Coaching Carousel (Basketball)
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Old thread was closed while I was responding to the Brad/Whitman discussion, so here are my thoughts and then I'll get lost for a while because I'm sure a lot of you are sick of me:
You were told there would be less NIL funding... March 29th you were told "we're on the fast track" to donor money drying up... On Feb 7 you were told 'if changes are not made to staff there will be major problems getting same amount of NIL Brad got last season... this is where Whitman will step in'
None of this happened, we have $2M more NIL this year than last year (ie, increased funding & support)
You were told Brad would be forced into staff changes... Feb 23rd you were told Whitman is 'ultimately the guy who has to sign off' on staff firings... now that its became obvious we are keeping everyone, that's no longer the case and its all up to Brad and Whitman must watch the ship sink to the bottom before he can do anything... Feb 15th you were told 'there are things [Whitman] can't stand behind anymore' and now we're being told the opposite... Feb 7th you were told 'at minimum there will be 1 new assistant, would prefer 3 maybe 4 changes but guessing we'll see 2 maybe 3'...
None of this happened either
You were told there would be less NIL funding... March 29th you were told "we're on the fast track" to donor money drying up... On Feb 7 you were told 'if changes are not made to staff there will be major problems getting same amount of NIL Brad got last season... this is where Whitman will step in'
None of this happened, we have $2M more NIL this year than last year (ie, increased funding & support)
You were told Brad would be forced into staff changes... Feb 23rd you were told Whitman is 'ultimately the guy who has to sign off' on staff firings... now that its became obvious we are keeping everyone, that's no longer the case and its all up to Brad and Whitman must watch the ship sink to the bottom before he can do anything... Feb 15th you were told 'there are things [Whitman] can't stand behind anymore' and now we're being told the opposite... Feb 7th you were told 'at minimum there will be 1 new assistant, would prefer 3 maybe 4 changes but guessing we'll see 2 maybe 3'...
None of this happened either
More drop coverage next year with a healthy dose of random player career games.
USAFILLINI
- Florida
You have donors who are tired of the losing, but still want to support the team (they are still fans just like us). JW is letting his coaches coach, but if they don’t deliver after the ultimatum, there’s a strong chance he’ll be out. I’m not sure this is the “gotcha” moment you were hoping for.
Also worth noting: there’s a reason other “insiders” tread lightly when it comes to Indy. It’s not because he’s just throwing stuff at the wall and hoping it sticks.
I think others have said a similar sentiment to what I'm about to say, but here goes... do you ever think maybe, just maybe, they're being told something, they share it here, and then ultimately people change their minds, do something different, cool off, etc? If you would stop taking everything an insider says as "gospel truth", you might not get your feelings hurt so bad when it doesn't come to fruition.
I, for one, don't understand why we as average joes would want to piss off the insiders with these "gotcha" statements. Everybody already ran off 0440. I REALLY don't want that to happen with @Indy Illini Fan
I don't take anything any of them say as gospel truth, that was the whole point of my message
I'm also not angry at anyone, just pointing out that everyone is being mislead
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You're clearly going after one person by going through old statements that were made and "proving them wrong". What are you trying to accomplish? Because it seems like you're just angry/venting and I was assuming the anger comes from the fact that you were really holding onto what they were saying would happen, happens and then it doesn't. My apologies for misreading.
Making definitive statements that something is going to happen is somewhat risky. Fine if you want to tell the story after the fact, but people run with stories constantly and then get really angry when the thing they were told to expect didn't happen. Not only this, when you run with ideas of what goes on in the locker room, and you are the only source of that truth, people create expectations in their head which, fairly or unfairly, skews their response when the team doesn't meet those expectations.
Then the rest of the CBB internet laughs and calls Illini fans crazy.
But it's not like this is a new development. It's been happening for the twenty years I've been trolling this site under one account or another, way back to BrooksTaylorFan, betting your beach house, or the rumors heard from a barber. At some point you simply stop listening.
More NIL money is a good thing but that's about it. If no changes are made in the staff despite what roster we might put together during the offseason will be a major disappointment. Can't have another year of catching losses because our defense is s### simply because of the scheme we have chosen to live or die by.
I agree we should be a little less harsh when an insider gives us info that doesn't end up materializing. I will say though, that my interpretation of what drove 0400 off is a bit different than yours. He bowed out when this board was going into hysterics about how Tyler supposedly was single handedly causing an exodus of players. Tyler's status with the coaching staff appears to be an issue in which the insiders are very much not aligned. I think BU's future with the team is another such issue.
I think where at least some of the questioning/criticism (some of it valid, a good amount not so much) comes from these more ambiguous issues where conflicting information/opinion is coming from insiders who have given us good and valuable info in the past.
We have to get rid of Hamer man. Or change their roles. Listening to Dan Hurley interview this morning and it’s clear how much these head coaches have to put faith in their assistants for game plans. Especially come tournament time.
I ask you this because I'm genuinely inquisitive. I actually ask this of the whole board. Did you even know who Hamer was before the insiders (one in particular) consistently went after him during the season?
I think that the vast majority of people never knew the guy existed, but because the season was a bumpy ride, he's the whipping boy. Well, Ben too, but this is about Hamer.
Did you, or anyone else that wants to answer, know this dude even existed?
I, mean, seriously…… BU does not think Hamer did a good job, right? He will demote or fire him, right?
I, mean, seriously……
I, mean, seriously……
skyIdub
"I can't tell you. Secret."
Lmao, yeah dude it’s an anonymous internet message board. Nobody is misleading us, they are sharing their thoughts and thoughts of those they are connected with.
It’s not somebody actually in the program telling us “this will happen”.
They are giving us things to look for, hope for, and hope against, debate, discuss, laugh, and cry about.
How many times do they have to say “relax” or “be patient”?
Some users here are so clogged up and wound so tight you couldn’t pull a hot buttered needle out of their buttholes with a John Deere Tractor.
It’s not somebody actually in the program telling us “this will happen”.
They are giving us things to look for, hope for, and hope against, debate, discuss, laugh, and cry about.
How many times do they have to say “relax” or “be patient”?
Some users here are so clogged up and wound so tight you couldn’t pull a hot buttered needle out of their buttholes with a John Deere Tractor.
OrangeBlue98
Iowa is not in a great spot right now (LvilleILL1)
- Des Moines, IA
I just don't get the delay/deferral from Whitman regarding staff changes. It was clear this season that Hamer wasn't up to the job. Exactly what is Whitman doing in terms of management? I get it, Brad has his staff, but at some point if he's not going to fix an obvious problem then it's up to Underwood's superior (Whitman) to exercise his authority and work with him to make the needed changes to the staff.
I'll say it again - I know if I had a problem employee and I didn't do anything about it, my manager and I would be meeting with the manager point-blank asking me what I'm going to do about the situation. I guess it's a different dynamic when Underwood makes significantly more than Whitman while Whitman is still the boss, but it's just mind-blowing to me that he's just going to sit back and force the program to endure a bad staff decision when it's painfully obvious to everyone except the hiring manager (Underwood) that there's a significant issue to address.
To answer @Second place is 1st loser 's question - Yes, I knew who Zach Hamer was before this season. And I wasn't overly thrilled that it seemed like he got a pretty high assistant position because of his connections instead of his merits.
I'll say it again - I know if I had a problem employee and I didn't do anything about it, my manager and I would be meeting with the manager point-blank asking me what I'm going to do about the situation. I guess it's a different dynamic when Underwood makes significantly more than Whitman while Whitman is still the boss, but it's just mind-blowing to me that he's just going to sit back and force the program to endure a bad staff decision when it's painfully obvious to everyone except the hiring manager (Underwood) that there's a significant issue to address.
To answer @Second place is 1st loser 's question - Yes, I knew who Zach Hamer was before this season. And I wasn't overly thrilled that it seemed like he got a pretty high assistant position because of his connections instead of his merits.
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The Sprouting Divot
Invisible and Bulletproof
- Miracle Mile
Speaking for myself, I don't remember the exact moment when I became aware of him or his purported role as the architect of our defense.
Assuming that is in fact his role, our team came up lacking in this dimension (and others...) this past season, and I personally think the criticism is fair but that some of the more personal and/or unkind attacks sometimes go too far.
If Hamer was not actually in charge of our defense last season, then someone else needs to be the whipping boy and/or find a different role.
Or perhaps his role is merely to publicly catch all of the strays that would otherwise hit their true mark (i.e., other members of the coaching staff).
Perfectly said. That's exactly where I'm at. I wasn't aware of this guy until the season wore on and we hit the bumpy stretch of the season.
There should some alterations to the defensive philosophy or at least execution, but as for assigning blame.....the venom at this guy sure seemed to snowball when he had his name dropped mid season.
There never seems to be any accountability on the players.....except one, which was another snowball effect.
There should some alterations to the defensive philosophy or at least execution, but as for assigning blame.....the venom at this guy sure seemed to snowball when he had his name dropped mid season.
There never seems to be any accountability on the players.....except one, which was another snowball effect.
To answer your question, no. I recall it began last year when our defense took a drastic dip, seemingly out of nowhere. Last year's team started off strong on defense, then about half-way ish through the year, something fell apart. Our defense went from a strength to straight up untrustworthy. I remember Indy posted a pic of Hamer and it took off.
Personally, I was hesitant to place blame on him -- but one thing the insiders seem to absolutely agree on is he needs to go. I've seen enough to know our defense is a major issue. I'm afraid this is a case of Brad being stubborn and not letting him go. I'd love to be proven wrong, but I have a feeling we are going to see a lot of the same next year in terms of busted drop coverage, constantly trailing guards from behind & role players popping off.
Perfectly said. I think that most are in the same boat. One pic that arose during the same patch of time when all of the roster chaos began started this fury fest. Yet, nobody questions why the defense was fantastic early.
I trust our head coach. I really do. Maybe I'm loyal to a fault? Brad is extremely stubborn, however, if a coach was as detrimental to our season that some claim Hamer to be.... he'd be long gone. The results ultimately fall on Brad and I can't imagine him keeping a guy who's submarining his season and ultimately career if seasons do not meet expectations, as some suggest.
That's JMO.
MadtownIllin
- Madison, WI
When did he start?
I’ve been complaining about our X&O’s since Gentry left … Our defensive schemes, offensive schemes, OOB, SLOB, OOTO stuff is absolutely atrocious …
Last year our defense was an absolute
show down the stretch … This year was even worse … That is Hamer’s job … That’s what he’s paid a quarter of a million dollars every year to do and he’s not good at it and should be fired …Our defense looks decent in non con until actual coaches pick it apart and we refuse to make adjustments …
Domask & TJ with Hawkins could’ve had anyone coaching them and produced a top 10 offense … This year all we did was jack 3s … And when we kept bricking ? More 3s … No adjustments …
How many times has Brad had to go to spread during Christmas break because the scheme wasn’t working ? Good adjustment but why are we having to make the adjustment … Why did we not plan ahead and have multiple schemes ready to go ?
Why do we have to have players suggest changes to get anything changed ? Why are we benching players when they suggest changes that clearly work ?
That’s my frustration and ever since Gentry left … The coaching in game has not been great …
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Yes. His promotion to assistant coach did not come without some discussion. Plus once the roles of the assistants are made public, it becomes easy for us to focus on.
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