point and a half over a season of about 30 kicks. That's a completely insignificant statistical variance. That's one and a half fewer makes over 3+ seasons. It's simply not evidence of a tail-off, nor a reason to cut an elite kicker.

Are you sure you're not confusing his 2014 season (his second to last with the Bears) where he was injured and only attempted 12 field goals for the year? (Made 9 - 75%.)

Gould was cut as a cost saving measure. And I understand the reasoning. There's no point in paying a premium for an elite field goal kicker. The difference between him and a merely average NFL kicker might be three makes, or 9 points spread out over a 16 game schedule.

IF you replace him with a merely average NFL kicker and IF you use the money saved to improve your team in other places, it's a smart move to move on from him. I think the frustration many fans like me have is the Bears certainly didn't fulfill the first condition and - with the bevy of free agent whiffs during the Pace era - don't appear to have fulfilled the second condition either.
2014, combined with some key misses in 2015 and a high salary had most people calling for him to go.

Not directed to you, but revisionist history on message boards is what makes them tick. Frustrating , but I get it. I too fall into that trap sometimes I admit.

I wish he was here, but I understand why they let him go.

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Old Dec 18, 2017, 12:31 PM   #348
IanKEvans2
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If he did that in Chicago, he'd still be here.
As you and champaignchris hashed out, I understand why he was left behind, but the replacements have been subpar. Having a reliable kicker like Gould is akin to a lights out closer in baseball: It's hard to truly appreciate it until that consistency is gone.

But I'm just a frustrated fan becoming less and less interested in the team, so my opinions are more heart-driven than cognitively-driven.

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Old Dec 24, 2017, 02:35 PM   #349
IlliniFaninHoosierLand
Official number of no-shows for today's game has been confirmed at 17,539.
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Old Dec 24, 2017, 03:20 PM   #350
IlliniJim20
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Official number of no-shows for today's game has been confirmed at 17,539.
Meh. Worst team in football on the other side, snowy, cold day, Christmas Eve

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