Illini Football 2023

#126      
Will we honor them on "Senior day"?

What do people think ought to happen?
100%

Randolph and Williams have been here 5 years. They are only Juniors because of the COVID year. Newton has been here 4 and again, is only a junior because of the COVID year. It'd be an absolute miss if they didn't. I know IW may not go pro, but he might as do it now since it may be his last game.
 
#127      
What's craziest about this is that other than a fairly random 4-game winning streak toward the end of 2019 - a stretch that included one of the biggest upsets in college football history vs. Wisconsin and an absolutely insane, record-setting comeback at Michigan State - Lovie was actually worse than Beckman ... he was just way more likable.
From a pure numbers in a vaccuum sense, yes Lovie was worse than Beckman. However that doesn't take into account the fact that Lovie took over the cupboard is bare complete dumpster fire Timmy the clown left him with along with a number of legal issues whereas Beckman took Zook's average team and ran it into the depths of hell.

While I know the results certainly weren't there when Lovie coached, I think people undervalue how much credibility and stability he gave this program just by taking the offer and how he left Illinois not only in a much better shape than when he started, but in a shape where we were able to hire Bret while also giving him what ended up being some very good recruits.

The more years we distance ourselves from the Lovie tenure, the more I've been able to appreciate what he did to help move us even to this point. Beckman royally effed us and it's not like we were even good to begin with. In fairness, it's practically a miracle we're where we're at right now.
 
#128      
From a pure numbers in a vaccuum sense, yes Lovie was worse than Beckman. However that doesn't take into account the fact that Lovie took over the cupboard is bare complete dumpster fire Timmy the clown left him with along with a number of legal issues whereas Beckman took Zook's average team and ran it into the depths of hell.

While I know the results certainly weren't there when Lovie coached, I think people undervalue how much credibility and stability he gave this program just by taking the offer and how he left Illinois not only in a much better shape than when he started, but in a shape where we were able to hire Bret while also giving him what ended up being some very good recruits.

The more years we distance ourselves from the Lovie tenure, the more I've been able to appreciate what he did to help move us even to this point. Beckman royally effed us and it's not like we were even good to begin with. In fairness, it's practically a miracle we're where we're at right now.
We were literally playing more true freshmen than any team in the country in Lovie's second year. It was the type of rebuild that just isn't done at this level, so he gets a lot of slack for that. Particularly since those true freshmen included Alex Palczewski, Verderian Lowe, Nate Hobbs, Tony Adams, and Bobby Roundtree.
 
#131      
From a pure numbers in a vaccuum sense, yes Lovie was worse than Beckman. However that doesn't take into account the fact that Lovie took over the cupboard is bare complete dumpster fire Timmy the clown left him with along with a number of legal issues whereas Beckman took Zook's average team and ran it into the depths of hell.

While I know the results certainly weren't there when Lovie coached, I think people undervalue how much credibility and stability he gave this program just by taking the offer and how he left Illinois not only in a much better shape than when he started, but in a shape where we were able to hire Bret while also giving him what ended up being some very good recruits.

The more years we distance ourselves from the Lovie tenure, the more I've been able to appreciate what he did to help move us even to this point. Beckman royally effed us and it's not like we were even good to begin with. In fairness, it's practically a miracle we're where we're at right now.
Beckman was a clown, but don't overstate what he inherited. He had a handful of good seniors, but otherwise the cupboard was bare - very little talent in the FR-JR classes. The team he inherited went 6-6 the previous year. The team Lovie inherited went 5-7, so very little difference there.

Lovie's tenure here was devastating with regard to in-state recruiting relationships and general national perception. His coaching and player development was off the charts bad - it's hard to overstate just how bad a coach he was. We are seeing a similar dynamic with the Houston Texans this year. The one thing he did and that I give him credit for was bringing in some under the radar recruits that panned out really well - Witherspoon and Newton most prominently.
 
#132      

Illini2010-11

Sugar Grove
Beckman was a clown, but don't overstate what he inherited. He had a handful of good seniors, but otherwise the cupboard was bare - very little talent in the FR-JR classes. The team he inherited went 6-6 the previous year. The team Lovie inherited went 5-7, so very little difference.
Context matters though. While the records were similar, Lovie was given an entirely worse hand. The Cubit season was an entire lame duck year after the Beckman scandal, and then Lovie didn't get hired until well after the normal window. We all remember the one year Cubit deal and no AD. It was an entire season plus of lost recruiting and negative (more than normal) PR through the Chicago media.

It is easy to see that Beckman had a little better starting position. The fact remains that both coaches ultimately failed, but Lovie left Coach B in a much better situation than Beckman/Cubit left Lovie.

I credit Lovie for helping repair some of the perception of the Illini program; he simply failed as a coach.
 
#133      

GrayGhost77

Centennial, CO
Beckman was a clown, but don't overstate what he inherited. He had a handful of good seniors, but otherwise the cupboard was bare - very little talent in the FR-JR classes. The team he inherited went 6-6 the previous year. The team Lovie inherited went 5-7, so very little difference there.

Lovie's tenure here was devastating with regard to in-state recruiting relationships and general national perception. His coaching and player development was off the charts bad - it's hard to overstate just how bad a coach he was. We are seeing a similar dynamic with the Houston Texans this year. The one thing he did and that I give him credit for was bringing in some under the radar recruits that panned out really well - Witherspoon and Newton most prominently.
Newton wasn't under the radar at all. Was considered a very good get at the time and pretty highly rated. Now Quan, Kerby, Sydney, and Devon I'll give you.
 
#134      
Context matters though. While the records were similar, Lovie was given an entirely worse hand. The Cubit season was an entire lame duck year after the Beckman scandal, and then Lovie didn't get hired until well after the normal window. We all remember the one year Cubit deal and no AD. It was an entire season plus of lost recruiting and negative (more than normal) PR through the Chicago media.

It is easy to see that Beckman had a little better starting position. The fact remains that both coaches ultimately failed, but Lovie left Coach B in a much better situation than Beckman/Cubit left Lovie.

I credit Lovie for helping repair some of the perception of the Illini program; he simply failed as a coach.
Lovie and Beckman both sucked. It doesn't matter what they inherited
 
#138      
One more football game . . . Looking forward to watching Iowa get dismembered in Indy. Then it’s on to 2024.
 
#142      

TentakilRex

Land O Insects between Quincy-Macomb-Jacksonville
Me in 2020: “All I want is to be competitive week in and week out”

[monkey’s paw unfurls]

[repeatedly losing one-score games week in and week out]
Last few games someone was wanting us to more like Southern Cal
 
#144      
I don’t know where to put my post season thoughts on this team, but I’m so disappointed about not making a bowl game.

Maybe this is the best place…

I’ll type more later, but my first thought when I woke up this morning is that we had 5 wins, and 3 of them were won with miraculous finishes.

We were closer to being a 2 win team than we were an 8 win team.
 
#145      
I don’t know where to put my post season thoughts on this team, but I’m so disappointed about not making a bowl game.

Maybe this is the best place…

I’ll type more later, but my first thought when I woke up this morning is that we had 5 wins, and 3 of them were won with miraculous finishes.

We were closer to being a 2 win team than we were an 8 win team.
Seems like we teetered right on the midpoint, the fulcrum, between 2 and 8 wins. How many of Iowa’s 10 wins were just as close? It’s often a close sport in recent years. As many have observed, it’s been entertaining. Clean up a few things and we’re a winning team.
 
#147      
I don’t know where to put my post season thoughts on this team, but I’m so disappointed about not making a bowl game.

Maybe this is the best place…

I’ll type more later, but my first thought when I woke up this morning is that we had 5 wins, and 3 of them were won with miraculous finishes.

We were closer to being a 2 win team than we were an 8 win team.
To be fair, two of our losses were on fluky 4th quarters in which we had momentum, and we couldn't have predicted the way the 4th went (Wisconsin and Northwestern). I think we were destined to be a 5 or 6 win team this year, and the gods chose 5. We had a LOT of negatives, there's no denying it. But we also had a LOT of positives. They just didn't balance the way we had hoped.

Oh well.
 
#148      
To be fair, two of our losses were on fluky 4th quarters in which we had momentum, and we couldn't have predicted the way the 4th went (Wisconsin and Northwestern). I think we were destined to be a 5 or 6 win team this year, and the gods chose 5. We had a LOT of negatives, there's no denying it. But we also had a LOT of positives. They just didn't balance the way we had hoped.

Oh well.
In its final six games, illinois lost 4th quarter leads in all of them, ultimately winning half of them. Here are my main complaints:

1. Ultra-conservative play with the lead. This happened in all six of those games except against Northwestern. Had we not fumbled the punt that gave NU the go ahead score, I have no doubt we would’ve concentrated on running down the clock with 10 minutes to play instead of keeping the offense open in a better attempt to score.

2. Failure to Consider Game Tempo when Going for Two. Too often, Bielema would go for the two point conversion at a point where, while the math makes sense in a one-possession situation, it fails to consider the multiple scoring options ahead. We lost the NU game by two and we missed two two-point conversions. That math is pretty simple. In the Iowa game, where scoring opportunities are limited, an early fourth quarter attempt would be justified. Against Northwestern, where the scoring was brisk, it cost us at least a chance to win in overtime.

Now, to be fair, we were competitive, at least for a half, in every game we played this year except for one (Kansas). We’ve come a long way since the dreadful years of Beckman, Cubit and Lovie, but it’s frustrating when the players have put themselves in positions to win, only to see those maddening coaching decisions put them unnecessarily behind the eight ball.
 
#149      
2. Failure to Consider Game Tempo when Going for Two.
I agree with the conservative play calling being disastrous nearly every time (it’s been that way for the entirety of Bielama’s tenure here). However, I don’t think there’s a coach in the world that would agree with this take on 2-pts.

Yes, it’s unfortunate that in a couple games this year, being down by 1 or 2 hurt us after failing to get a previous 2-pt conversion, but going for 2 has been the right call every time we’ve done it this year. We just suck at converting them it seems.
 
#150      
I agree with the conservative play calling being disastrous nearly every time (it’s been that way for the entirety of Bielama’s tenure here). However, I don’t think there’s a coach in the world that would agree with this take on 2-pts.

Yes, it’s unfortunate that in a couple games this year, being down by 1 or 2 hurt us after failing to get a previous 2-pt conversion, but going for 2 has been the right call every time we’ve done it this year. We just suck at converting them it seems.
Absolutely. As pointed out by another poster, every coach in America's 2 pt. Decision chart shows that you go for two when you are down 5, especially in the last 2-3 minutes of the game. And the last attempt was 100% necessary to try and tie the game.