Illini Basketball 2023-2024

[TheGMan]

So what is a realistic expectation? If they doubled thier percentage from last season for each of them they would still struggle. That is just very unlikely. If they shoot improved to the mid 50s that would be a major improvement but still will keep them on the bench down the stretch.

Like I said, very valid concern. But I guess what my thinking is that it is also possible that last year was an outlier for them. Sencire and Ty took 20 and 31 total free throw attempts, respectively, all last year. I don't know at what number of attempts it takes for FT% to stabilize, but I imagine that 20 and 31 FTA are considered a relatively small sample size.

That's why I was wondering what their FT% was like in high school. If they struggled in high school as well, then for sure, they are probably unlikely to improve enough overnight, but if they were good free throw shooters in high school, then I'd say there is a non-zero chance that last year was just small sample size weirdness. Not saying it is, just saying it's a possibility.

So it's certainly something to be concerned about, and to keep an eye on, I'm just of the opinion that it isn't necessarily a foregone conclusion.

 

[Joel Goodson]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1682058140861202432

 

[ChiefGritty]

So you are saying. Went from a final four team with ray J to not making the tournament with Ty and DGL and justin as our point guards?

I know that sounds a tad extreme, but yeah, that's kind of the implication of both the importance of point guard play in college basketball and how the options we're left with just aren't really options at all.

And what's especially bothersome about it is that BU said publicly that their #1 offseason target was a veteran PG, they clearly emphasized that in the portal, and then when their big swing came up empty they just gave up. Why? Why aren't they frantically trying to make something happen?

The staff, our insider cadre, and this board at large are now just sort of pretending away that the One Big Move that was going to make next year a coherent team that works unlike last year's mess just flat out did not happen.

And I'm still sitting here listening to the same old critiques of Jayden Epps when our options for next year are obviously and unambiguously far, far less promising.

 

[Rap47]

I would like all the posters who are so dissatisfied with Ty at point guard to tell me anyone in the portal we could have gotten and they would have liked. It is my opinion that Dennis went to Baylor because they emphasize guards more than any other school.He wanted to be the main man.

 

[HailtotheChief]

Deron Williams was not a great FT shooter at Illinois. (under 70% for his career) He shot under 60% his freshman year. There weren't enough tight games in the late DWill era for us to be super worried about FTs.

He developed into a reliable FT shooter as his career progressed. (over 80% in the NBA)

It's interesting that you brought up Deron, because his FT% actually went up over 25% between his freshman & sophomore years. Significant improvement is possible. Past performance isn't always indicative of future performance, especially when looking at a player's freshman year.

I realize that Ty's shot looked pretty broken last season, but I also assume he understands the importance of putting in the work to fix it as it could be a significant barrier to his playing time and future pro career.

Maybe he needs to consider watching some Rick Barry videos...

I'd be estatic if Ty could shoot FTs at 60%. I hope he exceeds that mark. If ever becomes good enough to get his future stat line at PG near to DWill's I will happily say I shouldn't have been concerned about Ty at PG!
Rick Barry was a beast too, I loved watching him play when I was a kid!

 

[2020 Final Four]

I know that sounds a tad extreme, but yeah, that's kind of the implication of both the importance of point guard play in college basketball and how the options we're left with just aren't really options at all.

And what's especially bothersome about it is that BU said publicly that their #1 offseason target was a veteran PG, they clearly emphasized that in the portal, and then when their big swing came up empty they just gave up. Why? Why aren't they frantically trying to make something happen?

The staff, our insider cadre, and this board at large are now just sort of pretending away that the One Big Move that was going to make next year a coherent team that works unlike last year's mess just flat out did not happen.

And I'm still sitting here listening to the same old critiques of Jayden Epps when our options for next year are obviously and unambiguously far, far less promising.

O Ye of Little Faith. Ty Rodgers will be a much better PG than Epps. This team could make a deep run in the Tournament. A few months ago we were praying that Shannon and Hawkins would return.

 

[HailtotheChief]

O Ye of Little Faith. Ty Rodgers will be a much better PG than Epps. This team could make a deep run in the Tournament. A few months ago we were praying that Shannon and Hawkins would return.

I am estatic and think we had a good off season simply because TSJ and Hawk came back. But Ty at PG was not the plan and is not ideal. The reality is Epps left, we whiffed on adding an experienced PG so Ty will be our PG to start the season. I for one hope DGL can assume that role asap. I am confident we will add an experienced PG after this season. Ty has three years left but I certainly do not expect him to be starting at PG after this season for obvious reasons. We are blessed to have Ty as an option for this season since they whiffed on Dennis and while DGL gets better. If Ty was a better PG than Epps I think BU would have played Ty last year. Don't you think? Ty is our Swiss Army knife, can back up PG as needed and is very valuable but he would be better served crashing the boards in a position better suited for his skill set.

 

[Qwiksilvur]

I know that sounds a tad extreme, but yeah, that's kind of the implication of both the importance of point guard play in college basketball and how the options we're left with just aren't really options at all.

And what's especially bothersome about it is that BU said publicly that their #1 offseason target was a veteran PG, they clearly emphasized that in the portal, and then when their big swing came up empty they just gave up. Why? Why aren't they frantically trying to make something happen?

The staff, our insider cadre, and this board at large are now just sort of pretending away that the One Big Move that was going to make next year a coherent team that works unlike last year's mess just flat out did not happen.

And I'm still sitting here listening to the same old critiques of Jayden Epps when our options for next year are obviously and unambiguously far, far less promising.

It is also conceivable that when they evaluated PG options that the difference between the second tier PGs and Ty wasn’t large, and instead was a gap they thought could be filled as Ty gained experience.

 

[CentralILLini]

Don't sleep on the D.

 

[The Galloping Ghost]

It is also conceivable that when they evaluated PG options that the difference between the second tier PGs and Ty wasn’t large, and instead was a gap they thought could be filled as Ty gained experience.

And yeah, it's a huge gamble that BU will be judged harshly on if it fails. Currently, the jury is out. Disagreeing about whether it will succeed or fail is reasonable, but to act as if the future is certain is foolish. It's also July. Any number of things can happen between now and March.

 

[New Creation]

I know that sounds a tad extreme, but yeah, that's kind of the implication of both the importance of point guard play in college basketball and how the options we're left with just aren't really options at all.

And what's especially bothersome about it is that BU said publicly that their #1 offseason target was a veteran PG, they clearly emphasized that in the portal, and then when their big swing came up empty they just gave up. Why? Why aren't they frantically trying to make something happen?

The staff, our insider cadre, and this board at large are now just sort of pretending away that the One Big Move that was going to make next year a coherent team that works unlike last year's mess just flat out did not happen.

And I'm still sitting here listening to the same old critiques of Jayden Epps when our options for next year are obviously and unambiguously far, far less promising.

I do agree that if Epps stayed another year that would have been massive for us. On the flip side, that’s why we play the game.

 

[Emerson Bigguns]

I know that sounds a tad extreme, but yeah, that's kind of the implication of both the importance of point guard play in college basketball and how the options we're left with just aren't really options at all.

And what's especially bothersome about it is that BU said publicly that their #1 offseason target was a veteran PG, they clearly emphasized that in the portal, and then when their big swing came up empty they just gave up. Why? Why aren't they frantically trying to make something happen?

The staff, our insider cadre, and this board at large are now just sort of pretending away that the One Big Move that was going to make next year a coherent team that works unlike last year's mess just flat out did not happen.

And I'm still sitting here listening to the same old critiques of Jayden Epps when our options for next year are obviously and unambiguously far, far less promising.

Isn't it possible they "gave up" because of how Ty looked in practice once they put him at the 1? Perhaps the other options just didn't seem better than what they think they already have.

 

[Rap47]

It is easy to criticize Ty for some people but none of them have said anything about a viable option.

 

[Tevo]

I know that sounds a tad extreme, but yeah, that's kind of the implication of both the importance of point guard play in college basketball and how the options we're left with just aren't really options at all.

Can't think of too many Final Four teams where, if you took away one player, they would suddenly miss the tournament.

The staff, our insider cadre, and this board at large are now just sort of pretending away that the One Big Move that was going to make next year a coherent team that works unlike last year's mess just flat out did not happen.

And I'm still sitting here listening to the same old critiques of Jayden Epps when our options for next year are obviously and unambiguously far, far less promising.

Jayden was on the team last year that was the "mess". You really think that Freshman or even Sophomore Jayden Epps is "far, far" more promising than any of Soph Ty, Soph Sencire, Senior Harmon or Freshman DGL? Even when virtually everyone agrees that Epps is not actually a point guard either?

You seem to not only have a much, much lower opinion of all the guys we have left to play PG, but also a much, much higher opinion of RayJ, Mulcahy or any of the other possibilities we heard about. Personally, I think you're overstating both the upside of those other guys and the downsides to the guys we have. I think a lot MORE of the upside or downside of the team lies in the abilities of everyone ELSE on the floor to be on the same page, to share the ball, and to commit to the schemes. PG alone would not have saved the team, if we added one, and will not sink the team if we don't have one.

 

[Rad]

If your team doesn't have a well planned and taught offensive approach then it is more important to have an established facilitator or someone "elite" at created their own offense.....and therein lies the rub

 

[Joel Goodson]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1682058140861202432

welcome to the dawg house. we have the ingredients for a very special defensive team. it's the last dance for a bunch of these guys, so I'm hoping they're locked in. color me optimistic. can't wait

 

[alaskaillini]

Your right he likely will not. But DGL or Harmon will down the stretch at PG because Ty and Harris can't be the primary ball handlers down the stretch up a few points given their FT shooting issues. I just don't see how people ignore this major issue for a quality PG. Didn't we enjoy the feeling when DWill, Garris and other great PGs went to the line in tight games? Hell, people forget we lose vs Texas if Epps doesn't knock down two FTs in a moment that would be unlikely for some. I really, really hope DGL goes off and can be our starting PG by the time B10 gets here. Ty can fill so many other areas of need. He does bring so many skills to this team but is he who we want handling the ball and being hacked in close games? Ty or Harris playing PG down the stretch is and going to the line. It concerns me big time. How can it not be a concern for anyone if they are being honest?

I've got a beach house that I'll bet that both those guys shoot over 60%. Think it was mostly nerves last year. Sincere shot 32% from 3 - he is not a 20% FT shooter. Anyone know what they shot in HS?

 

[GrayGhost77]

Don't sleep on the D.

Our D was good last year despite Maier, Clark, Epps, etc. This year I expect it be elite.

 

[LouDou]

Anybody out there want to try and defend Ty Rodgers in a pick and roll situation?

True, there is more to playing point guard, but...just saying.

 

[Old Farm Illini]

I've got a beach house that I'll bet that both those guys shoot over 60%. Think it was mostly nerves last year. Sincere shot 32% from 3 - he is not a 20% FT shooter. Anyone know what they shot in HS?

This is just one game’s stat line but it shows that he’s capable:

Sencire scored 29 points in a win against St. Ignatius, including 3-for-5 from behind the 3-point line, 7-for-11 on 2-point attempts and 6-for-6 at the free-throw line.

 

[thefalcon5]

I've got a beach house that I'll bet that both those guys shoot over 60%. Think it was mostly nerves last year. Sincere shot 32% from 3 - he is not a 20% FT shooter. Anyone know what they shot in HS?

Sincere also shot like 18% from three in conference play. His shooting is definitely not a strength.

 

[skyIdub]

Lmao @ all the absolutes thrown around here. The staff "gave up". Ty isn't a PG and never will be. We aren't a complete BB team.

It's a bit. An obnoxious one at that.

I watched all of Jayden Epps last year. The assertion that Ty "can't" be as good as he was as our PG is laughably absurd. Maybe he won't be. Maybe he will be.

To just assume that this is already a burning ember in a dumpster is just stupid.

To be clear, I wish Epps had worked out.

 

[TheGMan]

Sincere also shot like 18% from three in conference play. His shooting is definitely not a strength.

He took 17 3PAs in conference play. 41 all year. Not saying he's lights out, and it could very much be a weakness. But, as I stated about FT%, we are talking about small sample sizes here.

We don't have enough data to "definitely" say anything. The team might have enough info, since he's obviously taken more threes in practice. But we, as uninformed fans, do not.

 

[HailtotheChief]

I've got a beach house that I'll bet that both those guys shoot over 60%. Think it was mostly nerves last year. Sincere shot 32% from 3 - he is not a 20% FT shooter. Anyone know what they shot in HS?

Sincere shot 18 percent from 3 in B10 play, was 4 for 20 not 1 for 5 and Ty did not even attempt a jump shot all season for a reason, and had a 58% conversion rate at the rim. Ty does a lot well but perimeter and FT shooting are not amoung them. I truly do hope your right and I dont bet against my team but I do have a basis for my expectations. Ty and Harris are athletic, good on D, create havoc, and Ty can play multiple positions, pass well, plus he is hell on the boards. Thats what I expect from Ty. I do hope you are correct on the shooting but that seems unlikely. One thing I actually do love about Ty is he plays to his strengths and doesn't take shots that could be better for the team if others took them. I honestly don't think he took a jump shot all season. I recall someone said that having see his shot chart. He would for sure be a pass first PG and not force things. Not sure he would be closely guarded and may lead to clogged lanes. I just don't see him in down the stretch in close games due to FT shooting. I do think he can play the 1 through 4. I hope DGL pops.

 

[hooraybeer]

ILL-ohio st B1G championship game from 2021 on BTN… this team was so stacked 🥹