TSJ Thread
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Kedric had a tweet today showing what I think was a court document saying the DNA collected from the accuser did not match TSJ. Said it was a mixture from at least three males but TSJ was excluded as a contributor.
ChiefGritty
- Chicago, IL
Begs the question of what 1.1 and 1.2 say? Obviously there is another location of consequence based on the police report.
I'm not sure why the defense would be moving to exclude the expert testimony and reports of the DNA investigator if those results were exculpatory to Shannon.
Perhaps more importantly, this hearing would need to be scheduled, and that pushes the timeline further.
("At least three males" weighs on the willingness of the accuser to bring herself into the public eye at trial though for sure, that's the ugly reality of this stuff)
the national
- the Front Range
A bit graphic, for those in an office.
This is a big development, as pointed out by Kedric (and Gritty above)
This is a big development, as pointed out by Kedric (and Gritty above)
Please post Parrish's apology article just as soon as it comes out, as I'm currently holding my breath.
Because the states expert is going to get on the stand and opine as an expert that TSJ was the offender. The defense is moving to exclude that testimony by showing why that testimony would not meet Daubert standards based, I guess, on the methodology or the results of the testing. That would likely leave only eyewitness testimony to prove the states burden. I think if the expert does get to testify, he will be crossed on the points they raise in their daubert motion.
Agreed timeline is not great...states has to respond in writing most likely and a hearing set then wait for a decision, etc.
But maybe this convinces DA to drop case or significantly downgrade the charges.
OH almost forgot. IAALBNACL
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TheDukeUIUC
- Twin Cities, MN
It also does not explicitly say that TSJ was not a match to one of the two subjects found on the inner thighs (1.4) as it does with 1.3. Its possible that his DNA is found there, but the argument is that there are four other male DNA found on her body in those two locations, raising doubt on who may have touched her inappropriately and when. I agree that it's weird to have those findings dismissed unless there is more damning info in the findings of 1.1 and 1.2, and they hope this ambiguity would raise enough doubt about the testing protocols and untrustworthiness of the data. Shoddy reporting by Kedric (unsurprisingly) to exclude the rest of the bullets.
ChiefGritty
- Chicago, IL
Oh, someone posted the whole thing on Twitter.
Gonna keep reading here, but at a glance this looks EXTREMELY good for TSJ. All the DNA found was very inconclusive, and the best sample they got expressly excluded him.
Maybe the Daubert motion is seeking to draw favorable boundaries on what the expert can and can't say, but this report is TSJ's whole case.
I am warming to the notion that this case is a dead duck.
Gonna keep reading here, but at a glance this looks EXTREMELY good for TSJ. All the DNA found was very inconclusive, and the best sample they got expressly excluded him.
Maybe the Daubert motion is seeking to draw favorable boundaries on what the expert can and can't say, but this report is TSJ's whole case.
I am warming to the notion that this case is a dead duck.
Sue those Kansas ... to the moon.
Both of them.
Both of them.
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I suspect that the Prosecutor is going to try some "junk science" interpretation of the test findings, which a Daubert motion is designed to address.
Nice find. I mean if the defenses expert is correct, the state, at best, only has evidence of male DNA on her underwear but no male DNA in her private area. That evidence seems extremely weak for the state coupled with the DNA of three other men that were definitively not tsj being found on her backside seems positive for the defense.
the national
- the Front Range
ChiefGritty
- Chicago, IL
No DNA was found that raises to the level in the state's own guidelines that would be reliable to indicate anything, as opposed to the background noise of collecting and handling the sample. Fully zero DNA of any kind was found in the swabs of the accusers genitals. The only sample for which they were even able to attempt a profile match was from the accuser's buttocks, and it expressly excluded TSJ.
When put into the context in which the incident occurred and the facts as alleged, this result is fatal to the state's case in my message board poster whose work in criminal law ended during the Weber Administration opinion. Beyond a reasonable doubt is, as justice requires, an extremely high bar.
Tacomallini
- Washington State
Let Illinois play TSJ in 6 regular season games this year, let the state of Kansas contribute $1 million each to TSJ and the Icon fund, and fire the prosecutor.
the national
- the Front Range
The 6 games are ones of our choosing and it doesn’t hurt our scholly count. Sounds like a deal.
But seriously, fire the prosecutor.
OrangeBlue98
- Des Moines, IA
Just providing ongoing information on how useless this particular DA is. Douglas County needs to vote her out at the first opportunity.
Still no report, timeline for complaint case against Douglas County DA as election looms
A disciplinary complaint case against Douglas County District Attorney Suzanne Valdez is still up in the air about two months after a hearing on the matter.
lawrencekstimes.com
Completely frivolous by the DA to even think charges should be brought here. This is dangerably close to "verifiably false" status at this point. A wrong man's life was very nearly ruined for absolutely no reason.
I hope TSJ sues and wins a large lawsuit. This seems pretty reckless to have brought charges before DNA. If they had prior knowledge of DNA and still brought charges I would say criminally reckless.
Bigtex
- DFW
Probably because financially, he was the most attractive.
Obviously, it isn't official, but I have read and seen everything talked about and posted so far in this thread... I agree that it's mostly pointing to at least a dismissal of charges at some point with full exoneration on the table as well. With that being said, I felt the need to talk about Terrence some. When the news of charges originally broke, I was shocked. I do not know Terrence well, but have met him, and follow the program very closely. At no point did I ever internally think he actually did what he was accused of, I believed him to be smarter than that. He knew what was at stake, his future, his entire life. However, externally I made the personal decision to not tweet/post/mention his name in a positive (or negative light) because of my respect for actual victims of sexual assault and abuse. If I did ever have anything to say about him, I would just use his jersey number to get my point across.
Now, I want to scream this out loud. Terrence Shannon Jr. is the greatest Illini of my generation (I was born in 95). He is better than Brian Cook, he is better than Frank, he is better than D-Will and Dee Brown (who I loved, obviously, based on my profile picture.) He was better than Brandon Paul, Demetri McCamey, and even better than Kofi and Ayo. Don't get that twisted with importance to the program, but he was also very important to the program.
He was boo'd, he was called a rapist, the crowds chanted no means no! every time he went to the line, and FOX and ESPN purposefully turned up crowd mics and announcers stopped talking to let them be heard clearer, and they were wrong. The kid did nothing but played hard and handled it all like a pro, even though he wasn't a pro yet, and under all that pressure: the nasty mistreatment, the slander of his name, and the hate, he still almost led us to the Natty.
I wanted to give TSJ his flowers. His jersey should be hung in the rafters of the Assembly Hall. Terrence Shannon Junior, Illinois legend. ILL
Now, I want to scream this out loud. Terrence Shannon Jr. is the greatest Illini of my generation (I was born in 95). He is better than Brian Cook, he is better than Frank, he is better than D-Will and Dee Brown (who I loved, obviously, based on my profile picture.) He was better than Brandon Paul, Demetri McCamey, and even better than Kofi and Ayo. Don't get that twisted with importance to the program, but he was also very important to the program.
He was boo'd, he was called a rapist, the crowds chanted no means no! every time he went to the line, and FOX and ESPN purposefully turned up crowd mics and announcers stopped talking to let them be heard clearer, and they were wrong. The kid did nothing but played hard and handled it all like a pro, even though he wasn't a pro yet, and under all that pressure: the nasty mistreatment, the slander of his name, and the hate, he still almost led us to the Natty.
I wanted to give TSJ his flowers. His jersey should be hung in the rafters of the Assembly Hall. Terrence Shannon Junior, Illinois legend. ILL
That's why the hospital tried rejecting the SANE subpoena. They purposefully tried to stop an innocent man from going free.
I think everyone needs to slow their role on this until you read the motion and the expert report. These values stated in 1.3 and 1.4 are according to TSJ's team at levels so low as to be inconclusive and possibly the result of contamination. It seems likely that TSJs team can keep out DNA, but that just leaves us where we were initially - one person's word against another.
I would note that TSJs position does not support the conclusion some of you are drawing - that the accuser should not be believed because she was promiscuous. That is not an allowable defense in any event, even if the DNA evidence could be used to prove that there were 5 other guys been there with no indication that one was TSJ (which TSJs team disputes)..
I would note that TSJs position does not support the conclusion some of you are drawing - that the accuser should not be believed because she was promiscuous. That is not an allowable defense in any event, even if the DNA evidence could be used to prove that there were 5 other guys been there with no indication that one was TSJ (which TSJs team disputes)..
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