Worst ever fierljeppen.
Guess you can't always trust Translate.
Worst ever fierljeppen.
B1G record over a 6 season span leading up to the Underwood hire:
43-65.
B1G record over the past 4 seasons with Underwood at the helm:
53-25.
For the 2016/2017 seasons (2 yr span before Underwood was hired) our average final KenPom ranking was 96.
Our preseason rank in Torvik for next year is 26.
This thread is a joke.
Your statement is the epitome of "These days".Sorry to offend you Brad…. How many Elite 8 squads has the Big10 produced during his time here? I appreciate what he has done during a time when the entire conference hasn’t been very Elite. Looks good on paper, but? 11-9 conference record last year with Elite transfers and Elite freshman. Which way are we trending?
Every single school is dealing with "retention misses." Even Bill Self is dealing with them.Do the Underwood defenders here think he bears no responsibility for the retention misses with Clark and Epps? And is he not accountable for the lack of consistent offense and too many players refusing to run the plays he calls with little consequence? I don't think his seat is even warm nor do I want him replaced, but as a long-time fan I found last year to be very disappointing with regards to those two items.
When it comes to basketball, the guy has forgotten more than any of us will ever know. This is the equivalent of the guy at the YMCA who says he could beat Brian Scalabrine one on one...Jeff Van Gundy smart?????? Are you kidding? The guys on here would rip his logic to shreds, myself included! He wouldn't stand a chance.
That is epic.When it comes to basketball, the guy has forgotten more than any of us will ever know. This is the equivalent of the guy at the YMCA who says he could beat Brian Scalabrine one on one...
JVG managed to get into Yale, so I assume he knows a couple other things as well...
Nope, but the question is whether or not last season was a trend or an anomaly. The retention and defiance of the offensive sets were almost certainly directly related. He had guys last year that didn't buy in, and subsequently left. Was it him, or them? I give him the benefit of the doubt for now.Do the Underwood defenders here think he bears no responsibility for the retention misses with Clark and Epps? And is he not accountable for the lack of consistent offense and too many players refusing to run the plays he calls with little consequence? I don't think his seat is even warm nor do I want him replaced, but as a long-time fan I found last year to be very disappointing with regards to those two items.
Is Geoff really the problem? Maybe the insiders can say. If he is the one working on free-throws, that would be the answer. Unlike his brother Greg, he was not a great a shooter. Not in high school not in college. His time with Marty Simmons surly taught him a thing or two.That's not a good argument. Who got Kofi here and designed the way we played? You all have lost your minds if you don't think Brad was a serious upgrade from Bruce and JFG. We are relevant in the B1G again. Making the dance. Yes we have dropped a load in tournament play but we are there,not on the outside looking in. At this point we need to get better in post season play but keep in mind the landscape in CBB is changing dramatically, changes in how we bring in players is changing but I trust Brad to get us back to the 2nd weekend.
I do believe that it is time for a staff shakeup if things remain the same. Maybe time to replace GA with a better offensive minded coach.
I mean Geoff is in charge of the offense….and brings nothing to the table recruiting so….Is Geoff really the problem? Maybe the insiders can say. If he is the one working on free-throws, that would be the answer. Unlike his brother Greg, he was not a great a shooter. Not in high school not in college. His time with Marty Simmons surly taught him a thing or two.
You’re absolutely correct. Problem is when they didn’t buy in they should have been on the bench or out the door if causing problems. You’re building a team not a bunch of individuals playing Y-ball. Brad deserves credit, but is a lot of his success more so due to the leadership of Ayo, Trent, and Damonte? I watched several games last year where we didn’t dive for loose balls and lost the 50/50s most of the time. That’s culture and Brad let it slide. Too much NBA talk and not enough effort. Sorry, coaches can’t blame the players when they are supposed to be driving the bus. JmoNope, but the question is whether or not last season was a trend or an anomaly. The retention and defiance of the offensive sets were almost certainly directly related. He had guys last year that didn't buy in, and subsequently left. Was it him, or them? I give him the benefit of the doubt for now.
If it continues to happen, the narrative changes.
I hate to blast our offense and coaches, whether it’s the players or the plays, it just makes you sick when you watch other games and teams who seam to have no problem moving the ball and getting open looks. How about Loyola’s offense that made out team look like junior high kids?I mean Geoff is in charge of the offense….and brings nothing to the table recruiting so….
Well that was Gentry running the offense then and it ran pretty well….I hate to blast our offense and coaches, whether it’s the players or the plays, it just makes you sick when you watch other games and teams who seam to have no problem moving the ball and getting open looks. How about Loyola’s offense that made out team look like junior high kids?
Not sure what you're talking about. Groce coached them together for their first three years. Then Nunn got kicked off.not a Groce defender at all, but he really only had the 2 of them together during their freshmen season.
I'm surprised nobody that I have read has called him by his real name .............Lord Van Gundy , aka LVG...................When it comes to basketball, the guy has forgotten more than any of us will ever know. This is the equivalent of the guy at the YMCA who says he could beat Brian Scalabrine one on one...
JVG managed to get into Yale, so I assume he knows a couple other things as well...
Read my post again. If it sounds serious, you have to be the only guy who thought so. I'll start putting the s after the posts for you. Sorry, my bad! sWhen it comes to basketball, the guy has forgotten more than any of us will ever know. This is the equivalent of the guy at the YMCA who says he could beat Brian Scalabrine one on one...
JVG managed to get into Yale, so I assume he knows a couple other things as well...
my bad. you're correct. For some reason I was thinking all of Nunn's stuff happened after his freshman year. Guess I thought it wasn't possible for us to not make the tourney with Hill/Nunn here together so my mind revised the history to make more sense.Not sure what you're talking about. Groce coached them together for their first three years. Then Nunn got kicked off.
There were so many players in legal trouble through those years, it's hard to keep it all straightmy bad. you're correct. For some reason I was thinking all of Nunn's stuff happened after his freshman year. Guess I thought it wasn't possible for us to not make the tourney with Hill/Nunn here together so my mind revised the history to make more sense.
Fifth, my baseline for success is to be ranked. We accomplished that at the end of 7 straight seasons twice. Satan derailed us once. Weber couldn't sustain it. I want to see that again. High bar? Of course. But it's been done twice so it's hardly unprecedented.
I believe that we all thought that last year's was maybe the deepest Illini we had ever seen, with multiple skilled players in every position and new faces to reinforce areas of need. What we lacked was the experience that graduated/left school in the back court that made us vulnerable to key players quitting mid-season, the sophomores failing to build on their freshmen season, or new players not melding into the team concept. And we failed to progress.Thanks for the thoughtful post. I generally agree with it. At the risk of stating the obvious, the above is likely the crux of the issue. What is the baseline for success? Is consistency doing the following a sufficient baseline for success? And i'm honestly asking:
- top 20-ish by end of season
- top third of big ten with the occasional win
- consistently making the tourney but consistent first weekend exits
I think the above is a fair, objective assessment of where BU has shown he can do. things deviate a bit one way or the other (the first few years + last year were below, the Ayo+Kofi years were above). But, all in all, this is what we've gotten. as a program, and we've gotten enough years to create a representative sample. should we be satisfied with this? Is there reasonable expectation that we can improve on the above and the ceiling can go higher (historically, slicing and dicing if's/but's as to why "next year will be better and this year was the anomaly", regardless of coach/program, has been a fool's game).
Secondarily, if "yes" to the above, how much should/must we pay for that? BU got his raise that he's currently being paid coming off the strongest years he's had. To some extent, JW probably thought the strong years were the new baseline. Is he correct in thinking that? Was last year just one of the off years?
Finally, part of the reason we're even talking about this is on BU himself. He (as he tends to do in general), talked last year's team up quite a bit (most talent he's ever had...etc etc.) He did the classic over-promise, under-deliver and exposed himself to this. Not that it should change how we're evaluating him, but just an observation.