So if we had gone 1-31 in 2005 your enjoyment level would have been the same?i don't get the fixation on this artificial and mythical milestone of the Sweet 16 as an accomplishment. Championships matter. End of discussion. I'm pretty sure some of the more senior members here can name the National Champion from 1985, can anyone name the Sweet 16 teams from that year (without resorting to Google!)?
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MDchicago
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And Loyola was a top 10 KenPom team (ranked 9th) going into the tournament, so they were criminally underseeded. It's a game we would win more often than not, but are gonna lose ~3 of 10x because they were that good and the margin for error was pretty slight.
Don't get that people don't get that. Maybe all of their double down hands in black jack come up aces... but sometimes you get the deuce.
A big part of this is how bad and uninspired we looked.
Joel Goodson
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way underrated, in my book:
Joel Goodson
- respect my decision™
it's true, it's true:
BTW, Passmore is yet another kid that Chester IDd early (don't think we're in the hunt though)
BTW, Passmore is yet another kid that Chester IDd early (don't think we're in the hunt though)
The problem was not losing to Loyola, it was how we lost. We were clearly and obviously outcoached. Moser knew exactly what we would do, created a plan to counter it, and we either wouldn't or couldn't adjust.
It's real easy to say, you'd win this game X% of the time, meaning Y% you'll lose, that's obvious. But the whole point of a tournament, is making sure that X% happens. What has Illini fans frustrated, is that Underwood is living in that Y%. I don't care how good Loyola was, when you have 2 AAs on your team, 1 that is having a nice NBA career, and the other a generational size/athleticism combo, you can't lose in the 2nd round, PERIOD.
Yep, made sense and fair point. To win a championship, you need a high seed. To get a high seed, you need to perform well in the regular season and every game matters in that regard.
But even then, not all games are equal. A win at Purdue, for example, will be infinitely more valuable than a win at home against EIU.
The real point I was getting at though is that in sports, you are defined by championships. 72-10 with a ring is better than 73-9 without one.
I think the whole “we were out coached” narrative is over used — players need to step up and perform — but this is one game I think it is appropriate. It was like Brad and company spent the week game planning and practicing for TN or OK St.
I don't really have an issue with losing to a good Loyola team. I have an issue with how they lost. They came out flat and they got absolutely dog walked for the entire game. Never even made it interesting.
Sidenote if it makes a little easier, my cousin works in the Loyola athletic department and basically said that Porter Moser and that staff had been scouting the Illini for a good chunk of the season because everything was still closed due to covid and the Illini were on the local TV a lot.
I'm not sure how you get to that statement from what I said - it is championships that matter, not an arbitrary, completely random selection of a measure of success. I see it as today's version of a participation trophy.
Okay so then you think 2005 for us was just a participation trophy?
It's better to win more games.
It's better to go further in the tournament.
It's better to be ranked higher.
I'm sorry all those don't matter to you. Most of us are having fun when we achieve these "arbitrary" goals.
Rumor I heard (my source quoted a couple really, really good players on the team) was that the Covid quarantine crap in Indiana got to them. Since they had traveled there for the B1G tournament and never left, stuck in their hotel rooms for weeks, they were just mentally out of it by the time Loyola rolled into town. I put this on the B1G and their stupid tournament scheduling even in normal years. B1G should be scheduling the tournament to finish a few days earlier so everyone gets time to collect themselves and get ready for essentially a 3rd season. But that year the Covid quarantine rules the B1G enforced leading right into the NCAAs were insane. Personally, I'd like to see the the guaranteed to make the tournament team coaches start their walk ons in the B1G tournament so the rest of the team can start tapering for the real tournament.
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We had our first solid team in forever. We were trying to build culture and if you've ever been a head coach at a decently high level some sacrifices come. Ever watched Coach Carter? I know people are going to jump in and say that's fiction. Yep it was to an extent. But it does work that way. It takes time. You build from the ground up. You go through ups and downs. I'm so tired of the people who think we should be National Title material over night. And it's not just at my beloved Illinois. It's everywhere in sports and in life. We were outcoached that game. I'd agree. But they had a culture, seniors, rhythm, etc. We were trying to get started and build something bigger. If everyone just got on board it becomes so much easier. Let's bet behind this basketball and football program. There are many good time ahead. Especially if we get behind them! ILL!
The Covid tournament factor has not been fully discussed. It is not like the team would say anything other than give credit to the other team.
That gamed sucked because we missed shots we hit all year and they hit shots that the following game did not go in. They slowed the game down a took advantage of how tv timeouts are used in tournament games. Moser now coaches at OU making 2 mil a year with a 500 record
BU is a good coach period. He has built a culture and has had success. You cannot have the regular season success along with BTT tournament success without being good. BU makes 4.6 mil a year. Jeff Capel at Pit makes 3.6 Kenny Payne at Louisville makes 3.5 Greg Gard UW 3.5. It seems like BU makes what a major program pays their head coach maybe a little more.
The 25 Highest-Paid College Basketball Coaches Are Rolling in Cash
College basketball is a very lucrative sports for coaches that bring home titles, as the top 25 highest-earners will tell you.
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I'm more tired of people who have an excuse for everything. I mean what are you talking about? This was Underwood's 4th year. Ayo was a Jr, 1st team AA, Frazier was a Sr, Grandison in his 4th year of college ball, Damonte was a Sr, Curbelo was playing so well as a Fr. he was conference 6th man of the year. Kofi was a monster and 2nd team AA.
When you're 23-6, 16-4 in a very good Big Ten, won the Big Ten Tournament (probably should have won the conference regular season), have 2 AAs, 1 a complete mismatch C almost averaging a double double, and a 1 seed, you are in every sense of the word National Title material.
And I'm sorry to break it to you, not a single thing said here makes even an infinitesimally small impact on the team's performance. I'm an Illini fan, but I don't feel the need to change history to stay "loyal."
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