Illini Coaching Staff

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Deleted member 186590

D
Guest
Deleted member 186590
Second and Chalmers said:
The greatest physicists in the world couldn't split hairs that small. We french kissed the ring with Parham. It got us ZERO. Probably set us back, really, because now we've normalized that Illinois owes them something.
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It's a mistake to compare Parham to Chin, as others have pointed out. In terms of how Chicago coaches view them it's not comparable. Think about someone you grew up with, from the same streets, that you've been through battles with and would trust your children with and you know would always have your back and would have your kids' back through thick and thin.

Then think about a co-worker who worked at your company for 3 years.

It doesn't take a physicist to tell the difference.
 
#1,652      

Obelix

Obelix
Obelix
illiniinhoosierland said:
"Always underpay when you have a chance. It never causes problems."

- Mike Holder, Oklahoma State AD*




*quote may be entirely fabricated
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Then, when that strategy fails, always overpay to avoid additional backlash.

- Mike Holder, Oklahoma State AD*




*quote may be entirely fabricated
 
#1,654      

skyIdub

skyIdub
Winged Warrior
skyIdub
Obelix said:
Then, when that strategy fails, always overpay to avoid additional backlash.

- Mike Holder, Oklahoma State AD*




*quote may be entirely fabricated
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60% of the time it works every time.

- Sex Panther*


*entirely fabricated
 
#1,655      

EJ33

E
San Francisco
EJ33
Keys to recruiting Chicago:

1) Win
2) Get players to the NBA
3) Build relationships

#1 and #2 matter a lot more than #3.

#3 without #1 and #2 get you second place finishes.

#1 and #2 are straight from Robert Smith's mouth on the Tay & Jay show.
 
#1,656      

Cradlock

Cradlock
C-U
Cradlock
Henson71 said:
I think people are underrating the Chin hire (maybe even BU is if he really wanted Martin first). It's literally the first time the state's flagship University has hired the "one of us" Chicago coaches the city has been clamoring for for decades. Parham coached 3 years in Chicago, but wasn't from there, Jerrance played in Chicago, but never coached there. All the Chicago HS and AAU coaches want to know that the UofI has their back and this is a step to demonstrate that.
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When did Jerrance play in Chicago? I guess he probably played in tournaments.
 
#1,658      

Ubermensch

Ubermensch
BOOM! Feed my ego.
Ubermensch
Henson71 said:
I think people are underrating the Chin hire (maybe even BU is if he really wanted Martin first). It's literally the first time the state's flagship University has hired the "one of us" Chicago coaches the city has been clamoring for for decades. Parham coached 3 years in Chicago, but wasn't from there, Jerrance played in Chicago, but never coached there. All the Chicago HS and AAU coaches want to know that the UofI has their back and this is a step to demonstrate that.
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There's what we fans say about Paris Parham/Chin Coleman and then there's what these actual "Chicago coaches" say about Paris Parham/Chin Coleman.

"Smith, who coaches nationally-ranked seniors Jabari Parker and Kendrick Nunn, had a similar reaction."

"I think they finally may have won over Chicago with that hire," Simeon coach Robert Smith said. "I think they did. I think he can really help with what they’re trying to do. He knows the city of Chicago. He has the same views I have. We’ve been friends for over 20 years and not just basketball."

http://www.espn.com/blog/chicago/colleges/post/_/id/6267/area-coaches-parham-good-hire-for-illini

This isn't to say Coleman can't be Jimmy Collins or that he wasn't the right hire. The proof is in the pudding, however. Because we've heard this stuff before. Hopefully Coleman is the right hire in order for UI to get back in with Chicago's top kids, but I don't just assume it. Show me. Talk is cheap.
 
#1,661      

mattcoldagelli

mattcoldagelli
The Transfer Portal
mattcoldagelli
EJ33 said:
Keys to recruiting Chicago:

1) Win
2) Get players to the NBA
3) Build relationships

#1 and #2 matter a lot more than #3.

#3 without #1 and #2 get you second place finishes.

#1 and #2 are straight from Robert Smith's mouth on the Tay & Jay show.
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Honestly, you can take the view that many in-state coaches have been polite when volunteering all manner of reasons for why we couldn't close the deal with their players over the last 10 years.

If they were being honest, the answer to the question "Why didn't X choose Illinois?" is "Because Illinois sucks right now."
 
#1,662      

Second and Chalmers

S
Second and Chalmers
mattcoldagelli said:
It's reasonable to have "keep staff intact" as your starting point, because like you said, if you're buying their past successes, try to get what earned said successes.

But this can only ever be a starting point.
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And that plan got blown to smithereens due to factors totally beyond Underwood or Whitman's control. I'm bummed about that, but it isn't Chin Coleman's fault that OSU hired Mike Boynton.

I don't know if anyone here watched the KU-OSU game in Stillwater in early March, but that was just from a pure entertainment perspective the best game I watched all year. OSU lost 90-85, and allowed 55% shooting to KU (Frank Mason was incandescent), but offensively they were just a symphony of aggressive but precisely executed and fearless basketball. Plus the crowd were up for it and OSU has a great venue, it was just everything college basketball can and should be.

I didn't think we had a chance at Underwood, I wasn't watching this in coaching search mode, I was just enjoying (IIRC) the Saturday afternoon game on ESPN. I also watched his upset of West Virginia at SFA in the tournament and while it wasn't the same run and gun shootout, it was similarly just an awesome spectacle to watch that offense at work against such a big challenge.

When we hired him out of the blue I was over the freaking moon, and the chance to really implement an identity like that was the reason why. That's everything I think Illinois basketball should be, and THAT'S the path that will attract players to come here.

He did it in one offseason at SFA (I've gone back and watched some clips, it's true), he did it in one offseason at OSU. Will we have the same level of wins and losses success as those teams next year? Perhaps not (though I don't buy this idea that we should expect to be garbage).

But what I expect to see is for us to stand toe to toe with terrific teams and play the sort of thrilling, intricate, intelligent offensive basketball that I saw OSU play last year. Win or lose. And if we don't, if we're playing basketball that looks more influenced by John Groce and Nick Irvin than Brad Underwood, the place to point the finger will be obvious.
 
#1,663      

TownieMatt

T
CU Expat
Chicago
TownieMatt
illinipioneer said:
Methinks that if the Walker gamble doesn't pay off, we may see Gentry promoted after next season?
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Highly doubt we see assistant shuffling an 2-3 years unless things go very poorly (or very well i.e. coaches leaving for HC positions). Basketball staff's are as volatile as in football for example. This staff will be given 2-3 years to prove itself.
 
#1,665      

Obelix

Obelix
Obelix
bigruss22 said:
Gentry can't coach in practice, but he can scout and develop game and practice plans.
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He can attend practices and interact with the players. He can't directly "coach" practices. That does not affect X's and O's. Chin Coleman actually had a similar role as the Direcor of Player Development at Nebraska, I know George Lynch has a similar role at SMU, and Nottingham had the same role with Weber.
 
#1,666      

STLINI

STLINI
STLINI
Second and Chalmers said:
I don't purport to know the entire landscape of assistant coaches, but I probably would have done Antigua, Stephen Gentry for cheap, and then take the rest of your war chest and look for the best guy you can find who has high major experience in a system similar to Underwood's with some recruiting connections somewhere. Maybe that's enough money for Lamont Evans but I doubt it, maybe that money keeps Chuck Martin from South Carolina, not sure he's that guy anyway. But my staff would be focused on coaching and player development, and would have gotten rid of Groce's entire team including Fletcher and would not have burned one of the three assistant spots on a token Chicago guy.

But what's done is done. Let's go get the players these guys were brought in to get, and if we can't, let's reconvene in a year and rethink this. We have a good head coach, plenty of money and plenty of time.
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So in your mind, it would've been better for Gentry to be in a position that needs to be able to recruit, even though recruiting is not his forte, instead of an x's and o's position, which by all accounts is his strong suit?

Is it really too much to expect these assistants to relatively easily learn a system, since we expect 18-20 year olds to learn it as well? I think the "not knowing the system" concern is extremely overblown.
 
#1,667      

GBPillini

GBPillini
GBPillini
Second and Chalmers said:
He did it in one offseason at SFA (I've gone back and watched some clips, it's true), he did it in one offseason at OSU. Will we have the same level of wins and losses success as those teams next year? Perhaps not (though I don't buy this idea that we should expect to be garbage).
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He did it in one season at OSU while only bringing one assistant coach with him from SFA (Boyton) who he didn't plan on bringing with him to Illinois. I think he believes in his ability to implement his system without needing to carryover assistant coaches.
 
#1,668      

Second and Chalmers

S
Second and Chalmers
STLINI said:
So in your mind, it would've been better for Gentry to be in a position that needs to be able to recruit, even though recruiting is not his forte, instead of an x's and o's position, which by all accounts is his strong suit?
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I want the people responsible for the quality of execution that made Brad Underwood a $3 million dollar coach to have as many fingers in as many pies as possible as Illinois transitions to that system. Gentry can be involved in many things in his current role and I'm extremely glad we have him. He could be involved in more as an assistant. Recruiting is not just landing players, it's knowing which players to land.

Plus he's cheap, and the less you pay him the more you have for others.
 
#1,669      

Obelix

Obelix
Obelix
STLINI said:
So in your mind, it would've been better for Gentry to be in a position that needs to be able to recruit, even though recruiting is not his forte, instead of an x's and o's position, which by all accounts is his strong suit?

Is it really too much to expect these assistants to relatively easily learn a system, since we expect 18-20 year olds to learn it as well? I think the "not knowing the system" concern is extremely overblown.
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Plus, just because there is a strong focus in recruiting, it does no mean that our assistants will be totally incompetent in the rest of their responsibilities. They have all been involved with coaching for many years. Underwood already has Gentry very familiar with his system. If he can't teach/communicate his system to his assistants to implement, that would be more on BU than the assistants.
 
#1,670      

brillinian

B
brillinian
Second and Chalmers said:
Listen, I don't want to sit here and bash this staff. I am all-in on the Brad Underwood era.
.
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If you don't want to keep bashing the staff, why do you keep doing it every chance you get??

And, if you were "all-in" on the Underwood era, you wouldn't keep bashing his hires either. JMO
 
#1,671      

Tevo

Tevo
Wilmette, IL
Tevo
I'd guess the person best able to predict if Underwood will be able to effectively implement his system of offense (and defense), without the help of his assistants from OSU would be Underwood himself.

If there was a way to get those assistants (either from OSU, or from other schools that implement a similar system) and he felt it was critical, I'm sure he would have done that.

If he instead felt that either (a) there weren't any other folks like that available, or (b) he felt confident he could implement that system himself, either directly or by training his new assistants, and that his new assistants should instead hit the ground running on the recruiting trail, then he'd go that route.

Based on his hires, I suspect there either were the people available he'd prefer, or he decided hiring recruiters was the best bet. Either way, the result is the same, and we have to assume that he felt it was the best course available. And he would know better than anyone.
 
#1,672      

qcillini13

Q
qcillini13
Second and Chalmers said:
I want the people responsible for the quality of execution that made Brad Underwood a $3 million dollar coach to have as many fingers in as many pies as possible as Illinois transitions to that system. Gentry can be involved in many things in his current role and I'm extremely glad we have him. He could be involved in more as an assistant. Recruiting is not just landing players, it's knowing which players to land.

Plus he's cheap, and the less you pay him the more you have for others.
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If he isn't good at the building relationships portion of recruiting but he knows which players fit the system he can be the guy the coaches come to with "Hey, I really like this player and I have a good relationship with this high school coach and I think I can land him, will you check out his tape and let me know what you think before I go to the big boss with it?"

I remember doing this all the time when I was a college football coach, though all of the coaches were assistants and we didn't have a support staff the way basketball does.

He won't be out of the loop of recruiting by any means and he will help to identify the players that the program needs.
 
#1,673      

PlayAZ

P
PlayAZ
This staff I believe was put together for the following:

X and O - Underwood, Walker, and Gentry

Recruiting - Underwood, Anitgua, Coleman

The TEAM together will play to there strong point first and foremost, then assist in the other area's...Outside of St Louis and Central Illinois Walker's strength will be to communicate and get players working system. He proved he is more than adequate in that area....he will be the face in recruiting the other areas also. Antigua and Coleman will be Chicago and ALL other major recruiting bases imo, then assist with game planning and implementation.

They all will do both, just some stronger than others for different reasons.
 
#1,674      

Ulysses Everett McGill

Ulysses Everett McGill
Ulysses Everett McGill
haasi said:
Also (pure speculation), based on his public persona which stresses winning and results, I'd guess that underwood unlike groce would not be shy about getting rid of an assistant and hiring a new one if warranted
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That's my view. Just drop the notion that assistants are forever attached at the hip to the HC. I don't know if their contracts typically have buyouts, but even if they do it's "only money" to replace them. If Walker, strictly as an example, fails to pick up BU's system in such a way as to be useless as an instructor, while also failing to bring in major talent, you let him go. Gentry is waiting in the wings for now. Really not seeing the problem. Would appreciate if anyone could elaborate on what Gentry can and can't do in practice.
 
#1,675      

Illiniguy13

Illiniguy13
Illiniguy13
Second and Chalmers said:
And that plan got blown to smithereens due to factors totally beyond Underwood or Whitman's control. I'm bummed about that, but it isn't Chin Coleman's fault that OSU hired Mike Boynton.

I don't know if anyone here watched the KU-OSU game in Stillwater in early March, but that was just from a pure entertainment perspective the best game I watched all year. OSU lost 90-85, and allowed 55% shooting to KU (Frank Mason was incandescent), but offensively they were just a symphony of aggressive but precisely executed and fearless basketball. Plus the crowd were up for it and OSU has a great venue, it was just everything college basketball can and should be.

I didn't think we had a chance at Underwood, I wasn't watching this in coaching search mode, I was just enjoying (IIRC) the Saturday afternoon game on ESPN. I also watched his upset of West Virginia at SFA in the tournament and while it wasn't the same run and gun shootout, it was similarly just an awesome spectacle to watch that offense at work against such a big challenge.

When we hired him out of the blue I was over the freaking moon, and the chance to really implement an identity like that was the reason why. That's everything I think Illinois basketball should be, and THAT'S the path that will attract players to come here.

He did it in one offseason at SFA (I've gone back and watched some clips, it's true), he did it in one offseason at OSU. Will we have the same level of wins and losses success as those teams next year? Perhaps not (though I don't buy this idea that we should expect to be garbage).

But what I expect to see is for us to stand toe to toe with terrific teams and play the sort of thrilling, intricate, intelligent offensive basketball that I saw OSU play last year. Win or lose. And if we don't, if we're playing basketball that looks more influenced by John Groce and Nick Irvin than Brad Underwood, the place to point the finger will be obvious.
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Starting 0-6 in the Big12 last season and winding up 9-7 by late February is leading me to believe that in some capacity, our guys will respond to Underwood no matter how low our floor may be. I'd like to think we won't be complete garbage next year, either. We won't be good, but that's ok.