3/22 Games

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#126      
The Pac-12 is demonstrating for all just how prevalent “east coast bias” is. Nobody rated the Pac-12 at all. And yet...
Could be that the travel limitations have exposed the non-west coast ”experts” and pollsters. The PAC 12 schools are on a roll and the B1G has been underwhelming to say the least.
 
#127      
DC Area
Could be that the travel limitations have exposed the non-west coast ”experts” and pollsters. The PAC 12 schools are on a roll and the B1G has been underwhelming to say the least.

It hards to blame anyone for underrating the Pac-12 this year. They just didn't play many non conf games
 
#129      
Wow looks like Big Ten is massively overrated this year with only scUM making it into the sweet 16, kind of pathetic really.
 
#132      
Evanston
So the consensus two best conferences all season long got a combined 16 teams in the field and are left with 1 apiece. Crazy stuff.
 
#133      
I have mentioned in several game and post game threads that the conference really needs to examine how they are managing games, scheduling and overall style of play during conference season. It is becoming more and more apparent, in my opinion, that the conference is not prepared for the NCAA each and every year. It has been now, barring a Mich run to the championship, 21 years since the last B10 national champion. Something has to change in order to prepare the teams for the dance. Go to a more free style of play, stop allowing the beating down low and calling all touch fouls out top. Look inward B10. But given the current lack of leadership I do not expect any of that to take place.

Final Fours by conference since 2000:

Big 10 - 16
ACC - 15
Big East - 12
SEC - 11
Big 12 - 10
Pac 12 - 5
 
#138      
This is definitely a COVID Year for NCAA Big Dance. No Duke, No Kentucky, Big Ten and Big 12 with one each remaining. Lowly Pac 12 with 4 remaining, plus their highest seed Colorado the only team that is not in Sweet 16.
 
#139      
Final Fours by conference since 2000:

Big 10 - 16
ACC - 15
Big East - 12
SEC - 11
Big 12 - 10
Pac 12 - 5
Interesting. I had not looked at Final Fours. It would be interesting to see NBA players by conference during that same time period. Is it a talent issue or a style of play issue when it comes to the B10 not winning championships?
 
#140      
So the consensus two best conferences all season long got a combined 16 teams in the field and are left with 1 apiece. Crazy stuff.
I think the big 10 shot itself in the foot by keeping the teams in Indy for so long. Ever seen the Shining -- bad things happen to your psyche when trapped in a hotel. I'm not sure the teams anticipated how stringent the quarantine was going to be. Not sure they even got to spend very much time outside. There is a mental aspect to this tournament never seen before. I still can't get over how sluggish Ayo looked, against Loyola, and the first half of Drexel. He was also tugging at his mask quite a bit in the Loyola game. Ayo does not make excuses, and that is a great trait, but he must have been emotionally drained.
 
#141      
Orange Krush Class of 2013
Rochester, MN
Interesting. I had not looked at Final Fours. It would be interesting to see NBA players by conference during that same time period. Is it a talent issue or a style of play issue when it comes to the B10 not winning championships?

With numbers this small, it’s probably luck. You’d expect 1/4 of FF teams to win a title, so that’d be only 4 expected on average... instead we’ve had 0. Basically the equivalent of a hitter having an 0/16 hitting slump, which I don’t think is that unusual.
 
#142      
Could be that the travel limitations have exposed the non-west coast ”experts” and pollsters. The PAC 12 schools are on a roll and the B1G has been underwhelming to say the least.
The Pac 12 performed very poorly in the non-con portion of the schedule, and thus why their Ken Pom and other metrics were mediocre. True, the non-con season was short, but here is a summary of how their top 5 teams performed:

UCLA - lost to San Diego State, lost to Ohio State
Oregon - lost to Missouri
USC - Beat BYU, lost to UConn
Colorado - Lost to Tennessee
Oregon State - No games against tournament teams, lost to Wyoming and Portland

So that's 1-5 vs power conference tournament teams. There was never any indication that the Pac 12 was a strong conference, until this past week.
 
#143      
Me too. They are burying Maryland. They play like a college version of the Golden State Warriors
Bama is an amazing team.

Who would think Terps would shoot 53%, make 10 3ps, hold herb Jones to 6 points and lose by almost 20. Alabama owned the boards 40 to 19 and played a deep quality bench.

I think they blow through Michigan in elite 8 and they give Gonzaga a run in F4 first round..

Nate Oats is a great story...HS coach 8 years ago and may well compete and win a National Championship.
 
#144      
The Pac 12 performed very poorly in the non-con portion of the schedule, and thus why their Ken Pom and other metrics were mediocre. True, the non-con season was short, but here is a summary of how their top 5 teams performed:

UCLA - lost to San Diego State, lost to Ohio State
Oregon - lost to Missouri
USC - Beat BYU, lost to UConn
Colorado - Lost to Tennessee
Oregon State - No games against tournament teams, lost to Wyoming and Portland

So that's 1-5 vs power conference tournament teams. There was never any indication that the Pac 12 was a strong conference, until this past week.
The Tournament is just so volatile. How often does the best team win a National Title? Some might argue that the answer is always, but it's a much more nuanced question. The 2014-15 UK team might had a bench full of pros, and didn't win. The Fab 5 at Michigan, Larry Johnson's UNLV teams, Phi Slamma Jamma, heck the Flyin Illini and the 2005 Illini were probably the best teams in the nation in their respective years & didn't get the job done.

The volatility of a single elimination tournament is huge. It's the reason ( besides$$$) pro sport play series' rather than single game elimination. Crazy things happen when you roll the ball out.

I'd say it's something to consider when sizing up conference strength, especially in a year when so few inter-conference games were held, but it is far from the only measure. The few games outside of conference that were held were months ago. The teams that played in November or December can be at a whole different level in March, especially a team like USC and to a lesser extent UCLA who have freshmen playing major roles.
 
#145      
I think the big 10 shot itself in the foot by keeping the teams in Indy for so long. Ever seen the Shining -- bad things happen to your psyche when trapped in a hotel. I'm not sure the teams anticipated how stringent the quarantine was going to be. Not sure they even got to spend very much time outside. There is a mental aspect to this tournament never seen before. I still can't get over how sluggish Ayo looked, against Loyola, and the first half of Drexel. He was also tugging at his mask quite a bit in the Loyola game. Ayo does not make excuses, and that is a great trait, but he must have been emotionally drained.
I think this was the second shot in the foot, the first was being the last conference to finish their conference tourney. Not enough time to recover. Michigan had extra time due to their early exit and that enabled them to employ their "Eepty the tank" strategy against LSU. Too bad the Illini and other Big Ten teams were running on empty by the second round of the ncaa tourney.
 
#146      
I think this was the second shot in the foot, the first was being the last conference to finish their conference tourney. Not enough time to recover. Michigan had extra time due to their early exit and that enabled them to employ their "Eepty the tank" strategy against LSU. Too bad the Illini and other Big Ten teams were running on empty by the second round of the ncaa tourney.
This is an excellent point, and the BIG’s last national championship actually correlates pretty closely but not exactly to when the BIG tourney started.

We played 3 games, including 2 absolute wars, in 3 days. And then only got 4 days off before going into another 2 games in 3 days stretch. That, on top of the compressed end to the season.

I just checked and Loyola won Arch Madness on March 7, giving them a 12 day break leading up to the tourney.

Might be a factor, and also might support teams taking the BIG tourney less seriously.
 
#147      
BU:1 Trash cans:0
Chicago
This is an excellent point, and the BIG’s last national championship actually correlates pretty closely but not exactly to when the BIG tourney started.

We played 3 games, including 2 absolute wars, in 3 days. And then only got 4 days off before going into another 2 games in 3 days stretch. That, on top of the compressed end to the season.

I just checked and Loyola won Arch Madness on March 7, giving them a 12 day break leading up to the tourney.

Might be a factor, and also might support teams taking the BIG tourney less seriously.
With the way the B1G performed in this NCAA tourney, it should be Warren's responsibility to try and figure out why and what can be done to improve conference postseason performance in the future. No sacred cows. If it means moving the BTT earlier, then do it. There are lessons that can be learned from this year if there is any interest in doing the work.

With that being said, I would be surprised if Warren even recognizes the opportunity to examine and make progress.
 
#148      
With the way the B1G performed in this NCAA tourney, it should be Warren's responsibility to try and figure out why and what can be done to improve conference postseason performance in the future. No sacred cows. If it means moving the BTT earlier, then do it. There are lessons that can be learned from this year if there is any interest in doing the work.

With that being said, I would be surprised if Warren even recognizes the opportunity to examine and make progress.
Whatever the B1G's been doing has gotten more teams to the final four than any other conference over the last 20 years. This year's 15 tournament games, in which the B1G has gone 7-8, is way too small of a sample size to even be sure there is a problem, let alone know what the solution would be.
 
#149      
Whatever the B1G's been doing has gotten more teams to the final four than any other conference over the last 20 years. This year's 15 tournament games, in which the B1G has gone 7-8, is way too small of a sample size to even be sure there is a problem, let alone know what the solution would be.
Exactly. This is a really difficult season to judge anything. Everything about this season was weird. Even if this were a normal season I wouldn't put much stock into any narrative that is based solely on a single NCAA tournament outcome. My guess is there is nothing fundamentally wrong with the way the conference handles things. It certainly isn't wildly different from the way others do it.

There is a reason they refer to it as "Madness".
 
#150      
BU:1 Trash cans:0
Chicago
It's literally Warren's job to look at this. Maybe he looks at it and concludes that nothing needs to be done. But he should reach that conclusion after looking at it. He shouldn't simply assume it doesn't need to be looked at to justify doing nothing.

He needs to be proactive. The conference took a major hit on a national stage. Shift the narrative or address it. Silence (his seemingly preferred strategy) is a terrible approach.
 
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