Illinois Hoops Recruiting Thread

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#651      
SkyysNotFalling
Our insiders: everyone that we want back is back and we got Blackwell

Us: soooo what’s going on????

Insiders: Blackwell is coming and Mirk and Andrej and T and Z and Jake and who knows probably Ty too :)

Us: THE ANXIETY IS KILLING ME!!!

Insiders: ya we should be preseason #1

Us: How did the LA trip go??? Why is he going to UCLA? OMG. But Andrej is already in LA?? What’s going on?

Our insiders: guys we literally got everything we could ask for and more

Us: butt stuff
 
#652      
HailtotheChief
Well, if things go as it appears they will then it looks like Coleman isnt gonna start after all. He should still get enough tick backing up our guards. Also, is it possible that Morrillo at 6'7" could challenge Jake for a role backing up Andre? Morrillo can drive it well, better handle and is good size too. He should be able to play the 3 too. It seems likely that Andre starts with Kylan leaving there should be improved shooting around Andre and the loss of D up top makes since Andre is likely to start over Jake next year with better shooters and need for D up top.
 
#653      
OnlyOrange
ChiefGritty said:
Again I think this profoundly underrates our returnees and overstates the impact of Blackwell.

I think the difference is more like #10-to-#3 than #15-to-#1, and on top of that while I am happy to play along with the Blackwell thing who is a good player and a legacy and clearly someone the staff likes, if his replacement were in more of a passer and defender mold, I think that team is actually better.

Where Blackwell is the perfect fit is if we lose Stojakovic, which I very strongly hope we do not.

#TheRetention is the big item on the agenda, everything else is secondary.
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I'll be honest, I don't get the talk of preseason #1, even with Blackwell.

Let's assume #TheRetention happens, and we essentially "trade" Wagler for Blackwell. That to me isn't a step up - lateral at best.

Of course, if we assume Andrej and Mirk make a big step forward, then I suppose it can get you there, but that's a big assumption.
 
#654      
Fly Illini Fly!
ChiefGritty said:
I think the difference is more like #10-to-#3 than #15-to-#1, and on top of that while I am happy to play along with the Blackwell thing who is a good player and a legacy and clearly someone the staff likes, if his replacement were in more of a passer and defender mold, I think that team is actually better.
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I honestly don’t get the passer aspect.

Vaaks will be the lead guard / primary initiator. I’d actually question that fit in the backcourt. A player like Blackwell who’s a traditional 2 would fit a lot better.

Defense you COULD argue might be a weakness, but we’d only need to do enough to win a ton of games.
 
#658      
illiniguy24
ChiefGritty said:
KJ AST% - 26.0
Wagler AST% - 23.2
Vaaks AST% - 18.1

And KJ and Wagler are lengthier guards, but Vaaks is just a little bit taller and thicker and stiffer (behave, people), less of a lead guard's body.

Vaaks is kind of a cross between KJ and Evansville Humrichous. Really nice addition, and he alleviates our distribution questions, but he doesn't solve them.
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I Cannot Bite My Tongue GIF by Superstore
 
#662      
RIP_Chief_2003
OnlyOrange said:
I'll be honest, I don't get the talk of preseason #1, even with Blackwell.

Let's assume #TheRetention happens, and we essentially "trade" Wagler for Blackwell. That to me isn't a step up - lateral at best.

Of course, if we assume Andrej and Mirk make a big step forward, then I suppose it can get you there, but that's a big assumption.
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You're assuming all else is equal - its not.

In simplest terms:
1) We got Vaaks,
2) Gonna have a DEEEEP bench,
3) Other teams are losing their stars to the draft.
 
#663      
Grange Grover
OnlyOrange said:
I'll be honest, I don't get the talk of preseason #1, even with Blackwell.

Let's assume #TheRetention happens, and we essentially "trade" Wagler for Blackwell. That to me isn't a step up - lateral at best.

Of course, if we assume Andrej and Mirk make a big step forward, then I suppose it can get you there, but that's a big assumption.
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If you’re looking at things on a 1 for 1 trade perspective I’d look at the “trades” being Vaaks for Wagler and Blackwell for Bam. Then you keep Drej, Mirk, Tomi, Z, Coleman and Jake.

Preseason #1. Not sure it’s really close and I think Blackwell is an improvement over Bam.
 
#665      
Illinicpa14
ChiefGritty said:
Again I think this profoundly underrates our returnees and overstates the impact of Blackwell.

I think the difference is more like #10-to-#3 than #15-to-#1, and on top of that while I am happy to play along with the Blackwell thing who is a good player and a legacy and clearly someone the staff likes, if his replacement were in more of a passer and defender mold, I think that team is actually better.

Where Blackwell is the perfect fit is if we lose Stojakovic, which I very strongly hope we do not.

#TheRetention is the big item on the agenda, everything else is secondary.
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I think the more simple terms the board is feeling is without Blackwell this is a very good top 5-10 team with F4 upside. Your confidence belief on that upside is how much you believe minutes continuity is important and how likely progression by Mirk, AS, or Vaaks is.

With Blackwell I think you enter with F4 expectations (even if unfair to ever do that in a single elimination tournament) and true championship upside (whether that’s preseason 1 or 3) with whoever ends up as the other top 2-3 team. You have very little unknowns of talent going into the year other then the wondering how all the talent fits together with 1 basketball.
 
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#667      
FightinIllini30
SkyysNotFalling said:
Our insiders: everyone that we want back is back and we got Blackwell

Us: soooo what’s going on????

Insiders: Blackwell is coming and Mirk and Andrej and T and Z and Jake and who knows probably Ty too :)

Us: THE ANXIETY IS KILLING ME!!!

Insiders: ya we should be preseason #1

Us: How did the LA trip go??? Why is he going to UCLA? OMG. But Andrej is already in LA?? What’s going on?

Our insiders: guys we literally got everything we could ask for and more

Us: butt stuff
Click to expand...
POTD
 
#668      
RabidDawgClassic
SkyysNotFalling said:
Our insiders: everyone that we want back is back and we got Blackwell

Us: soooo what’s going on????

Insiders: Blackwell is coming and Mirk and Andrej and T and Z and Jake and who knows probably Ty too :)

Us: THE ANXIETY IS KILLING ME!!!

Insiders: ya we should be preseason #1

Us: How did the LA trip go??? Why is he going to UCLA? OMG. But Andrej is already in LA?? What’s going on?

Our insiders: guys we literally got everything we could ask for and more

Us: butt stuff
Click to expand...

giphy.gif
 
#669      
Fly Illini Fly!
OnlyOrange said:
I'll be honest, I don't get the talk of preseason #1, even with Blackwell.

Let's assume #TheRetention happens, and we essentially "trade" Wagler for Blackwell. That to me isn't a step up - lateral at best.

Of course, if we assume Andrej and Mirk make a big step forward, then I suppose it can get you there, but that's a big assumption.
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Other top teams will be losing their best players. Your logic will taint a lot of teams when you get down to the exercise.
 
#672      
OnlyOrange
Fly Illini Fly! said:
Other top teams will be losing their best players. Your logic will taint a lot of teams when you get down to it.
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Fair. I think they will be reloading though as well.

Personally I think the loss of Keaton will be very difficult to overcome, but damn if Underwood isn't trying!!
 
#674      
NarrowJ
OnlyOrange said:
I'll be honest, I don't get the talk of preseason #1, even with Blackwell.

Let's assume #TheRetention happens, and we essentially "trade" Wagler for Blackwell. That to me isn't a step up - lateral at best.

Of course, if we assume Andrej and Mirk make a big step forward, then I suppose it can get you there, but that's a big assumption.
Click to expand...

Wagler out and Blackwell in, but you're ignoring the Vaaks and Coleman additions entirely (and we're going to add a Ben replacement / role player). Maybe not intentionally, but neither player was mentioned in your post so just wondering if you've glazed over those two guys?

I'd assume a 'step forward' of some sort for all returners, but especially Mirkovic and Stojakovic being their 2nd year in the program / system. If we do return everyone (sans guys who wouldn't play anyway, I'm talking guys who played significant minutes last year only) then we'll be easily top 5 in what we're returning plus adding Coleman, Vaaks, Blackwell and another role piece.

I believe at least one publication had us as the "too early" #1 for next year, even prior to the Vaaks news. So adding Blackwell to this is just insanity.
 
#675      
Second place is 1st loser
OnlyOrange said:
I'll be honest, I don't get the talk of preseason #1, even with Blackwell.

Let's assume #TheRetention happens, and we essentially "trade" Wagler for Blackwell. That to me isn't a step up - lateral at best.

Of course, if we assume Andrej and Mirk make a big step forward, then I suppose it can get you there, but that's a big assumption.
Click to expand...
I'd say the additions of Stefan and a couple of elite freshmen might raise the floor/ceiling. He's only going into his sophomore year. Last year, we was a focal point defensively because he was Providence's best perimeter player. He's going to get a LOT more open looks.

I love Kylan, but when his shooting went off the radar bad, that really hurt.

Davis was playing WAY too big of a role because of us trying to manage that whole injury disaster. As we saw in the tournament, we saw what a healthy Drej looks like. He's a phenomenal defender and his comfortability finishing at the rim was REMARKABLY better.

We've all seen Blackwell go nuclear. Not much more needs to be said there.

Mirk is going to be an assumed first time All Conference. He was phenomenal.

The biggest hurdle for our group is getting comfortable sharing the ball. There are going to be quite a few alphas in the room now.

If I had two concerns:

1)On the defensive side, will we be better versus Uber physical and athletic bigs

2) That backup 4 or 5 spot. That was the same concern as last year. We'll see what happens there with our last few dollars left.

That's a ton of experience, size, talent, scoring ability, etc coming back with a LOT of experience in big games.
 
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