Illini Basketball 2020-2021

Status
Not open for further replies.
#176      
Illini Farmer
Ga65 said:
Trying to ascertain how much our orange lens are affecting our judgement of the talent on this team I took the starters from 1988-89 and 2004-05 and made a lineup. Result was Dee, Deron, Ayo, Nick, and Kofi. No one else made the second team. I am sure others will have different opinions and our frosh might be considered very differently by time they leave. Hopefully the rest will be considered differently by the end of the season. (Did think Nick Anderson would be great as the 4th guard.)
Click to expand...
I would absolutely put Kendall Gill or Kenny Battle in that lineup over Dee.
 
#177      
Retro62
Emerson Bigguns said:
I totally agree on Kofi. If he plays with confidence and aggression on offense, he could very well become the most dominant center in the country.
Click to expand...

I’m cherry-picking this portion of your post, but in a good way...I hope. Pure speculation/conjecture, but Kofi must see the same thing you are suggesting. It’s not like all the talk about his improvement after only a few years of organized play; his upside and learning curve; not to mention being FOTY in the best conference in the country, is news to him. I truly believe he is going to come back with the sole purpose of dominating. The great thing is, he has the ability and we have the staff to ensure that happens...not to mention Ayo and a very good to great roster of teammates.
 
#178      
Ga65
Ayo is a great player and will make a difference but it is Kofi that will give us a consistently tough defense. No amount of skill replaces 7’ and 290#’s of athletic power.
 
#179      
billybaroo
Illini Farmer said:
I would absolutely put Kendall Gill or Kenny Battle in that lineup over Dee.
Click to expand...
I loved Dee, but have to agree, especially when you consider Dee was a shooting guard (mostly). At the very least, I'd put Kendall in over Ayo. He wasn't the closer that Ayo is, but was a more complete basketball player when he left the program. Kendall was a top 5 draft pick for a reason. :)
 
#180      
WeWillWhen
billybaroo said:
I loved Dee, but have to agree, especially when you consider Dee was a shooting guard (mostly). At the very least, I'd put Kendall in over Ayo. He wasn't the closer that Ayo is, but was a more complete basketball player when he left the program. Kendall was a top 5 draft pick for a reason. :)
Click to expand...
Kendall was a consensus second team All-American and the #5 pick in the 1990 NBA draft, whereas Ayo currently is a fringe 2nd rounder. Let's see where Ayo is in a year; right now he is quite a ways away from what Kendall achieved at Illinois.
 
#181      
altenberger22
billybaroo said:
I loved Dee, but have to agree, especially when you consider Dee was a shooting guard (mostly). At the very least, I'd put Kendall in over Ayo. He wasn't the closer that Ayo is, but was a more complete basketball player when he left the program. Kendall was a top 5 draft pick for a reason. :)
Click to expand...
A very interesting exercise and I agree it's totally subjective. Ayo could potentially crack the starting line-up with a superior junior season. However, I'm going with a starting 5 of:
G - Dee Brown
G - Deron Williams
G - Kendall Gill
F - Nick Anderson
C - Kofi Cockburn

We'd win 6 national titles out of every 10 played with this team. Nearly unstoppable!
 
#183      
ILLHangOut
#185      
billybaroo
ILLHangOut said:
Also, no mention of Brian Cook for these all time rosters? I think he deserves to be in the conversation.
Click to expand...
Nothing against Cookie, but I think the OP was pulling strictly from the 89, 05, and current rosters only.
 
#186      
illiniguy24
What is everyone expectations now as far as loss total? 3-5? 5-7? Given how tough the conference will be, and that we will have a handful of tough non conference games, I’m thinking 7 or 8 losses going into the BTT. 2 non conference L’s and 5-6 conference L’s. Which could be drinking kool aid
 
#187      
LouHenson
altenberger22 said:
A very interesting exercise and I agree it's totally subjective. Ayo could potentially crack the starting line-up with a superior junior season. However, I'm going with a starting 5 of:
G - Dee Brown
G - Deron Williams
G - Kendall Gill
F - Nick Anderson
C - Kofi Cockburn

We'd win 6 national titles out of every 10 played with this team. Nearly unstoppable!
Click to expand...

I love Dee, but with Deron to run the point I think it has to be:

1) Deron
2) Kendal
3) Nick
4) Kenny (no way he does not start)
5) Kofi

Then give me these three off the bench:

6) Kenny Norman
7) Eddie Johnson
8) DerIck Harper

that gives you 2 points (Deron and Derick)
2 shooting guards (Kendal and Nick)
2 small forwards (Eddie and Kenny)
2 power forwards (Kenny and Kenny)
2 Centers (Kofi and Norman)

Side note, I would of loved to have Lucas Johnson on the 2005 team. He would have gotten under the skin of May and made him lose his mind.

I know it is never “right” to say this but Sean Pruitt was on the 2005 team. When Augustine got his second foul, I would have put Pruitt In with one goal. Break Mays arm, I mean really hard foul. Sean was not going to play anyways so why not make the refs pucker up. If Sean got ejected so what?

The dome would have been wild and the refs would have changed at that moment what May was allowed to get away with. There were 45,000 crazy Illinois fans. I know it is wrong to think that way, but we needed the one sided interior officiating to change and that would have done it.
 
#188      
NV Illini
LouHenson said:
Side note, I would of loved to have Lucas Johnson on the 2005 team. He would have gotten under the skin of May and made him lose his mind.

I know it is never “right” to say this but Sean Pruitt was on the 2005 team. When Augustine got his second foul, I would have put Pruitt In with one goal. Break Mays arm, I mean really hard foul. Sean was not going to play anyways so why not make the refs pucker up. If Sean got ejected so what?

The dome would have been wild and the refs would have changed at that moment what May was allowed to get away with. There were 45,000 crazy Illinois fans. I know it is wrong to think that way, but we needed the one sided interior officiating to change and that would have done it.
Click to expand...
Great idea about Pruitt on May.

And Lucas was always a hefty thorn in the side of our opponents, and was always a motivator for our guys. Really fun to watch.
Does he have kids who play? Grandkids?!
 
#190      
sacraig
Goode-for-3 said:
UNDEFEATED.
Click to expand...

giphy.gif
 
#191      
Calvin
Retro62 said:
Kofi...I truly believe he is going to come back with the sole purpose of dominating.
Click to expand...

This may sound a bit strange, but I think the way for Kofi to dominate is to do less individually. Sure, he could work on his post play and positioning, but I think the way he dominates is to use his head more, draw players to him, see weaknesses in the opponent's D, and pass. I'd love if he got a touch nearly every time we're in the half-court.

I can't tell you how many times I watched him last season and thought how much deadlier he'd be if he could recognize when he's attracting too much attention and found a cutter or open man. Not trying to second guess his development in any way --he's been VERY efficient, tough around the bakset, and good with the ball generally. Just saying I think his arc to the NBA will take better recognition and passing.
 
#192      
Calvin
ILLHangOut said:
I hope Dee’s lack of NBA career isn’t causing anyone to forget what an amazing player he was for the Illini. No way I leave him off the all-time starting lineup.
Click to expand...


All true, but Dee isn't the only legendary PG that's worn the uniform. FWLIW, Deron is the only PG I'd take over HRF, and I don't want to show even a little disrespect to either. Just shows what a tough choice it is and how good we've had it as fans. All of them are deserving players.
 
#193      
RichBradIllini
Calvin said:
This may sound a bit strange, but I think the way for Kofi to dominate is to do less individually. Sure, he could work on his post play and positioning, but I think the way he dominates is to use his head more, draw players to him, see weaknesses in the opponent's D, and pass. I'd love if he got a touch nearly every time we're in the half-court.

I can't tell you how many times I watched him last season and thought how much deadlier he'd be if he could recognize when he's attracting too much attention and found a cutter or open man. Not trying to second guess his development in any way --he's been VERY efficient, tough around the bakset, and good with the ball generally. Just saying I think his arc to the NBA will take better recognition and passing.
Click to expand...

Agreed. I think this is where Kofi develops this year.
 
#194      
Fighter of the Nightman
battle said:
Comparisons are fun ... but its not fair to compare this group before the season begins to the 89 & 05 groups after their seasons ... March Kofi was way better than Nov Kofi. a better comparison would at similar points in the season. In Aug 1988: had just had two disappointing tourney finishes - Austin Peay in 87 and Villanova in 88 (we were 3 seed, had large lead, and missed 6 or 7 1-1s to blow it, shooting under 50% FT). Both 89 and 05 had high expectations going into seasons (Top 10) but both had questions and issues to be on top. Big 10 was stacked in 89. There were teams nationally just as good of returners, recruits, ... What is consistent between 89, 05 & 21 is all the articles (Tate was younger then) emphasized how hard they worked, how hungry they were, the intensity, and chemistry/working together from April-Nov and then in season Nov-April. I recall 1988 articles on Gill's workouts, Battle's ... they sound pretty similar in intensity to Ayo & Co 2020, last season and upcoming season. 89 & 05 had the opportunity to be special and they made it happen. 21 team has that chance, at this point that's all they and we can ask for.
Click to expand...

Good post. I also remember hearing that Dee, Deron and Luther shot something like 1,000 three point shots in a time span to get better at shooting so that they could make a run ... uh, 2021 squad, TAKE NOTE! Seriously, if our three point shooting improved a bit (which isn't that crazy with a junior Ayo, Frazier bouncing back a bit, Williams continuing to gain confidence and the new guys), this team would be SO scary to run into.
 
#195      
altenberger22
Fighter of the Nightman said:
Good post. I also remember hearing that Dee, Deron and Luther shot something like 1,000 three point shots in a time span to get better at shooting so that they could make a run ... uh, 2021 squad, TAKE NOTE! Seriously, if our three point shooting improved a bit (which isn't that crazy with a junior Ayo, Frazier bouncing back a bit, Williams continuing to gain confidence and the new guys), this team would be SO scary to run into.
Click to expand...
I seem to recall a Robbie Hummel interview years ago in which he said that figure (for him) was 1,000 shots per day during the off-season.
 
#196      
Mrflyinhi06
altenberger22 said:
A very interesting exercise and I agree it's totally subjective. Ayo could potentially crack the starting line-up with a superior junior season. However, I'm going with a starting 5 of:
G - Dee Brown
G - Deron Williams
G - Kendall Gill
F - Nick Anderson
C - Kofi Cockburn

We'd win 6 national titles out of every 10 played with this team. Nearly unstoppable!
Click to expand...
So do you think kofi is better than Myers Leonard?
 
#197      
RockfordIllini
Calvin said:
This may sound a bit strange, but I think the way for Kofi to dominate is to do less individually. Sure, he could work on his post play and positioning, but I think the way he dominates is to use his head more, draw players to him, see weaknesses in the opponent's D, and pass. I'd love if he got a touch nearly every time we're in the half-court.

I can't tell you how many times I watched him last season and thought how much deadlier he'd be if he could recognize when he's attracting too much attention and found a cutter or open man. Not trying to second guess his development in any way --he's been VERY efficient, tough around the bakset, and good with the ball generally. Just saying I think his arc to the NBA will take better recognition and passing.
Click to expand...

Agree. Nobody is going to feed Kofi in the post in today’s nba. He should focus on awareness/passing, screening and rolling to the rim, help defense/blocking shots, and grabbing every rebound in sight. A reliable jumper 18-20 feet as well. All doable.
 
#199      
Ga65
illini55 said:
Meyers gave us virtually nothing his freshman year. If that is the comparison, there is no comparison. If you're talking about potential, I think it's simply too early to tell.
Click to expand...
Per my memory there is no comparison as college players, Kofi is superior. Actually think Augustine was also.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back