Have to score at all three levels to be the man. Someone else mentioned about the mid range jumper. Yes Yes and Yes. The idea you are just going to put your head down and get to the rim does not work everytime you go to the hoop. A stop and pop from a crossover dribble can be nasty and force defense to stay closer which then opens up the blow by.
Arkansas 73, Illinois 63 Postgame
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I don’t think anyone is hanging hats on only 20 win seasons. He’s been successful with 20 + 4 straight, basically won 2 Big conference Championships, took us to the Dance 4 straight yrs if you include Covid. Do we need to get further yes. But I think he’s had a string of issues out of his control that have contributed. Ayo getting hurt right at the end of season. Trent played hurt the entire last yr and was spent at the end. This yr tries to cobble a team and stay competitive and his team got away from him. If he would have benched his problem children and then not made the tournament you would have all definitely been screaming for his head! He made a choice and it at least got them in and won 20. Sometimes that happens. This is real life in 2023. It’s not like 1980’s. Different way to treat Student Athlete now. They have easy out, plus nil options that make it way to easy to bail for greener pastures. Lots of people telling them to seek them.
If he learns to shoot he will be hard to keep out of the lineup next year. Very surprising as athletic as he is he did not learn proper shooting mechanics. Free Throws, was he really 4 for 18 on the season and then missed 2 yesterday?
It's NBA ball, without NBA talent.
Pretty classless of Clark to tweet the transfer immediately after the game ended. But no surprise. A me first kid with a me first helicopter Dad who had been to 5 HS in 4 yrs always looking for the best spot to "showcase" his talent. Pretty obvious they don't care how many games the team wins as long as he gets what he wants out of it. Good riddance.
Tough team to watch and I'm sure a tough team to coach. Guys that bought in couldn't score. Guys that could score never bought in. Guy that could have helped missed 75% of the season. Guy that was expected to take a step forward couldn't throw the ball in the ocean 90% of the year.
Take a couple of weeks off to rest up, then get to work on next year.
Tough team to watch and I'm sure a tough team to coach. Guys that bought in couldn't score. Guys that could score never bought in. Guy that could have helped missed 75% of the season. Guy that was expected to take a step forward couldn't throw the ball in the ocean 90% of the year.
Take a couple of weeks off to rest up, then get to work on next year.
I too do not have the energy or the will to read this entire thread, so I apologize if this is a rehash. There may be exceptions to this observation at other programs, but a significant problem with transfers is many of them left their former program because of playing time issues - they were not the center of the attention to which they felt they were entitled. This is probably less true of players coming from lower level major programs. The feeling “I’m here because I wasn’t appreciated at my former program, I’m going to make certain I’m the focal point in my last year of college basketball…” is very human and as we all watched last night and for much of the year, very destructive.
ChiefGritty
- Chicago, IL
He has absolutely the worst free throw form from a guard I've ever seen.
That is in some sense good news, since it's very easy to identify and work on the problem. It's not like his arms don't work and he has to shoot them that way, he just needs to get in the lab and rebuild his stroke. He doesn't shoot jumpers like that, I expect progress will be made next year.
And of course so, so much else to like about his game. Harris growing into a larger role is a reason for optimism.
Yes on the mid range jumper. I know the analytics hate it but it the defense is selling out on a drive I think you have to take what the defense gives you.
If I recall correctly during the Texas game Terrence forced shots in the lane but then his first shot in OT was a pull up mid range jumper that got him going. I believe after the game it came out that the staff recommended he take that pull up as his first shot.
If it worked so well during the UT game I’m surprised they didn’t recommend it again. Ha. But what do I know.
Ryllini
- Lombard
Welp, thankfully not from this board. This has to be a joke right, I’m not on the Illini inquirer, so I don’t know what the norm is.
He finished the year at 20%, so yes. Rodgers finished at 38%. Ouch.
Agreed. And this children, is what Twitter will do to your developing brain. Just say "No" to Twitter!
Ransom Stoddard
Ordained Dudeist Priest
- Bloomington, IL
I'm embarassed for the creator of that tweet and embarassed for anyone who knows that person.
ChiefGritty
- Chicago, IL
Pretty sure that's in jest.
"Fire Josh Whitman" is a fun reaction-baiting gimmick for an Illini forum.
USAFILLINI
- Florida
I know people will attack the post, cause it’s hard to have any discussion about the coaching.
What are our expectations for BU and his coaching staff? Are we good with 20 win seasons with first round exits in the tourney every year?
I’m not on the fire BU train yet, but criticism is absolutely warranted with the product he put on the court. He got paid $100k+ per game this year (not including any bonuses), and is the 7th highest paid coach in NCAAB.
What are our expectations for BU and his coaching staff? Are we good with 20 win seasons with first round exits in the tourney every year?
I’m not on the fire BU train yet, but criticism is absolutely warranted with the product he put on the court. He got paid $100k+ per game this year (not including any bonuses), and is the 7th highest paid coach in NCAAB.
I said a few weeks ago that this team would be one and done or would get very deep into the tournament. After the Penn State game, I knew it would be one and done. I had to be real when filling out my brackets and had Arkansas winning yesterday. I enjoyed the team. I would have loved to have Mayer on last year's team. I am a big Shannon fan, especially coming out of Lincoln Park. Just needed to show more consistency.
This discussion concerning where Hawkins has spent most of his time on offense is a very important and difficult issue for Illinois basketball. The only more serious problems this year on offense involved Matt Meyer 3s and when TSJ was going to get going (often, how late in the 2nd half).
I wouldn't describe CH as "the best option" "at point". Again, in my opinion, the whole concept of a "point center" is flawed. To be clear, CH was not our point. TSJ mostly served as our as our point guard against both Penn State and Arkansas (ever since Epps's concussion), although that was mostly for bringing the ball up the court, when we were not in transition, and starting the offense from the backcourt. At other times, the point was a shared role, where CH played a part.
The original comment here (by forbesfrosh, about CH roaming the perimeter) is a better way to say it. Yes, CH is a better shooter than SH, but neither are great outside shooters. The real question is, how effective could CH be on offense, if most of his shots came closer to the basket? There are different answers to this depending on who CH plays with / against and how his skills developed / develop in the future. CH missed a lot of development as a player around the basket over the last 5 to 10 years, and a good question is what to do about it as he becomes a bigger part of the IL offense. I would say that Kris Murray from Iowa had a similar issue this year, although he's a better perimeter shooter than CH.
Honestly, our best bet is to fill the big voids as TSJ and MM leave, expand CH role modestly around the basket (when a guy like DD isn't in the game and against teams like Penn State and Arkansas, where there are no taller players on the court than CH), and ask CH to play a reduced role in pushing the ball in transition, where he tends to make mistakes. CH can still get a lot better, but this might take years, so IL needs to reduce the pressure on CH by simplifying his role and getting him help for next year. Hopefully, some new guys joining the team will provide that.
Givens:
Perrin: Gone
Skyy: Gone
MM: Gone
I expect:
Epps: Gone
Dain: Gone
CoHawk: Gone
TSJ: Gone
I think Brad's post game presser was an early attempt to keep RJ (and maybe TSJ).
Hot take: Coach Frazier leaves for a head coaching job which leads to:
Sencire: Gone
Perrin: Gone
Skyy: Gone
MM: Gone
I expect:
Epps: Gone
Dain: Gone
CoHawk: Gone
TSJ: Gone
I think Brad's post game presser was an early attempt to keep RJ (and maybe TSJ).
Hot take: Coach Frazier leaves for a head coaching job which leads to:
Sencire: Gone
3 point girl
- texas
Mayer is one of the most selfish players I have ever seen. TEAM is a foreign concept to him - Jacking up horrible shots one after another game after game instead of passing the ball to others with a better shot. Shannon, on the other hand, I have loved watching play ever since high school. Best of luck to him in the future.
ChiefGritty
- Chicago, IL
To keep the program a destination for talented players and to keep competing at the sharp end of the Big Ten standings.
Everything will work itself out so long as that remains the case and it would be senseless to risk that no longer being the case.
It's easy to forget how regularly we used to go into games without a real chance to win, just for lack of having the horses and the quality, both against the top teams in the conference and elite teams in the non-conference. BU has put a stop to that.
If that kind of thing returns under BU, different situation, but I don't see that on the horizon. The guy gets players and has a long history of deploying them in strategically strong ways, which was even intermittently true in this mess of a season.
BU is still way, way on the good side of the ledger for me.
Anytime a random twitter account tells the FBI to go in guns blazing, rest assured, the FBI will do so.
/s
My expectation:
In a few years we should be able to look back at this last season as the low point in a decade of Illini basketball.
altgeld88
- Arlington, Virginia
It's obvious satire. Perhaps tone-deaf satire, but satire nonetheless.
The puzzling part to me is how often we read "they won't run the plays." Wouldn't any high level coach be expected to bench any such players until they got on board? It seems like a failure of leadership.
I'd suggest that this year is the floor of (certainly my) expectations for Illinois basketball. To replace 90% of the previous year's scoring with three transfers and two freshmen and still attain a 20 year season (4th in a row) and make the tourney tells me he had to really work this roster to get winning results. And in the end, he is paid to win (which we didn't do a whole lot of from about 2008-2018). Tournament performance seems to be the bar by which everyone seems to be holding college coaches up against, and Brad has come up short so far. I'm still not willing to consider making a change to try to improve on the winningest coach we've had in almost 20 years.
The Portal and NIL have changed the fundamentals of college basketball so much that what we all "know" or have experienced the past 50+ years is really null and void. I don't see things improving at all across college basketball, and would not be surprised to see it "spun off" by colleges and universities much like businesses spin off segments.
These "kids" are not coming to a school for a college education, they are coming to a trade school that teaches how to get to the NBA. Yes, I mourn the "old days", and fear the demise of college sports as we knew them, but I think that ship has left the dock.
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