Illinois Hoops Recruiting Thread

[Umit9]

The one thing we know for sure is that Shannon's value in 2024-25 and beyond is zero.

That variable is being under-weighted in these calculations, IMO.

Fair. However, if Shannon returns odds are he performs at an All B1G level again. Epps next season, most likely not.

For ‘24 and beyond, I suspect Epps still isn’t an all B1G performer. I’ll take the chances of the Illini getting someone of greater ability than Epps to fill the guard spots for future seasons covering Epps’ departure.

Eg. Shannon’s 1 season at Illinois was greater than Adam Miller or Curbelo’s 3 collegiate seasons thus far.

Just my take.

Go Illini

 

[Poe's Law]

The one thing we know for sure is that Shannon's value in 2024-25 and beyond is zero.

That variable is being under-weighted in these calculations, IMO.

Perhaps you are overweighting it in these calculations. TSJ is coming off a first team all big ten season. That’s a pretty large jump required by Epps and you have to thread the needle on the top end that it’s not so good that he goes pro providing zero value in 24-25 and beyond.

You’re also discounting whoever we replace TSJ with in those out years provided we thread that needle and Epps made it to year 3 and/or 4.

 

[NarrowJ]

Perhaps you are overweighting it in these calculations. TSJ is coming off a first team all big ten season. That’s a pretty large jump required by Epps and you have to thread the needle on the top end that it’s not so good that he goes pro providing zero value in 24-25 and beyond.

You’re also discounting whoever we replace TSJ with in those out years provided we thread that needle and he made it to year 3 and/or 4.

Also, everyone is now 1 year contracts anyway. No reason to throw a ton of NIL at Epps, piss off everyone else on the entire roster, and then also lose Epps next year on top of it all.

 

[Poe's Law]

Also, everyone is now 1 year contracts anyway. No reason to throw a ton of NIL at Epps, piss off everyone else on the entire roster, and then also lose Epps next year on top of it all.

Now more than ever one more athletic Larry Bird in the hand is worth two in the bush.

 

[Umit9]

Perhaps you are overweighting it in these calculations. TSJ is coming off a first team all big ten season. That’s a pretty large jump required by Epps and you have to thread the needle on the top end that it’s not so good that he goes pro providing zero value in 24-25 and beyond.

You’re also discounting whoever we replace TSJ with in those out years provided we thread that needle and Epps made it to year 3 and/or 4.

Haha, @Poe's Law Check my post almost simultaneous to yours. Appears we think alike.

Go Illini

 

[NarrowJ]

Now more than ever one more athletic Larry Bird in the hand is worth two in the bush.

 

[ChiefGritty]

Perhaps you are overweighting it in these calculations.

I might be. Everybody is learning how this works.

"How much are remaining years of eligibility worth?" is an objective question that we can shake out over time.

I also just think people are memory-holing how good Epps frequently was last year as a true freshman forced to play out of position on a total mess of a team.

If he's such a defensive liability and malcontent at Georgetown that he doesn't develop, fair enough, I will be totally wrong, but I see a big, big star there.

Ed Cooley got started at Providence with Bryce Cotton and I think he's going to get started at Georgetown with Jayden Epps.

But the party line is that he was terrible. And we accept that because we're told it comes from BU. But we also want to throw BU overboard and hire Sean Miller. I dunno man, I struggle with the party line sometimes.

 

[jamarvelous31]

Well that kinda mixes the two together.

I think Epps and his camp just decided he didn't want to be here and this wasn't the right environment and situation for him.

But someone said in one of these threads that "the productivity wasn't worth the NIL expectations" and that's flat-out wrong. I anticipate Epps being a big star at Georgetown, he is an incredibly promising player with very rare ability to get to the rim and finish.

And as a more general matter, I predict that as the NIL market develops, programs are going to find that continuity has a higher financial value than its currently being given.

We've heard from insiders here and around that it wasn't just money: Mom, coachability, PG tick were all factors & then money sealed the deal.

I agree with the retention sentiment. In any profession it's more expensive and disruptive to find new talent. Epps is going to be good, but he's a high usage, average defender as a mid-range shooting SG. He is not irreplaceable, particularly if he's not all in on the program.

 

[InDaAZ]

Smoking straight facts … He’s gonna play less than Buck did this year …

Kid is talented but he needs Fletched… The easiest way to ride the pine is not being able to defend … And that’s not exactly a strength of his …

We don’t need him to score … We’ve got proven scorers … So if he can’t defend … Can’t create for others yet … Isn’t strong enough to guard bigger guys … Where do you expect Brad to put him ?

Now the kid is talented and will he be a piece for the future ? Yes - if he stays … But is he ready now ? Absolutely not … And if you told Hawkins and TJ that DGL was the starting PG next year … There’s a 0% chance they come back …

Leaked DM from Pru to Indy: “Hey, don’t bogart those facts, dude!”

 

[CoachHooleyHoo]

I'd pay Epps more than Shannon to play for us next

 

[Mobi]

Look at MSU and their roster continuity taking them to a Sweet 16.

This will be the second offseason that we live and die by the portal and I have to say… not the biggest fan. Should we get a PG we all feel comfortable can play close to 30mpg and this player CoHawk and TSJ must approve of, then I might warm back up to the portal.

Epps would have been a great 4 year player here, but onto the Hoya$ he goes where he’ll just get yelled at by a different coach about defense.

This is just the beginning of the portal era so I say let's give it another couple years to observe. While I am not sure about this free agent every year approach, the obvious downside of Izzo's way is he cannot stop his players portaling out even when he doesn't take transfers. So your choices become filling those spots with future freshmen or transfers. Maybe Izzo has some magic keeping the loyalty (NIL?). We will see.

 

[CoachHooleyHoo]

You don't know that!! I think that young man if he actually shows up to Illinois will have a chip on his shoulder the size of Chicago. Haven't you been paying attention to all the tweets about how people have been doubting him all year???

I love the passion Qdog, but BU’s not handing the keys to (another) erratic freshman PG. I could see him getting a few minutes and doing some electric stuff but no chance he’s the #1 guy and probably not a significant contributor.

 

[BashCtIllini]

This is just the beginning of the portal era so I say let's give it another couple years to observe. While I am not sure about this free agent every year approach, the obvious downside of Izzo's way is he cannot stop his players portaling out even when he doesn't take transfers. So your choices become filling those spots with future freshmen or transfers. Maybe Izzo has some magic keeping the loyalty (NIL?). We will see.

There's no magic to keep players, there is cash.

Unless your team has the NIL cash to keep players happy, you should expect constant turnover. Don't know how Epps vs Shannon came into play, but if Epps were here this season, you still play the better player because there is not a guarantee anyone comes back next year. Just look at some of the guys that are in the portal. They make no sense unless it's only about money.

It's a new world, you can't count on anything next year, so you better play for this year.

 

[DAM1298]

I keep seeing here that DGL can’t play defense. If that is the case, then why did we recruit him?

Most high school prospects don’t play defense… Brad said early this season that Epps had “never had to guard before” or something along those lines, iirc

 

[Ga65]

Has he gotten taller? He's listed at 6-8 on 247 but boy he looks bigger than that.

He blocked several shots without jumping. Long wingspan?

 

[Emerson Bigguns]

This is just the beginning of the portal era so I say let's give it another couple years to observe. While I am not sure about this free agent every year approach, the obvious downside of Izzo's way is he cannot stop his players portaling out even when he doesn't take transfers. So your choices become filling those spots with future freshmen or transfers. Maybe Izzo has some magic keeping the loyalty (NIL?). We will see.

Who says Izzo doesn’t take transfers? His top two scorers last year were transfers. Walker played 2 years @ Northeastern & Hauser played a year at Marquette.

 

[DAM1298]

The one thing we know for sure is that Shannon's value in 2024-25 and beyond is zero.

That variable is being under-weighted in these calculations, IMO.

This is college basketball now, man. Even the guys who have eligibility are questions marks. With the money being injected into the sport (a great thing, players should be paid), it’s becoming more like pro sports — this is free agency.

 

[Nuke Dukem]

I keep seeing here that DGL can’t play defense. If that is the case, then why did we recruit him?

Because he is a bucket getter? Trent was a defensive liabilty as a freshman but he could score. He worked hard and became an outstanding defender. Maybe the staff saw that potential in Epps. I honestly don’t the know the. answer. Just a guess on my end.

 

[PIT_ILL]

The team will look really good when we are done with the roster construction. I promise y'all that

I get it but I think we all kinda thought that this year. Many times people said Illinois had the most talented roster (not sure it was more than Michigan with 2 lottery picks and an AA). I personally don't think there can be a roster assembled that I would believe is FF caliber until I see them play games after last year.

 

[pruman91]

Leaked DM from Pru to Indy: “Hey, don’t bogart those facts, dude!”

 

[Ga65]

This would be my ideal lineup since I love Hawkins at the 5, but one of the insiders said he won't and doesn't want to play the 5 this year

So we play with no 5’s and two 4’s.

 

[Kendall Gill’s Uncle]

Smoking straight facts … He’s gonna play less than Buck did this year …

Kid is talented but he needs Fletched… The easiest way to ride the pine is not being able to defend … And that’s not exactly a strength of his …

We don’t need him to score … We’ve got proven scorers … So if he can’t defend … Can’t create for others yet … Isn’t strong enough to guard bigger guys … Where do you expect Brad to put him ?

Now the kid is talented and will he be a piece for the future ? Yes - if he stays … But is he ready now ? Absolutely not … And if you told Hawkins and TJ that DGL was the starting PG next year … There’s a 0% chance they come back …

Thank you!

 

[sharpshot16]

Well the goal is to have a team that doesn’t require Brad to do that every game …

Josh had to order like 8 new trash cans and a TV or two this year per sources …

And a white-board.

Side note though - DGL will get tick next year, just won't be a starter. Dude has a chip on his shoulder from dropping 60 spots and is a baller. Shoots the ball well and is athletic as hell. Also really puts work into his game and already went from 165lbs - 175lbs on a Fletch plan in 6 months...

He played for 9 months on a fractured foot in HS...toughness is through the roof and won't be Charmin-soft like some of our team this year.

His mom on the other hand

 

[pruman91]

Because he is a bucket getter? Trent was a defensive liabilty as a freshman but he could score. He worked hard and became an outstanding defender. Maybe the staff saw that potential in Epps. I honestly don’t the know the. answer. Just a guess on my end.

I honestly say that recruiting in my past career was the most difficult part of my job........Someone can ooze potential , but it's really hard to define effort.....The effort needed to overcome rejection ......The ability to not get dragged down by other factors such as family worries , etc.........We all hope that BU and staff can recognize a recruit who checks all the boxes as far as what the staff is looking for as getting production with little minimal risk of not blending in with the current roster.......

it's a risk adding to a staff or roster and seeing if the reward is worth the risk.........BU heaped much praise on Mr. Epps , sometimes to a point of hyperbole , but that is in the past now.........First I can remember of Mrs. Epps hating BU was in the past week or so......
As we all know from past disappointments that mother's greatly determine what a recruit will do as far as to the recruit's path in college......

Like the portal or not , it's here to stay in one form or another , and we need to be able to play at the highest level to succeed in today's environment...........I am happy to hear that we are at a very nice position as far as NIL compared to other programs.....here's hoping we can look to bring in every off season additions to the squad that the previous year showed of needing upgrading ........

it's all a crapshoot and sometimes you win and sometimes you crap out .................We are knee deep into the off season drama that gets more difficult to navigate................Just think , it hasn't been a minute since everything was done incognito , with bagmen and shoe $$ and such .....now it's mostly out in the open.........All I want is for the Illini to have as much of a chance to land top talent as anyone else does...............................jmho

 

[Kendall Gill’s Uncle]

You don't know that!! I think that young man if he actually shows up to Illinois will have a chip on his shoulder the size of Chicago. Haven't you been paying attention to all the tweets about how people have been doubting him all year???

Getting Fletched is not the answer to everything!!! Where in the hell do we have all of these proven scorers??? Your joking right???

I smell a lot of “mutes” coming