Illinois Hoops Recruiting Thread

[21ChampaignSt]

That's college basketball now. Reload every year. When your a 59 year old coach who has pressure to win in the tourney, getting a bunch of old, talented veterans will help with this

This is an interesting tension that Illinois and a bunch of other schools are dealing with.

Fans and DIA want to build something that can be sustained for decades. This might mean grinding through a down year with a young team in order to be better for the next 2 or 3 years.

But Brad and other coaches want to win now. They don't want to "take their medicine", to steal a golf phrase. And they're compensated and evaluated on what they achieved this year.

Meanwhile, the players are becoming less and less motivated by team outcomes and multi-year outlooks. How can Brad stake his career on anything but the current season when players don't commit to coaches or schools anymore. They commit to checks that Brad doesn't write.

 

[SkyysNotFalling]

Interesting stat I just made track of:

Last year we brought in a roster with a total of 2,022 college points scored

Shannon: 915 career points

Mayer: 865 career points

Hawkins: 230 career points

Goode: 56 career points

Melendez: 84 career points

Lieb: 12 career points

Serven: 2 career points

Everyone else: 0



Not only did we have just 7 guys who have scored at the Division 1 level, not a single 1,000 point scorer, just 2 guys over 500 career points, and just 3 guys with over 100 points scored in their career.

Say Coleman & TJ come back; and we fill out with Rayj and Guerrier, we’re bringing in…

Domask: 1,615 career points

Dennis: 1,486 career points

Shannon: 1,449 career points

Guerrier: 1,280 career points

Harmon: 746 career points

Hawkins: 566 career points

Dainja: 321 career points

Harris: 121 career points

Rodgers: 108 career points

Goode: 96 career points

Kutcher: 63 career points



….That’s a roster of 7,851 points scored at the D1 level..



Wish there was a way to more quickly figure out how that stacks up to other teams…but a massive improvement in terms of experience, minutes played & proven productivity.


11 Division 1 scoreres
4 players with 1200+ career points scored
6 players with 500+
9 players with 100+ points scored

 

[Joel Goodson]

View attachment 25182

doh!

in my defense (feeble that it is), my mind is fixed on transfers

 

[reckejo]

sorry if this has been asked, but is Quincy practically a lock for us? he just entered the portal yesterday and is already on campus (or will be tomorrow?), and with the prior connection...

 

[ChiefGritty]

Is it? I think it's practically a foregone conclusion, barring additional rule changes.

Note that on the other side of Kirby, the football team lost the fewest players to the portal of the entire Power Five.

Is stability and program cohesion something you write off to the new world of college sports? Or is that now something programs now compete over just like talent level?

Could be different answers for different programs or different sports. Time will tell. But a team driven by newcomers to the Brad Underwood Experience does not fill me with optimism after the season I've just seen. Whereas the roster stability in football does give me hope we might become more than the sum of our parts.

 

[CoachHooleyHoo]

I don't mean this as a shot at the insiders at all, but there was a lot of talk that by the time this all shakes out, we'd all be super excited (my words, not theirs) about the roster construction. But right now, I'm not really seeing it. I know things change quickly especially in the NIL/portal era, so, again, this is not a shot at insiders in any way, shape or form. Just some observations about the way it appears things could be shaking out.

PORTAL ADDITIONS
* Harmon & Domask = good back-ups that should provide some depth but I wouldn't consider them big-time recruits. Good not great.
* RayJ = I've seen him a lot & he's a smooth guard that can get his shot. Very strong. I think he's going to be solid but he's not a proven pg at high major level. Not super quick & can have trouble getting by defenders at times.
* Guerrier = Meh. Good size, decent shooter, terrible FT %. I think he would be a solid piece if you had a lot of pure scorers around him. Don't get this one tbh.

The concerns I would have with the projected roster are:

1) I wouldn't consider anyone on that team to be a pure scorer. Come tourney time gotta have guys that are bucket-getters.

2) With no back-up to Dainja other than Hawkins, that puts a lot of pressure on both of them.

3) While I think RayJ will be good, he's not the quickest guy in the world, which is a concern with him stepping up a level of competition. Would have liked to have seen them get a guy who can get in the lane at will to set up shooters.

4) I don't see much improvement on shooting.

Not trying to be Debbie Downer, just looking at how things seem to be shaking out.

 

[ChiefGritty]

The concerns I would have with the projected roster are:

1) I wouldn't consider anyone on that team to be a pure scorer. Come tourney time gotta have guys that are bucket-getters.

Disagree, I think that's true of both Domask and RayJ, and are we counting TSJ as a returnee here because that's true of him as well.

2) With no back-up to Dainja other than Hawkins, that puts a lot of pressure on both of them.

1000% agreed.

3) While I think RayJ will be good, he's not the quickest guy in the world, which is a concern with him stepping up a level of competition. Would have liked to have seen them get a guy who can get in the lane at will to set up shooters.

RayJ looks like he's pretty crafty and pretty good at using his length to his advantage at the rim. I think getting to spots on the floor won't be an issue so much as evolving his game to be more of a facilitator and not as ball dominant and high usage as he's been in his career.

4) I don't see much improvement on shooting.

1000% agreed. Still not a bombs-away team by any stretch of the imagination, and I don't understand why a deadly catch-and-shoot threat wasn't a priority.

 

[Chickenmane]

I’ve never seen Guerrier play, but I’m over bringing in guys who can’t shoot free throws.

I feel like it bites you in the !!! at the worst possible moments.

 

[LvilleILL]

Domask and Goode are both really good shooters. Guerrier plays the 4 and shoots 35% from three on a team that had 0 floor spacing, so there could be an increase there as welI. in terms of pure scoring, Terrence Shannon will average 18-19 ppg if he comes back to Illinois. If he doesn't come back there's a couple guys they have their eyes on.
RayJ Dennis shot over 36% from three. Once again, that's a lot better than what we saw last year.
The ideal roster would have Illinois at #2 preseason in Torvik. All that needs to be said there

 

[CoachHooleyHoo]

Disagree, I think that's true of both Domask and RayJ, and are we counting TSJ as a returnee here because that's true of him as well.

Could be wrong, but I think Domask will have trouble getting his shot. Haven't seen him enough so I hope I'm wrong.
RayJ may be the closest thing to that but while the MAC is good, it's hard to go do that every night in the B1G.
I love TSJ's game but he's not a classic bucket-getter. He's learned to use his athleticism to get to the rim, but he's not a pure shooter.

1000% agreed.

RayJ looks like he's pretty crafty and pretty good at using his length to his advantage at the rim. I think getting to spots on the floor won't be an issue so much as evolving his game to be more of a facilitator and not as ball dominant and high usage as he's been in his career.

I live in Toledo so I've seen a lot of his games. He's got a B1G body & you're right he is crafty & maybe surprisingly quick for his size. Just not a guy that is going to blow by defenders consistently especially B1G defenders. Loves to back guys down and hit fade-away jumpers. I was hoping for a PG that could score and get in the lane consistently to set up open shooters.

1000% agreed. Still not a bombs-away team by any stretch of the imagination, and I don't understand why a deadly catch-and-shoot threat wasn't a priority.

 

[LvilleILL]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1648756284970221568

 

[john1952]

I don't mean this as a shot at the insiders at all, but there was a lot of talk that by the time this all shakes out, we'd all be super excited (my words, not theirs) about the roster construction. But right now, I'm not really seeing it. I know things change quickly especially in the NIL/portal era, so, again, this is not a shot at insiders in any way, shape or form. Just some observations about the way it appears things could be shaking out.

PORTAL ADDITIONS
* Harmon & Domask = good back-ups that should provide some depth but I wouldn't consider them big-time recruits. Good not great.
* RayJ = I've seen him a lot & he's a smooth guard that can get his shot. Very strong. I think he's going to be solid but he's not a proven pg at high major level. Not super quick & can have trouble getting by defenders at times.
* Guerrier = Meh. Good size, decent shooter, terrible FT %. I think he would be a solid piece if you had a lot of pure scorers around him. Don't get this one tbh.

The concerns I would have with the projected roster are:

1) I wouldn't consider anyone on that team to be a pure scorer. Come tourney time gotta have guys that are bucket-getters.

2) With no back-up to Dainja other than Hawkins, that puts a lot of pressure on both of them.

3) While I think RayJ will be good, he's not the quickest guy in the world, which is a concern with him stepping up a level of competition. Would have liked to have seen them get a guy who can get in the lane at will to set up shooters.

4) I don't see much improvement on shooting.

Not trying to be Debbie Downer, just looking at how things seem to be shaking out.

I would agree with this assessment, particularly #3., our most significant limitation this past year, and it may not have been addressed.
How does the team look if Hawkins and Shannon do not return?

 

[TheodoreRex]

Don’t be shocked if we add Quincy … Add a PG right after the NFL draft … First part of May like I said last night and we’re done …

Just waiting on TJ and Coleman at that point …

I guess I envisioned Ty & Amani filling the 3/4 well enough that we wouldn't need to bring in someone like Guerrier. I would understand a true 5 athlete being brought in. But someone that plays the 3/4 doesn't seem to have a role on the roster we currently have (Ty, Amani, and even Luke)

 

[Boskydell]

Could be wrong, but I think Domask will have trouble getting his shot. Haven't seen him enough so I hope I'm wrong.
RayJ may be the closest thing to that but while the MAC is good, it's hard to go do that every night in the B1G.
I love TSJ's game but he's not a classic bucket-getter. He's learned to use his athleticism to get to the rim, but he's not a pure shooter.

I live in Toledo so I've seen a lot of his games. He's got a B1G body & you're right he is crafty & maybe surprisingly quick for his size. Just not a guy that is going to blow by defenders consistently especially B1G defenders. Loves to back guys down and hit fade-away jumpers. I was hoping for a PG that could score and get in the lane consistently to set up open shooters.

Don't think Domask will have any problems getting his shot off.

 

[PassingBy]

I guess I envisioned Ty & Amani filling the 3/4 well enough that we wouldn't need to bring in someone like Guerrier. I would understand a true 5 athlete being brought in. But someone that plays the 3/4 doesn't seem to have a role on the roster we currently have (Ty, Amani, and even Luke)

Seems like per the coach's calculations one of Hawkins or Shannon is not coming back and that slot goes to a 5.

TBD.

 

[djkirkpatrick22]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1648756284970221568

as in ?!?!

 

[CoachHooleyHoo]

Domask and Goode are both really good shooters. Guerrier plays the 4 and shoots 35% from three on a team that had 0 floor spacing, so there could be an increase there as welI. in terms of pure scoring, Terrence Shannon will average 18-19 ppg if he comes back to Illinois. If he doesn't come back there's a couple guys they have their eyes on.
RayJ Dennis shot over 36% from three. Once again, that's a lot better than what we saw last year.
The ideal roster would have Illinois at #2 preseason in Torvik. All that needs to be said there

I hear you for sure and that all makes sense. With what you're saying, looks like my point #4 is off-base...thanks for the info. Still have concerns about not having a pure scorer on the roster (I think that's why recent teams have had big-time scoring-drought issues) but hopefully overall shooting is better.

 

[ChiefGritty]

With what you're saying, looks like my point #4 is off-base...thanks for the info.

Domask, despite having the, uh, "look" of a deadly shooter is only around 35% from 3.

It projects to be a team with respectable 3 point ability up and down the roster, but bar Goode no one who warps defenses.

 

[KingWolf11]

Getting to play for all 3 teams in your final 3 coming out of high school has to be a wild feeling Lmao

 

[ChiefGritty]

Getting to play for all 3 teams in your final 3 coming out of high school has to be a wild feeling Lmao

It's like ordering the Tour of Italy sampler at Olive Garden

 

[DAM1298]

Domask, despite having the, uh, "look" of a deadly shooter is only around 35% from 3.

It projects to be a team with respectable 3 point ability up and down the roster, but bar Goode no one who warps defenses.

Well, consider the context of guys like Domask, Harmon and Guerrier who take deep, off the dribble 3s and are higher volume guys vs Luke Goode, who’s made 24 3s in his career. Put those guys in the right roles and maybe the numbers will be better. That’s clearly what the staff is going for considering Domask and Harmon grade out well on open/spot-up shots (not sure about Guerrier, haven’t dug into the numbers)

 

[PassingBy]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1648756284970221568

The lock has been approved by Hawkins and Shannon?

 

[Illini From Michigan]

Does the staff prefer Quincy Guerrier over Olivier Nkamhoua (who is likely going to Michigan)?

 

[CoachHooleyHoo]

Well, consider the context of guys like Domask, Harmon and Guerrier who take deep, off the dribble 3s and are higher volume guys vs Luke Goode, who’s made 24 3s in his career. Put those guys in the right roles and maybe the numbers will be better. That’s clearly what the staff is going for considering Domask and Harmon grade out well on open/spot-up shots (not sure about Guerrier, haven’t dug into the numbers)

Which goes to my point about getting a PG who can get in the lane and create off the dribble. That's not what RayJ is so I don't see them getting a lot more wide open 3s.

 

[Johnny Lawrence]

I always appreciate the info and opinions, and I'll preface this question by saying I really like BU despite being quite frustrated with the culture/makeup of this past season's team...Does it feel a bit like BU is chasing the "flavor of the month" in wanting to "get old"? A strange, wild NCAA tourney yields a couple of older lower seeds in the finals and now we're going to try to replicate that? I know that NIL and free agency has really changed the landscape but I hope BU is not overlooking building a team and culture with complementary pieces and individuals who fit/embrace the culture he wants.

I think it's more than the flavor of the month. Kansas won it last year with upper classman (zero five star recruits) as did Baylor the year before. Hard to believe that Mathew Mayer was a junior coming off the bench for that team.