FBI College Basketball Corruption Investigation

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#826      
mattcoldagelli
miketherevelator said:
yeah, here's the actual tweet.
Brian Rauf‏ @brauf33 2h2 hours ago

Schools that are likely to be hit next, according to sources: Auburn, Arizona, Alabama - and Illinois' Brad Underwood
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Never heard of this guy, but it's certainly plausible and frankly, likely that Underwood will be at least talked to as a part of this given that he hired Lamont Evans.

The word "hit" is doing a tremendous amount of work in that tweet - does it mean charged with a federal crime? Named in relation to some of the existing charges? Tied to something not necessarily illegal but in violation of NCAA rules? The breadth of possibilities is enormous
 
#827      
AttentionDeficit
Does anyone have a decent link to a gambling odds site that does NCAA futures? I am not a betting man (beach houses excluded), but i am curious to see how the lines are reacting to this.
The best site i could find in a cursory search was oddsshark, which doesn't appear to have done any updating lately (still has Louisville with the same odds to bring home the championship as Duke and Kansas).
 
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#828      
Deleted member 10676
mattcoldagelli said:
Never heard of this guy, but it's certainly plausible and frankly, likely that Underwood will be at least talked to as a part of this given that he hired Lamont Evans.

The word "hit" is doing a tremendous amount of work in that tweet - does it mean charged with a federal crime? Named in relation to some of the existing charges? Tied to something not necessarily illegal but in violation of NCAA rules? The breadth of possibilities is enormous
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And I'm wondering if he means head coaches which is why he specifically mentions BU -- the other 3 schools have already been 'hit' in other ways. Either directly or as University numbers. With what I've read about AZ, I'd be super surprised if Sean Miller gets out of this with his job. Pearl is probably gone. And Alabama is trying to do a self penalty by firing the director of basketball operations but Avery Johnson probably is in the hot seat. That self penalty thing is going to mean diddly to the FBI.

I just haven't been very easy about BU since this started. Huggins, Martin, Evans, Antiqua -- and the people on here saying Evans operated without Underwood knowing. Head coaches always know what is going on in their programs, he coached with or over Evans for years. How could he not know what the man was like?

But, we'll see what happens. Even if Brad is mixed up in this, the university may come out ok, although I'd be very happy if nobody looked too closely at the Jeremiah Tilmon recruitment.
 
#829      
ChiefIllini
Kajagoogoo said:
Worry not. Every, and I mean EVERY program recruiting players like him are playing dirty; otherwise, they avoid recruitments like that. If Illinois goes down for offering money to a player like Tilmon, then Kentucky, Kansas, Duke, UNC, Syracuse, etc. will all go down, as well.
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Not so fast my friend. You're under the assumption the NCAA is going to punish those schools as hard as it would us. We aren't the cash cows of CBB.
 
#831      
kcib8130
miketherevelator said:
yeah, here's the actual tweet.
Brian Rauf‏ @brauf33 2h2 hours ago

Schools that are likely to be hit next, according to sources: Auburn, Arizona, Alabama - and Illinois' Brad Underwood
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Isn't he reporting the past there? We already knew that.

Not exactly breaking news there.
 
#832      
qcillini13
Calvin said:
I think that's a red herring. If the athlete's get paid, it won't be by schools, which will stick to tuition, room & board. Anything past that will be because their market value allows them to be paid professionally, or paid professionally at a later date. The NCAA just needs to get out of the way.
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If they want to pay players then the players shouldn't get a scholarship. That is my take. Give them the amount of money they are currently receiving for tuition, room and board, all their meals, their apparel, and all the extras. Have them pay for those but then you can say they are getting paid (without doing all the research over my lunch break) would probably amount to around $100,000 or more a year. That would only be for the revenue sports. That is much higher than the workers of multi-billion dollar industries are currently getting paid.

If they want all of the benefits they currently get PLUS a stipend I can get on board with that but I don't think the stipend should be much more than $1,000 a month.
 
#833      
Illiini
Calvin said:
Couldn't disagree more. Baseball has a system that allows players to be drafted, explore their value, and leave or stay based on the contract. Basketball could be much friendlier to athletes. The problem is the incredible lengths the NCAA goes to to keep all the money or even let athletes figure out their value above board.

To put this nonsensical system entirely on the people trying to get their share is IMO, giving a corrupt organization a free pass.
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Nah, I think any system set in place has some vulnerability for corruption. Rules-free? It won't be. And if there are rules, there's a way to make money off the ways those rules can be bent or broken.

And baseball's farm system, btw, isn't college sports. The only sure way to eliminate some sort of corruption in college sports is to take college out of sports. Let football and basketball establish farm systems like baseball--your example--has.
 
#834      
NEIlliniFan
miketherevelator said:
And I'm wondering if he means head coaches which is why he specifically mentions BU -- the other 3 schools have already been 'hit' in other ways. Either directly or as University numbers. With what I've read about AZ, I'd be super surprised if Sean Miller gets out of this with his job. Pearl is probably gone. And Alabama is trying to do a self penalty by firing the director of basketball operations but Avery Johnson probably is in the hot seat. That self penalty thing is going to mean diddly to the FBI.

I just haven't been very easy about BU since this started. Huggins, Martin, Evans, Antiqua -- and the people on here saying Evans operated without Underwood knowing. Head coaches always know what is going on in their programs, he coached with or over Evans for years. How could he not know what the man was like?

But, we'll see what happens. Even if Brad is mixed up in this, the university may come out ok, although I'd be very happy if nobody looked too closely at the Jeremiah Tilmon recruitment.
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How could he not know what the man was like?

Underwood knows Evans going back to 2008 when the latter was a student at K State. But his supervision of/over Evans covers three seasons -
2011-12 at K State - Underwood was Associate Head Coach & Evans was in first year as an associate coach after being a student manager then Grad manager for several season.

2012-13 at S Carolina - Underwood as Associate Head Coach and Evans as associate coach

2016-17 at Ok State - Underwood hires Evans as assistant coach/recruiting coordinator.

How long has Evans been 'dirty'? Did he plunge right in as a first-year associate coach back in '11-'12? He was certainly caught on tape while at SC after Underwood was at SFA.

That leaves the Ok State season. Underwood may have known about Evans then or it may have been a case of the basketball version of "Don't Ask/Don't Tell".

I still think it will be difficult for the FBI to pin anything substantive on Underwood. The NCAA is a different matter.
 
#836      
Whitman2020
What I really want to see is some kids and their families go under the hammer. Especially parents who accepted or solicited money.
 
#837      
Chris Yates
mattcoldagelli said:
The NCAA isn't running this.
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Exactly! The FBI and the U.S. Attorney's Office in Manhattan will follow the evidence wherever it leads. Being a blue-blood provides ZERO protection in this criminal investigation.
 
#838      
IlliniJim20
TheGMan said:
I've accepted that Underwood is going to get investigated at some point. And will probably get some type of sanctions by the NCAA. My only hope is that it is just "lack of institutional control" and that the sanctions are just a few games.
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Lack of institutional control wold not apply to us since he was at OSU.

The NCAA cannot pin it on us. How can they say we should have known, when they didn't know?

Too many schools and coaches to reprimand. Although nothing the NCAA does surprises me, I wold be very surprised if we were affected. Underwood only if he is explicitly involved, which I don't see happening.
 
#840      
Chris Yates
IlliniJim20 said:
Lack of institutional control wold not apply to us since he was at OSU.
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Do you mean to suggest that Illinois isn't responsible for providing institutional control over the Oklahoma State program?! :eek:
 
#841      
sbillini
mattcoldagelli said:
Really?
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not the kids, but I wouldn't mind the parents getting caught up. Some parents who risk their own kids' future for some cash (esp. considering for many of these kids/parents, the potential cash upside is huge if they just wait a few years) is greed that I would say is beyond criminal.

The Cliff Alexander story is a perfect example.
 
#842      
Obelix
Once you allow the shoe companies and their agents to pretty much run the AAU showcase tournaments and the AAU showcase programs, you pretty much open the door wide open for this to happen. You are destroying the AAU structure and organization, which has nothing to do with the shoe companies. Once you allow the shoe companies to have complete control of the athletic levels below college (in addition to already having control on the levels above) this would happen and continue to happen even if you punish every single person involved. Corruption will just resurrect in a different form.
 
#843      
Obelix
sbillini said:
not the kids, but I wouldn't mind the parents getting caught up. Some parents who risk their own kids' future for some cash (esp. considering for many of these kids/parents, the potential cash upside is huge if they just wait a few years) is greed that I would say is beyond criminal.

The Cliff Alexander story is a perfect example.
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Parents and players are pawns in all of this, the least responsible parties.
 
#844      
KrushCow31
miketherevelator said:
Head coaches always know what is going on in their programs, he coached with or over Evans for years. How could he not know what the man was like?
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Actually Underwood coached with Evans for 1 year at South Carolina, 1 year at KState and then hired him at OSU, where they coached together for less than 1 year, and had a recruiting class resulting in two 3 star recruits. I hardly count the KState year as Evans was just starting out. I don't think it's fair to say he has coached with or over Evans for years, since there is a 3 year gap, and most of the South Carolina issues seemed to have occurred after Underwood left.
 
#845      
sbillini
Obelix said:
Parents and players are pawns in all of this, the least responsible parties.
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Players yes. Parents, in many cases, hardly. Again, the FBI discussed two investigations. In one, yes maybe the parents were unaware. In the second, what they're doing is arguable worse than what the coaches are (given that it's their own kids).
 
#847      
Obelix
sbillini said:
Players yes. Parents, in many cases, hardly. Again, the FBI discussed two investigations. In one, yes maybe the parents were unaware. In the second, what they're doing is arguable worse than what the coaches are (given that it's their own kids).
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Parents are as much pawns in this entire things as are the players. You have to look at the source, not the result.
 
#848      
Illiini
Obelix said:
Corruption will just resurrect in a different form.
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Yeppers. Catch and punish those who are in the system if the system overall provides maximum benefits. Will you have cheaters and crooks? Of course you will. Just as you'll always have sexual predators worming their way (perhaps a poor metaphor, but accurate) into associating with children.
 
#849      
aluma
So far the only connection that's been made to cash bribes has been money funneled from shoe companies, agents, etc... to coaches and student athletes. I'd be curious how much $ is funneled from boosters to players. Probably a lot harder to track though.
 
#850      
sbillini
Obelix said:
Parents are as much pawns in this entire things as are the players. You have to look at the source, not the result.
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"Kim described what him and his team have uncovered as, "coaches at some of the nation's top programs taking cash bribes, managers and advisers circling blue-chip prospects like coyotes, and employees of a global sportswear company funneling cash to families of high school recruits.""


On what planet do you not give the parents any culpability in this????? Pass me some of whatever you're smoking, cuz I'd be a much happier person then.
 
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