Illinois Hoops Recruiting Thread (July 2018)

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#603      

Second and Chalmers

S
Second and Chalmers
othawhitemeat said:
I thought Damonte was top 50 before getting injured. If he gets back to his athletic peak, I hope he can show that ranking.
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The thing about thinking about it this way is that while DaMonte was on the shelf, all the kids ranked around him and behind him were on the court developing. Just by not playing he falls behind, and his final ranking reflects that.

That doesn't mean he doesn't have tremendous innate ability and might not surge past those kids that got ahead of him in line, but that is no less true of a kid that was ranked 125 the whole time.

Those final rankings are an apples-to-apples comparison of the raw materials as they enter college programs, that's why they're valuable. But the competition never stops, before that snapshot or afterwards.
 
#605      

othawhitemeat

O
othawhitemeat
Obelix said:
Bruce Weber is 55-53 in conference play at KSU and Frank Martin is a pathetic 45-63 at South Carolina. Hardly the success stories to imitate.
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I agree. Im just saying there is some sucess, but i also covered we need more talent too. I dont want to follow that model at all. I do think outside if one recruit, this past class is very good. Just hope we get some size and start getting higher ranked recruits.
 
#607      

Obelix

Obelix
Obelix
Sizzler22 said:
I still would appreciate a final four appearance or an elite eight which they have both gotten their teams to recently. Illinois hasn’t even been to a tournament since 12-13 season lol.
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Being better than UI lately is the easiest of bars to clear.

But one season, does not equate to success over their tenure at their current school and certainly should not be viewed as success examples to imitate.
 
#608      

Obelix

Obelix
Obelix
Second and Chalmers said:
Those final rankings are an apples-to-apples comparison of the raw materials as they enter college programs, that's why they're valuable. But the competition never stops, before that snapshot or afterwards.
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Yes, development does not stop. And while there is certainly correlation with success and rankings, aberrations could generally be attributed to different rate of development, physical maturity, etc. and less on that snapshot being wrong at the time.
 
#609      

hoopsfan47

H
hoopsfan47
If ayo goes one or two then in nba,


I don't want to denigrate Ayo in any way. I hope he can achieve such heights. But after one season anywhere, I see the probability of it happening as less than .0001. Truthfully, for a guard to go 1 or 2 in the draft is highly unlikely unless they can shoot 50%+ from 3, and there is a lot of upside before Ayo gets there. Late round 1 may be possible, but again not likely after a year. Truthfully, I have for some time been convinced that he needs two seasons of hard work in C-U to prove consistency and dependability at his size. Potential is not what NBA drafters look for in guards of his size and skill.....that is what athletic bigs offer them. Guards must be able to play....no projects.

But....let's wait and see what kind of overall game improvement he makes from Maui to the BTT. Maturity, confidence, and success can cause a tidal wave. I hope he wows us all and gets drafted #1......but as much as I would like to see that, I just can't even imagine it is possible. Dream vs practicality is so daunting sometimes.....but if you have some talent, love to work hard and compete, I know from experience that dreams can become reality.
 
#611      

EJ33

E
San Francisco
EJ33
othawhitemeat said:
IWisconsin was able to win without many top 100 talent, West Virginia at time with Huggy has done it, Bruce at KSU, Beilein at Michigan has done it, and Coach at South Carolina.
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Check 247 Sports for each of these teams. Wisconsin has had some very highly rated players (remember Sam Dekker?) and many Top 100 players. Huggy has Top 100 high school players and many highly ranked Jucos. Michigan has had McDonald's All-Americans and many Top 100 players. Frank Martin had Top 100 guys at K-State and his Final Four team at South Carolina had PJ Dozier, a top 25 player. Weber is an exception as the top ranked guy on his current KSU team is Xavier Sneed at 144, but who wants to watch Weber-ball. Sure he eeks out some wins and he'll sneak into the tourney, but he will never build a contender at KSU.

The "we don't need Top 100 players" is nonsense. Every memorable Illinois team has been loaded with really good players.
 
#612      

othawhitemeat

O
othawhitemeat
EJ33 said:
Check 247 Sports for each of these teams. Wisconsin has had some very highly rated players (remember Sam Dekker?) and many Top 100 players. Huggy has Top 100 high school players and many highly ranked Jucos. Michigan has had McDonald's All-Americans and many Top 100 players. Frank Martin had Top 100 guys at K-State and his Final Four team at South Carolina had PJ Dozier, a top 25 player. Weber is an exception as the top ranked guy on his current KSU team is Xavier Sneed at 144, but who wants to watch Weber-ball. Sure he eeks out some wins and he'll sneak into the tourney, but he will never build a contender at KSU.

The "we don't need Top 100 players" is nonsense. Every memorable Illinois team has been loaded with really good players.
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Again, I feel nobody is reading the post fully. I said it is not what I want. I just alluded that it can be done, but not that I want it to be done.
 
#614      

infamous

I
infamous
We have been in this mode for so long. Always looking out and forecasting the next couple years & it really never happens. We don’t have enough talent to compete. We need 3 or 4 top 50 players on the same team & it just doesn’t look like it will happen anytime soon.
 
#615      

Love the Illini

L
Love the Illini
Need to play better on the court if we want recruiting to improve. You can get top 100 players now and than with a losing or up and down program but if you look
at the ratings most of them go to the better programs. Without making the tournament soon Illini will continue to struggle to recruit the talent level we need to compete on a yearly basis
 
#616      

Newman

N
Newman
infamous said:
We have been in this mode for so long. Always looking out and forecasting the next couple years & it really never happens. We don’t have enough talent to compete. We need 3 or 4 top 50 players on the same team & it just doesn’t look like it will happen anytime soon.
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I doubt more than 25 teams in the country have more 3 or 4 top 50 players on their roster. We can win with less than that but we probably won't be playing a postseason tournament until after this season.
 
#617      

TCTORNADO

TCTORNADO
TCTORNADO
Newman said:
I doubt more than 25 teams in the country have more 3 or 4 top 50 players on their roster. We can win with less than that but we probably won't be playing a postseason tournament until after this season.
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That will make it 6 years in a row, right?
 
#620      

TCTORNADO

TCTORNADO
TCTORNADO
2004-2005 Illini=7 top 100
Plus RS Randle was top 100
 
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#621      

1stsgttb

1stsgttb
1stsgttb
My biggest question, aside from cheaters like Pearl, is how do we get out of the proverbial circle with winning and recruiting. Other programs have done it, but how did they do it.
 
#622      

Second and Chalmers

S
Second and Chalmers
1stsgttb said:
My biggest question, aside from cheaters like Pearl, is how do we get out of the proverbial circle with winning and recruiting. Other programs have done it, but how did they do it.
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Practice better, lift better, watch film better, scout opponents better, game plan better, identify talent better, prioritize recruiting options better, host visits better, rest better, lead better, communicate better, schedule better, empower your staff better, empower your players better, plan for the future better.

Getting better is about getting better. That's what EVERY rags-to-riches college sports story has in common, including the cheaters who hauled in 5-stars. You bring up Pearl, his 2016-17 team that finished 11th in a bad SEC and missed the tournament had MORE talent than last year's version. What changed? They got better.

It's not a satisfying narrative for keyboard warriors, but it's the truth.
 
#623      

Chukwuwumba

Chukwuwumba
Chukwuwumba
Adding to S&C...consistency. Even great programs have off years, but processes are in place to better the players. Consistently recruiting well; next man up if supposed studs don’t work out. Developed veterans fill in gaps. And consistent performance and effort every game leads to wins. We will get there, but building it up right now, takes time.
 
#624      

BRucks

BRucks
BRucks
EJ33 said:
Check 247 Sports for each of these teams. Wisconsin has had some very highly rated players (remember Sam Dekker?) and many Top 100 players. Huggy has Top 100 high school players and many highly ranked Jucos. Michigan has had McDonald's All-Americans and many Top 100 players. Frank Martin had Top 100 guys at K-State and his Final Four team at South Carolina had PJ Dozier, a top 25 player. Weber is an exception as the top ranked guy on his current KSU team is Xavier Sneed at 144, but who wants to watch Weber-ball. Sure he eeks out some wins and he'll sneak into the tourney, but he will never build a contender at KSU.
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Would you prefer to watch Groce-ball? How 'bout Underwood-ball?
 
#625      

nichi

N
nichi
EJ33 said:
Check 247 Sports for each of these teams. Wisconsin has had some very highly rated players (remember Sam Dekker?) and many Top 100 players.
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The "we don't need Top 100 players" is nonsense. Every memorable Illinois team has been loaded with really good players.
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I looked at 247, at Wisconsin's recruiting classes from 2010 through 2018. That is 9 years. For classes prior to 2010, 247's rankings are badly skewed.

Anyway, for those 9 clsasses, Wisconsin signed exactly three top 100 players: Sam Dekker 12, Nathan Reuvers 66, Brevin Pritzl 94.

More recruits: Brad Davison 108, Bronson Koenig 110, Jarrod Uthoff 114, Nigel Hayes 137, Evan Anderson 139, Ethan Happ 152, Ben Brust 181, George Marshall 187, Kobe King 197, Josh Gasser 197, Duje Dukan 199, Traevon Jackson 223, Vitto Brown 227, Frank Kaminsky 242, Jordan Hill 353.

Other recruits were ranked 147, 203, 253, 292, 303, 319, 320, 333, 380, 383, NR
 
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