Illini Basketball 2025-2026

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#51      
RabidDawgClassic
ChiefGritty said:
Boy, I dunno. MJ is their only two-time NPOY, was unanimous NPOY his final year (only Antawn Jamison and Tyler Hansbrough have done that), hit the game winning shot to win a national title, and he's Michael Jordan


It's always going to be a no from me because I think guys who were here longer had a bigger impact.

But I just want to say it's crazy to me that you don't even mention Dee Brown on that list. He's the GOAT for me. Go be Steph Curry this week and make that an argument, Keaton.
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Dee Brown was amazing and was the energetic face of the program at that time. But I’m a firm believer that Deron Williams’ presence elevated Dee in stature much in the same way he did Bracey Wright at the Colony HS. Wright was the “star” of that team, but when he got to Indiana without Deron, his star shined less brightly. Deron was one of those unique players that made everyone around him that much better.
 
#52      
hangdog
RabidDawgClassic said:
Dee Brown was amazing and was the energetic face of the program at that time. But I’m a firm believer that Deron Williams’ presence elevated Dee in stature much in the same way he did Bracey Wright at the Colony HS. Wright was the “star” of that team, but when he got to Indiana without Deron, his star shined less brightly. Deron was one of those unique players that made everyone around him that much better.
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Totally agree. Deron is the Illini all time great, followed closely by Gill.
 
#53      
21ChampaignSt
For me, in these greatest Illini ever conversations, longevity matters. I hate to hold his one and done status against him but I can't elevate him to the all time face of Illini basketball because of it. And I understand "face of the program" might be a little different from "greatest". Just my take on it.
 
#55      
Battle89
hangdog said:
He has now replaced Dee as my favorite.
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I, like most here (at least among the oldsters), have purchased dozens of pieces of orange and blue gear over my 40-year fandom. Still have stuff in my closet from college days.

Of all those pieces, never once have I had a player's name on my back. I had my favorites, sure - you can see a picture of the 2005 one in my avatar and see the 1989 one in my user name. But for me it was always 'the name on the front, not on the back'.

But I bought a Wagler shirt this year. Once-in-a-lifetime unicorn, that guy is. Superstar and an EDG, he earned it.
 
#56      
CrazedUIFan
If you look at the likes of Deron, Dee, Gill, and Wagler, it’s difficult to say who is the greatest Illini. In most cases, they have had an amazing supporting cast that has allowed them to be able to flourish and showcase their talent. In addition to that, they have had a team with an extremely likable personality. What a great discussion and I hope we get to debate this on Tuesday.
 
#58      
Battle89
Illini2010-11 said:
If Wagler goes on a Mackey Special on Monday and the Illini win, there is likely to be a statue built of him built in the trophy room of State Farm Center.

With that said, it is really hard to say greatest ever because of context. For this generation of Illini, Ayo was the beginning of this extended stretch of success. Without him, are we where we are today? Furthermore the landscape of the game has changed greatly in the last decade. For that reason, each of the above members of the Illini will always hold a special place in the hearts and minds of Illini young and old. However, if Wagler is the ultimate 1 and done at Illinois, he will definitely be in consideration for the best to wear the jersey.
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Both sides of the debate have merit, for sure. I'm just saying that those three little words from the original poster will override a whole lot of other great stuff from great players in past years. I'd bet even some here saying the opposite would change their minds in the delirium.

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#59      
Rad
I graduated from U of I in ‘ 87 (4 years orange crush). I have a lot of favorites including D Williams, K Gill, N Anderson, D Brown, E Winters, D Thomas…..but Kenny Battle in my mind was transformative in what he brought from an effort, ability and psychological standpoint to the ‘89 team. I am amazed by what Wagler has been able to do and to bring this team to where we are but Mirk is now that dude for me.
 
#62      
RichardKeenesCousin
RabidDawgClassic said:
Let’s say, for argument’s sake, that Wagler goes on to become the next Michael Jordan. That would now beg the question “is Michael Jordan the greatest Tar Heel ever?” Certainly his time at UNC was exceptional and he hit the game winner in the 1982 natty game. But does that make him the greatest Tar Heel? Most notable, sure, but there were many before and after him that — based only on their time in Chapel Hill — could claim greater Tar Heel success.

Would one season and a natty for Wagler out do the Illini accomplishments of Kendall Gill, Nick Anderson, Deron Williams, Deon Thomas, Kiwanis Garris, Malcolm Hill… all of which who would have considerably less hardware than Wagler, but more years and tangible records than him?

For the record, I don’t have the answers to these question. But let’s hope this debate grows legs in the coming days and weeks and years.
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swoon goes GIF
 
#63      
ChiefGritty
RabidDawgClassic said:
Dee Brown was amazing and was the energetic face of the program at that time. But I’m a firm believer that Deron Williams’ presence elevated Dee in stature much in the same way he did Bracey Wright at the Colony HS. Wright was the “star” of that team, but when he got to Indiana without Deron, his star shined less brightly. Deron was one of those unique players that made everyone around him that much better.
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I get it, and there was this argument even at the time, before Deron's pro and international success which adds to the luster of him in some sense being the superior talent.

But Dee was first team AA, Dee was BTPOY, Dee won a NPOY, Bob Cousy Award, he had more points, more wins, he was Mr. Basketball in the state of Illinois, he was on the cover of Sports Illustrated.

It's not the same question as "who is the most excellent player to wear O&B", I understand (and I think Dee has a case there to be clear, there are two ends of a basketball floor), but I tend to think of it more as "if Illinois Basketball is one guy, who is it?" and that's Dee Brown.
 
#64      
IlliniKat91
hiberto said:
according to his LinkedIn Greg went to MSU so not sure why he's a Michigan fan
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He gave the background in a video.

His parents are Michigan grads and raised him as a Michigan fan. He got into both Michigan and MSU. But when he went to visit Ann Arbor, he thought the people were too stuck up to go to school with and decided to go to MSU instead

That story always amuses me. Being too stuck up for even a life long fan feels like peak Michigan to me.
 
#65      
skyIdub
All of the ancillary things that surround this debate make it almost impossible to conclude.
Dee was a four year player because of his size and the era.
He will always be “the face” of Illinois Basketball.

if Wagler were to be at least three year Illini it is nearly concrete he would surpass that.
Face, draft, stats….whatever metric you want.
 
#66      
wc_illini
IlliniKat91 said:
He gave the background in a video.

His parents are Michigan grads and raised him as a Michigan fan. He got into both Michigan and MSU. But when he went to visit Ann Arbor, he thought the people were too stuck up to go to school with and decided to go to MSU instead

That story always amuses me. Being too stuck up for even a life long fan feels like peak Michigan to me.
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Replace MSU with Illinois, and that's my story

(edit: and I grew up rooting for UM to annoy my Dad who was an Ohio St fan. Fortunately now we're both just Illinois fans)
 
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#67      
mysterio2525
wc_illini said:
Replace MSU with Illinois, and that's my story

(edit: and I grew up rooting for UM to annoy my Dad who was an Ohio St fan. Fortunately now we're both just Illinois fans)
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well u of I is much better a school than MSU. so you made the right choice! regardless of school you clearly have a high level of intelligence from your posts!

I'm not buying the "I got into Michigan but chose to go to MSU" story but hey whatever. if he grew up Michigan fans, he can be a fan of Michigan.
 
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#68      
Second place is 1st loser
Is he the greatest Illini ever if we win the national championship?
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No. This team has been the epitome of a team. We have a lot of really, really good players that have accepted their roles, which is extremely rare in the portal era. Keaton gets the volume of shots, but where are we without Drej in this tournament? Where are we without Mirk or ANY of the bigs that just by being in the paint effects games? Where would we beat without the effort guys that chase down long rebounds?

Keaton has been a GREAT player, but the credit goes to Brad for making these pieces fit perfectly and for having guys accept roles that they probably didn't intend to have(Drej).
 
#69      
Second place is 1st loser
If Wagler goes on a Mackey Special on Monday and the Illini win, there is likely to be a statue built of him built in the trophy room of State Farm Center.

With that said, it is really hard to say greatest ever because of context. For this generation of Illini, Ayo was the beginning of this extended stretch of success. Without him, are we where we are today? Furthermore the landscape of the game has changed greatly in the last decade. For that reason, each of the above members of the Illini will always hold a special place in the hearts and minds of Illini young and old. However, if Wagler is the ultimate 1 and done at Illinois, he will definitely be in consideration for the best to wear the jersey.
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If Wagler goes on one Mackey special in the National Championship game(and we win) and has a 25/10/8 in the Final Four.....that obviously changes things. As we sit here today, he's an amazing player that fits with a team that really embraced their roles, which is almost impossible to find these days.
 
#70      
Orange Roughy
1970 John said:
I think the best without a doubt is IlliniInquirer, Jeremy has put together a great crew as evidenced by where the guys he’s graduated on to other things.

Jeremy and company are unabashedly Illini but the reporting is fair, though just from an Illinois fan perspective. And I think—I know—that my wife has a mom crush on Kyle.

It’s more than a vlog, however. Check out the website.

And no, I wasn’t paid to write this.
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I love that podcast too.

However, I also like the "I on the Illini" (Illini Guys) podcast as well. It is run by Mike Cagley and has Kedrick Prince, Brad Sturdy , and Marcus Griffin on it as well. Often have great guest (recently Eddie Johnson, Geoff Alexander, etc.) too.

Both are great content and I often post links to them when appropriate.
 
#72      
ChiefGritty
Just wanted to add, Andy Philip has a pretty strong case for the GOAT. As does Ray Woods. Both three-time All-Americans who played for the best team in the country that for different reasons were denied the opportunity to play in an NCAA tournament.

The University of Illinois has excelled at basketball for about as long as basketball has existed.
 
#73      
the juiceman cometh
The "greatest" question is interesting in this context because, while it's definitely odd to consider that status for a one-year player, a college basketball player's career is already going to be short by definition. So to be the driving force behind a national championship, for a program that has never had one, definitely carries more weight. I still probably go with saying the greatest Illini has to be someone who played longer, but it's close.

It'll all be moot though when Mirk definitively claims the title by staying on for his full four years, with one natty under his belt and a second one before he leaves, and breaks a bunch of records along the way.
 
#74      
ChiefGritty
the juiceman cometh said:
So to be the driving force behind a national championship, for a program that has never had one, definitely carries more weight.
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Carmelo Anthony being the archetype of a tradition-rich basketball program whose consensus GOAT was a one-and-done.

That's in play for Keaton. An incredible thing to say out loud. But two more wins are non-negotiable.
 
#75      
Hessel Blvd
Watching Sleepers is like talking the game with your sports obsessed friends. Are they always good takes? Not by a long shot. But it is a fun way to pass the time.

I've always enjoyed them, and they're one is the few podcasts I follow that are clean enough for me to listen to at work. Win in my book
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yeah, not analysis. I guess entertaining if your into people just being wrong about basketball alot?
People won't stop making clickbait until you stop clicking.
 
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