Hawkins is not a good shooter. Actually shooting worse this year on every metric..
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Illini Basketball 2022-2023
- Status
I’m guessing some of that has to do with how he’s being used and shots he’s getting, but, yeah, he’s not a good shooter. Just another reason I think they’d be better off letting the PGs and TSJ initiate the offense on a regular basis. Put Hawk in positions where he’s a more efficient scorer — put backs, lobs and pick and rolls, and catch and shoot from the outside.
He's also addicted to pump faking. He passes up the open shots only to take much worse shots that he misses or to make a pass (sometimes a really bad one and unnecessary pass). He needs to keep it simple on offense and can't run the point as much. His defense will always keep him on the floor though as it should
JFGsCoffeeMug
BU:1 Trash cans:0
- Chicago
It drives me nuts how CoHawk pump fakes away his open shots just so he can struggle to find an open shot by trying unsuccessfully to take his defender off the dribble.
Expect in one hand and crap in the other, see which one fills up first . . .I expect this team to get the various issues ironed out in the next 2-3 games and be back in the top 25 by mid January....be in the mix for the B10 conference championship and make a run into the 2nd weekend of the nc2a tourney.....that's what I expect.....we'll see if that happens....but that's what I expect
blackdog
- Champaign
Easy scouting report. Close out hard with hands up but don't leave your feet and play for the drive. Until he actually starts to shoot on a closeout or just blow by them its just too easy to defend. Nobody is buying the pump fake and it gives the defender too much time to recover that its too late to drive after.
skyIdub
Winged Warrior
I'm not an insider, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night.
Also, I only have a privileged uvula. My dentist thinks it's fascinating.
I have a perfect cone of reflection.
BMoreIllini
- Baltimore, MD
I think Hawkins' TO rate is elevated because he'll see an opening or make a read that a teammate doesn't see. It'll look like Hawkins threw the ball away and he'll get the TO, but it's as much on the teammate that didn't make the right read or was just going through the motions (not cutting hard/looking for a pass). Much in the same way that sometimes an interception is the fault of a WR, but the stat is applied to the QB.
BU has mentioned Hawkins' high basketball IQ and how his teammates need to get on the same level or at least make the same reads. I'd bet that at least 1 TO per game were due to a teammate not making the same read. ~4 TO/game is still higher than I'd like, but he's still getting used to this new role at game speed.
BU has mentioned Hawkins' high basketball IQ and how his teammates need to get on the same level or at least make the same reads. I'd bet that at least 1 TO per game were due to a teammate not making the same read. ~4 TO/game is still higher than I'd like, but he's still getting used to this new role at game speed.
We're gonna make the tournament. Breathe.
Yeh, you're probably right. Can't get that one game outta my head.
There is plenty of blame to be shared for the recent poor play by this team....alot of discussion on who should get more PT, and who shouldn't ......seems like we have relied on the 3pt shot a great deal, especially in games that we struggle offensively....I would like to see Danj get more time on the floor...he gives us a presence in the middle that Hawkins or Mayer can not or haven't given us to this point...I know he's somewhat limited offensively and can't shoot FT's ....but his presence in the middle (if used properly) could improve our 3pt shooting %.....very seldom does the ball go inside the paint, and then kicked back out to someone on the perimeter for a 3pt attempt...Danj is quick enough to make a decent post move and get to the rim if the defense doesn't collapse on him...if they do then kick it back out for the 3pt attempt....this may end with the same results, but it's something we haven't seen much of to this point ....I would like to see a little more of this
Alot to unpack with this post.
To keep it simple, these 2 statements both point to what BU has admitted previously that coaching needs to improve
....Right now we are too one dimensional as I view the games..
....BU is a much better coach than our players are showing..
Breathing fine. I am watching a dumpster fire right now unless there is major reset.
Over a thrid of the season is over. Our first 4 BT games are pretty much toss ups and that is the easier part of schedule.
We have dropped to a 7 seed in most mock brackets. At large teams are in the 28-40 range so we are now in free fall and on thin ice.
We are now projected to only be 19-12 and 10-10 in KenPom.
Exact same record as PSU who already bit$% slapped us.
The BT this year is Purdue and a bunch of teams who will win between 8 and 11 league games and it is not a good league.
Any other questions?
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Yes…he has done that for at least 2 years that I know of. Rather than reacting to
what the defense often gives him on a silver platter. He tends to:
1. Pump fake when he has a good open look AND should shoot. But doesn’t.
2. Looking right at the gap, having an open driving lane. BUT instead waiting till they recover and THEN seemingly saying: “you know what I waited too long, but heck I’m gonna put it on the floor anyway.” That usually doesn’t work out. I like CH but he is not that kind of player.
3. Immediately from the get-go, putting the ball on the floor(especially last year) usually with a defender right up in his grill…but not using his dribble with any kind of purpose…(one quick step and blowing by for example) rather he is aimless with it…and waists the dribble altogether.
He CAN BE an excellent passer at times. But if he can’t score he can’t be a truly effective passer…at least not consistently.
Exactly my observations over 2.5 years.
Edit:…WASTES the dribble
Dadgum it.
Fighter of the Nightman
- Chicago, IL
What would we even all consider a "successful season" at this point in this bizarre roller coaster? 
After beating #2 Texas, we were 7-2 with one of the best resumes in the country and a virtual lock for the top 10 if we just took care of PSU at home. Now, we are 8-4 (not that different from a record perspective) with three straight "puzzling" games, including a beatdown on our home floor just after our "height" and an embarrassing, heartless loss to arguably our biggest rival at Braggin' Rights.
Would fans be happy with a 7-seed and a team playing its best basketball by the end of the season? Are there still enough that think if the "intangible" issues get fixed we (clearly) have the talent to get red hot in conference play and compete for another banner and a high seed? Would that accomplishment mean enough to our fans if we lose in the Second Round for the third straight year? Either way, I just want to point out that we have been in comparable situations before in seasons that ended up turning out pretty well!
2021-22: Started off 2-2 to drop out of the top 25 with a loss to Cincinnati that was about equally as disheartening as the PSU loss, if not quite as bad as Missouri this year. We also had a pretty pathetic scare vs. UT-Rio Grande Valley at home, similar to this year's Alabama A&M episode but arguably worse. We obviously went on to get back into the top 15 toward the end of the season and win our first Big Ten Championship since 2005!
2020-21: While not QUITE as low as we are now, let's not forget that after two straight home losses (including one to a bad Maryland team) where we looked totally disengaged in both, we fell to #22 (which is where we are now in the Coaches' Poll) with a 9-5 (5-3) record and arguably ZERO overly impressive wins, as Duke had shown its true colors ... we were playing like a 7-seed. We finished the year winning 14 of our next 15 games before the NCAA Tournament, earning us a #1 seed and a BTT title.
2019-20: After losing to Mizzou yet again, we were 8-4 (same record as this year) heading into the holidays ... except we didn't have the wins we do this year. We remained a somewhat streaky team, but by the time the BTT was cancelled, we were primed to enter the top 20 and were likely playing for a 4-seed in the BTT ... I think most fans thought we'd be lucky to be on the right side of the Bubble after the Mizzou loss.
2003-04: While our record after dropping two straight to Purdue at home and on the road vs. a terrible Northwestern team was still 10-4 (1-2), I remember that people were feeling quite low at this point in the Weber Era. We won a close game vs. a mediocre Iowa team at home and followed it up by beating a lowly PSU in Champaign ... and then we got demolished at Wisconsin by 20 to fall to 12-5 (3-3) and unranked. We would go on to win 12 in a row before losing to Wisconsin again in the BTT final, and we would then make the Sweet Sixteen as a 5-seed.
2001-02: The timing is a bit different, but this actually seems like a very similar situation. This team started off ranked highly and picked up a huge win vs. #8 Mizzou at Braggin' Rights. While ranked #7, we lost twice on the road to Wisconsin and a very bad Purdue team. After winning three home games, we then got SMOKED at Indiana by 31, lost handily at Ohio State and dropped a home game to MSU in Champaign, all three in a row, to drop to 15-7 (4-5). The team would respond by winning 9 of 10 before March Madness to both earn a 4-seed and a share of the Big Ten Championship. We would also make the Sweet Sixteen and almost knock of #2/1-seed Kansas.
This team might crash and burn, but the point here is to say there is nothing that has been written in stone about this season. One thing is for sure - if they don't solve the alleged chemistry and/or focus issues, all the talent in the world won't make a difference. The good news is that we DO have enough talent to turn this thing around (that has been evidenced THIS YEAR by incredible wins already, this is not based off of subjective rankings), and we have a coaching staff that has proven itself in this conference before.
I'm not sure what will happen, but I'm going to try to believe that Mizzou was rock bottom. I think it might have served as a wakeup call for Brad and the staff that these guys might need a different approach than Ayo or Trent Frazier needed. I'm hopeful that they can craft this group into a functioning team and right the ship ... because there is more than enough time to have a great season, and we have the pieces without a doubt. We just need to put the pieces together. We should win our next game, even if we see a somewhat predictable hangover from the Mizzou embarrassment. I hope we can work through some issues, because the game in Evanston very well could be a true turning point, for better or for worse, on this season.
After beating #2 Texas, we were 7-2 with one of the best resumes in the country and a virtual lock for the top 10 if we just took care of PSU at home. Now, we are 8-4 (not that different from a record perspective) with three straight "puzzling" games, including a beatdown on our home floor just after our "height" and an embarrassing, heartless loss to arguably our biggest rival at Braggin' Rights.Would fans be happy with a 7-seed and a team playing its best basketball by the end of the season? Are there still enough that think if the "intangible" issues get fixed we (clearly) have the talent to get red hot in conference play and compete for another banner and a high seed? Would that accomplishment mean enough to our fans if we lose in the Second Round for the third straight year? Either way, I just want to point out that we have been in comparable situations before in seasons that ended up turning out pretty well!
2021-22: Started off 2-2 to drop out of the top 25 with a loss to Cincinnati that was about equally as disheartening as the PSU loss, if not quite as bad as Missouri this year. We also had a pretty pathetic scare vs. UT-Rio Grande Valley at home, similar to this year's Alabama A&M episode but arguably worse. We obviously went on to get back into the top 15 toward the end of the season and win our first Big Ten Championship since 2005!
2020-21: While not QUITE as low as we are now, let's not forget that after two straight home losses (including one to a bad Maryland team) where we looked totally disengaged in both, we fell to #22 (which is where we are now in the Coaches' Poll) with a 9-5 (5-3) record and arguably ZERO overly impressive wins, as Duke had shown its true colors ... we were playing like a 7-seed. We finished the year winning 14 of our next 15 games before the NCAA Tournament, earning us a #1 seed and a BTT title.
2019-20: After losing to Mizzou yet again, we were 8-4 (same record as this year) heading into the holidays ... except we didn't have the wins we do this year. We remained a somewhat streaky team, but by the time the BTT was cancelled, we were primed to enter the top 20 and were likely playing for a 4-seed in the BTT ... I think most fans thought we'd be lucky to be on the right side of the Bubble after the Mizzou loss.
2003-04: While our record after dropping two straight to Purdue at home and on the road vs. a terrible Northwestern team was still 10-4 (1-2), I remember that people were feeling quite low at this point in the Weber Era. We won a close game vs. a mediocre Iowa team at home and followed it up by beating a lowly PSU in Champaign ... and then we got demolished at Wisconsin by 20 to fall to 12-5 (3-3) and unranked. We would go on to win 12 in a row before losing to Wisconsin again in the BTT final, and we would then make the Sweet Sixteen as a 5-seed.
2001-02: The timing is a bit different, but this actually seems like a very similar situation. This team started off ranked highly and picked up a huge win vs. #8 Mizzou at Braggin' Rights. While ranked #7, we lost twice on the road to Wisconsin and a very bad Purdue team. After winning three home games, we then got SMOKED at Indiana by 31, lost handily at Ohio State and dropped a home game to MSU in Champaign, all three in a row, to drop to 15-7 (4-5). The team would respond by winning 9 of 10 before March Madness to both earn a 4-seed and a share of the Big Ten Championship. We would also make the Sweet Sixteen and almost knock of #2/1-seed Kansas.
This team might crash and burn, but the point here is to say there is nothing that has been written in stone about this season. One thing is for sure - if they don't solve the alleged chemistry and/or focus issues, all the talent in the world won't make a difference. The good news is that we DO have enough talent to turn this thing around (that has been evidenced THIS YEAR by incredible wins already, this is not based off of subjective rankings), and we have a coaching staff that has proven itself in this conference before.
I'm not sure what will happen, but I'm going to try to believe that Mizzou was rock bottom. I think it might have served as a wakeup call for Brad and the staff that these guys might need a different approach than Ayo or Trent Frazier needed. I'm hopeful that they can craft this group into a functioning team and right the ship ... because there is more than enough time to have a great season, and we have the pieces without a doubt. We just need to put the pieces together. We should win our next game, even if we see a somewhat predictable hangover from the Mizzou embarrassment. I hope we can work through some issues, because the game in Evanston very well could be a true turning point, for better or for worse, on this season.
Not Making Madness... Grade F
Make Tournament But Lose First Game... D-Minus.
Win Only One Game... D
Sweet Sixteen... B
Elite Eight... A- Minus
Final Four... A
Beyond That... A-Plus.
Overview: Seeing growth with all the young talent and seeing the Vets maximize what they've got.
Seeing Coach smiling a lot and not looking so frustrated.
Watching the Players get hot on the floor and watching the Coach get less hot under the collar.
There's always over-reactions on a fan forum, but I think objectively this team is in trouble, at least if you want to compete for the conference title and a good seed (top 4). And if you use the eye test, I think they're in bigger trouble than their record, which is pretty decent given the good SoS.
If the recent stretch of games doesn't alarm you, I don't know what to say. 15 point loss at home to PSU, and what should have been a bounce back turned into utter destruction at the hands of Mizzou. The problems don't look like minor fixable issues, either --lot of fundamentals look off to my eye on things like close-outs, inside help, and knowing where to be generally. The lack of close-outs against PSU was particularly bad given that should have been one of the top items on the scouting list. Every team has a bad game or two, but the depth of the problems is concerning.
Regardless, the team has a lot of talent and a good coach that's willing to adapt. Just need to figure it out.
Fighter of the Nightman
- Chicago, IL
I think this is a pretty steep scale! Haha. While I would grow concerned if 1-2 more "early" losses occurred with Underwood teams before the Sweet Sixteen, the Tournament is a crapshoot. Our 2020-21 team was honestly playing at a National Championship level before the Loyola loss; rewind time and replay that game, and we just might win and cut down the nets instead of Baylor. We'll never know! So, my grading scale would depend a lot more on what we have done to put ourselves in a position to make a run in March, even if it for some reason does not happen. Additionally, I will be pretty forgiving in simply recognizing the unfortunate reality of where we are right now mentally after the PSU and Mizzou losses ... I think I'd go:
A+: Big Ten/BTT banner in the regular season and a run past the Sweet Sixteen (Elite Eight+)
A: Big Ten/BTT banner in the regular season and a Sweet Sixteen
A-: We rebound to have a good Big Ten season (with no banner) but catch some breaks in March Madness and make the Sweet Sixteen
B+: We never regain our "top 25" status but we remain a dangerous team that sneaks into the Sweet Sixteen with a good draw (like 2022 Michigan)
B: We win the BTT and earn a top 4 seed but lose in the Second Round again
B-: We rebound to be a top 4 Big Ten team, likely ranked again, but lose in the First Round
C+: Make the Tournament easily due to the non-conference wins and being "okay" in the Big Ten but we're a paper tiger that loses early (First/Second Round)
C: Tread water and make the Tournament with a high seed (8+) but we're playing bad basketball by the end of the year and we lose early (First/Second Round)
C-: Scrap our way into the Tournament as a high seed and lose in the First Round
D: Miss the Tournament while on the Bubble
F: Not even come close to making the Tournament
As you can see, while I acknowledge that the Tournament is a crapshoot ... I am indeed prioritizing it over regular season success this season, given the past two March Madness results for this program. To get an A of any kind, we must be in the Sweet Sixteen AND have a "good" regular season, and we must make the Sweet Sixteen PERIOD to even get a B+. A "third place in the Big Ten but ranked #20 and earned a 4-seed!" season that ends in the Second Round? Meh. Even my B involves us hanging a banner for the BTT, but another Second Round loss effectively erases that.
The bolded is the most concerning. If we lost to a mediocre PSU team at home like we did in 2006 (the McBride buzzer beater that wasn't) and lost by 10 to a red-hot, much-improved Mizzou team that couldn't miss from three at Braggin' Rights to drop to 8-4 ... nobody would be THAT concerned on the surface, given our "resume on paper" to-date.
However, the WAY in which we lost to Penn State, fresh off beating #2 Texas on a neutral court, rightfully caused many to feel alarmed. Many more like me brushed it off as "just an off-day," and we moved on. I did not watch the Alabama A&M game, but it sounds like it was pretty underwhelming for a 21-point win, and we saw a lot of the same issues with lethargy and whatnot. I attended the game vs. Mizzou, however, and holy smokes ... talk about a team getting punched directly in the mouth and lying down. The atmosphere before tip (with Mizzou actually filling up their side this year) was electric, and it was almost astonishing how quickly half the arena was silenced for most of the rest of the game. I'll give our fans a TON of credit, too - it might have been the Holiday Season booze acting up here, but we were READY to cheer our team toward a comeback! However, every time we showed a sign of life, we'd let Mizzou hit a wide open three or give up a dunk in the lane with no defender in sight; it was a COMPLETELY deflating loss.
So yeah, the way in which we have LOOKED the last three games seems to be what is concerning, and that is WAY more concerning than having a "bad record" but looking good ... because our "good resume" will be gone like dust in the wind if we don't turn things around quickly. Like I said above, the game at Northwestern REALLY is a must-win.
Unfortunately he is still hurt...
Basketball is a game of streaks. Always has been, always will be. During the Game... hot shooting, cold shooting... And during the Season the same quality for most teams. Stretches where you are humming right along and other times when you look lost.
Unless you are one of the tiny handful of Overwhelming Power Clubs like those who only lose a couple times a year... everyone else goes through cycles. And what is at heart of those cycles? As a Team, you are not as good as you look in your very best games and you are not as bad as how you look in your worst ones. The Illini have not hit their water table level yet to know what their baseline truly is.
But what is important is the Trend Line. Not letting your bad play become habits and lot letting bad attitudes creep into the Locker Room or the Team Huddles. Keep building on the 'Good'.
The Big Ten is always a dogfight and everyone is beating each other up. So sometimes its hard to sustain success with that kind of street brawling in League. But again... watch the Team TREND LINE.
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