2021-22 College Football Coaching Carousel

#51      
San Bernardino, Ca.
Like others have said, expectations are the main reason. Helton was never supposed to have the interim tag taken from his title, because he really wasn’t a great fit — southern guy in SoCal. But after winning conference in first year, the players wanted him and USC AD (believe it was Haden) had all kinds of problems and gave job to him before running much if any kind of search. Then 3 years later he had the audacity of finishing under .500 and compounded it with bringing in a overall recruiting class of 20 (4th in conf.) followed by a class that was 64th overall and 12th in Pac 12. USC doesn’t finish under .500 and doesn’t fail to recruit well — especially in its own backyard. He also had the audacity to lose quite a few of their top out of conference games (think he only beat ND once, but sure he had losing record against Irish). A lot of people thought new AD would make change after 2019 season, but he had all kinds of other fires to put out in the athletic department, so he decided to wait on Helton until he could give him a thorough look of his own. So when a guy who wasn’t really a good fit culturally and not considered a great coach overall loses to Stanford 42-28 at home (a Stanford team that lost to Kansas St. at home the week before while scoring only 7 points), AD said he had seen enough. Helton just didn’t seem like the guy who could make them consistent winners at the top of the conference — giving them real chance at playoffs every year.
The lack of recruiting is big. Here in socal there's tons of top notch talent.....And the best have been leaving for Alabama, OSU, Georgia, Oregon, etc. Alums have been really upset about that and expect USC to successfully recruit most of those players.
On top of that, it looks like Chip Kelly and UCLA have become the dominant LA team. That can't fly for any USC fan.
 
#52      
Coach O's days at LSU are numbered. He is the perfect guy to get top talent just not necessarily the guy you want steering the ship. As for USC you are right on the poor leadership, Clay should have been canned 2 years ago.
Coach O hit the jackpot with Brady and Burrow; his record outside that one year has been underwhelming given the talent he's had access to
 
#53      
Ordained Dudeist Priest
Johns Creek, GA
Definitely!

Beckman was more of a CEO type of coach who loved to micro-manage. Toledo got better after Beckman left. Unfortunately for us, we got worse.
Not the "good" kind of CEO though. I'd put him in the same league as Elizabeth Holmes. Tries to look like a visionary, winds up looking like a moron.
 
#54      
Orange Krush '04 & '05
This is parsing details, but curious from those in the know regarding the Beckman hire.

Thomas hiring Beckman was a failure. It should have been clear that he wasn't the right guy, and one of the many other qualified coaches should have been hired.

That said, is there any scenario where Thomas woulda/coulda/shoulda known to consider Campbell? It feels like it would be incredibly odd to look past a mid-major head coach for his mid-major coordinator, unless the head coach was long tenured and had no intent on moving.
 
#55      
This is parsing details, but curious from those in the know regarding the Beckman hire.

Thomas hiring Beckman was a failure. It should have been clear that he wasn't the right guy, and one of the many other qualified coaches should have been hired.

That said, is there any scenario where Thomas woulda/coulda/shoulda known to consider Campbell? It feels like it would be incredibly odd to look past a mid-major head coach for his mid-major coordinator, unless the head coach was long tenured and had no intent on moving.

No. He never would have picked a mid-Major assistant. But Paul Chryst was just sitting there. Anyone want to try to convince me that Illinois couldn’t have outbid Pitt for his services?
 
#56      
This is parsing details, but curious from those in the know regarding the Beckman hire.

Thomas hiring Beckman was a failure. It should have been clear that he wasn't the right guy, and one of the many other qualified coaches should have been hired.

That said, is there any scenario where Thomas woulda/coulda/shoulda known to consider Campbell? It feels like it would be incredibly odd to look past a mid-major head coach for his mid-major coordinator, unless the head coach was long tenured and had no intent on moving.
about the only equivalent, that I can think of off the top of my head, of a P5 team hiring a guy , outside the organization , with ZERO HC experience, is ND hiring Gerry Faust.
Otherwise, teams tend to promote from inexperienced guys from within ( ie Tepper, Fitzgerald) or go with an experienced P5 or G5 or maybe even as low as a FCS head coach {Babers - edit- he was at BG after EIU }
 
#57      
about the only equivalent, that I can think of off the top of my head, of a P5 team hiring a guy , outside the organization , with ZERO HC experience, is ND hiring Gerry Faust.
Otherwise, teams tend to promote from inexperienced guys from within ( ie Tepper, Fitzgerald) or go with an experienced P5 or G5 or maybe even as low as a FCS head coach {Babers - edit- he was at BG after EIU }
Didn't Vanderbilt just hire an up-and-coming ND assistant to be their HC?
 
#58      
That said, is there any scenario where Thomas woulda/coulda/shoulda known to consider Campbell? It feels like it would be incredibly odd to look past a mid-major head coach for his mid-major coordinator, unless the head coach was long tenured and had no intent on moving.
Well let's set the scene properly, Campbell was 32 and had just two years experience as a coordinator. He was definitely promising, and Beckman and Thomas very much wanted and intended for him to be Beckman's OC, and didn't anticipate Toledo would hand the reins to someone that young. Toledo made the right choice and the rest is history.

No. He never would have picked a mid-Major assistant. But Paul Chryst was just sitting there. Anyone want to try to convince me that Illinois couldn’t have outbid Pitt for his services?
Thomas did interview Chryst, but the real move he should have made was Pat Narduzzi who he knew well from their time together at Cincinnati, who wanted the job, but Thomas apparently felt he had to get someone with head coaching experience. And wound up in a marriage in which neither party had confidence in one another from day 1.

No one has beaten Illinois Football anywhere near as regularly as we've beaten ourselves. I'm just praying there's a patient left to save.
 
#60      
Paducah, Ky
Gary Moeller says hello as well
Moeller references make me throw up ....................

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#63      
Didn't Vanderbilt just hire an up-and-coming ND assistant to be their HC?
Lots of assistants have been hired as Power Five head coaches. I believe the question is whether a Power Five team has ever hired a non-Power Five assistant straight into a head coaching role. Gerry Faust was a high school coach, which is a whole other kettle of fish.

No non-P5 assistant to P5 HC springs to mind, though rumor has it that we very seriously considered hiring Marcus Freeman instead of Bielema.

Through two weeks the idea that Freeman and Fickell were a Campbell and Beckman situation isn't looking too promising but it's early.
 
#64      
Lots of assistants have been hired as Power Five head coaches. I believe the question is whether a Power Five team has ever hired a non-Power Five assistant straight into a head coaching role. Gerry Faust was a high school coach, which is a whole other kettle of fish.

No non-P5 assistant to P5 HC springs to mind, though rumor has it that we very seriously considered hiring Marcus Freeman instead of Bielema.

Through two weeks the idea that Freeman and Fickell were a Campbell and Beckman situation isn't looking too promising but it's early.
I'd put a top-15 Cincinnati team's DC well above an OC from MAC Toledo, though I understand the point. Ultimately, people would have been beside themselves firing Zook and bringing in a 32 year old guy with no head coaching or coordinating experience at the P5 level. It could have worked out, but it would have been an incredibly tough sell. Unless that person was Nate Scheelhaase, as some clamored for him to get the job this time around...
 
#65      
I'd put a top-15 Cincinnati team's DC well above an OC from MAC Toledo, though I understand the point. Ultimately, people would have been beside themselves firing Zook and bringing in a 32 year old guy with no head coaching or coordinating experience at the P5 level. It could have worked out, but it would have been an incredibly tough sell. Unless that person was Nate Scheelhaase, as some clamored for him to get the job this time around...
The Scheelhaase clamor was more or a reaction to feeling we missed on Campbell. He is training under him and Illinois is home. I would not be entirely unhappy if/when McDonald leaves to try and hire Nate as a OC/coach in waiting type of guy.
 
#66      
Anyone have a sense of how long it typically takes a new HC to turn around a program's fortunes, for those who are actually successful at it? I looked at Campbell, and he had a winning record his 2nd season and hasn't looked back, which seems pretty remarkable. Are there guys who've been successful over longer term rebuilds, like 4-5 years? Or when it takes that long, do the losing seasons negatively impact recruiting to the point where winning basically becomes impossible for that HC?
 
#68      
Well let's set the scene properly, Campbell was 32 and had just two years experience as a coordinator. He was definitely promising, and Beckman and Thomas very much wanted and intended for him to be Beckman's OC, and didn't anticipate Toledo would hand the reins to someone that young. Toledo made the right choice and the rest is history.


Thomas did interview Chryst, but the real move he should have made was Pat Narduzzi who he knew well from their time together at Cincinnati, who wanted the job, but Thomas apparently felt he had to get someone with head coaching experience. And wound up in a marriage in which neither party had confidence in one another from day 1.

No one has beaten Illinois Football anywhere near as regularly as we've beaten ourselves. I'm just praying there's a patient left to save.

The bolded is a top candidate for the Understatement of the Decade Award....
 
#69      
Lots of assistants have been hired as Power Five head coaches. I believe the question is whether a Power Five team has ever hired a non-Power Five assistant straight into a head coaching role. Gerry Faust was a high school coach, which is a whole other kettle of fish.

No non-P5 assistant to P5 HC springs to mind, though rumor has it that we very seriously considered hiring Marcus Freeman instead of Bielema.

Through two weeks the idea that Freeman and Fickell were a Campbell and Beckman situation isn't looking too promising but it's early.
Robert Zuppke (who our field is named after) was the Champaign HS coach before taking the job at Illinois....
 
#71      
Robert Zuppke (who our field is named after) was the Champaign HS coach before taking the job at Illinois....
yea, back when ANYONE could be on the team Fr-Soph year if you showed up -- and they wore soft leather helmets.
typical opponents for the freshmen or JV teams back then were various midwest Army bases , liberal arts colleges , and the like - anyone on the train line.

I had a client back in the 1980's who was a 1935 grad. He played. It was a glorified club for 80% of the roster .
It was basically a varsity sport for the 30 talented guys, who mostly played both ways.
 
#73      
yea, back when ANYONE could be on the team Fr-Soph year if you showed up -- and they wore soft leather helmets.
typical opponents for the freshmen or JV teams back then were various midwest Army bases , liberal arts colleges , and the like - anyone on the train line.

I had a client back in the 1980's who was a 1935 grad. He played. It was a glorified club for 80% of the roster .
It was basically a varsity sport for the 30 talented guys, who mostly played both ways.
This is spot on. My dad played nosetackle on the Freshman team after he left the Marine Corps at the end of WWII. When I was little, I was like, “Whoa, you played nose tackle for the University of Illinois?” He was like, “Umm, to be clear ... for the FRESHMAN team.” I still have his leather helmet though. And because, unlike my dad who was part of the Greatest Generation, I was an idiot, so I generally used said leather helmet to drunkenly headbutt doors down when I went to U of I.
 
#74      
Paducah, Ky
This is spot on. My dad played nosetackle on the Freshman team after he left the Marine Corps at the end of WWII. When I was little, I was like, “Whoa, you played nose tackle for the University of Illinois?” He was like, “Umm, to be clear ... for the FRESHMAN team.” I still have his leather helmet though. And because, unlike my dad who was part of the Greatest Generation, I was an idiot, so I generally used said leather helmet to drunkenly headbutt doors down when I went to U of I.
lol.................ahhh, those college memories
 
#75      
That was more common back in the olden days. Harry Combes was hired straight from Champaign HS to coach the b-ball team.
He was probably paid $25 per game. Even adjusted for 2021 dollars, I’m guessing a bit less than BU’s new deal.