Illinois Hoops Recruiting Thread

Status
Not open for further replies.
#203      
Oracle21
IllinoisssssssVarsity said:
Just catching up and had this thought…

We have literally figured out a way to recruit grown men from around the WORLD, and we have people complaining about not recruiting kids from down the street.

I miss this place while I’m gone
Click to expand...

If you don’t understand how rooting for the Manual Trio, Brian Cook, James Augustine, Ayo Donsunmu, Kiwanis Garris, Deon Thomas, Meyers Leonard, Dee Brown, Luther Head, is different than say rooting for…“EURO Big 1, Transfer A, Transfer B, Transfer C, Euro Pro 2”…then we just have different takes on what you like about the sport. I can’t just be interested in laundry.

Even Kentucky fans who were used to the random nature of their teams changing each year due to one and dones could be following the next group of burger boys in. We don’t really have that.

Right now college basketball is what JUCO basketball is every year. And there’s a reason JUCO ball isn’t very popular even in the towns where the JUCOs are located
 
#208      
the juiceman cometh
Oracle21 said:
If you don’t understand how rooting for the Manual Trio, Brian Cook, James Augustine, Ayo Donsunmu, Kiwanis Garris, Deon Thomas, Meyers Leonard, Dee Brown, Luther Head, is different than say rooting for…“EURO Big 1, Transfer A, Transfer B, Transfer C, Euro Pro 2”…then we just have different takes on what you like about the sport. I can’t just be interested in laundry.

Even Kentucky fans who were used to the random nature of their teams changing each year due to one and dones could be following the next group of burger boys in. We don’t really have that.
Click to expand...
But this is always what sports have been. It's always been rooting for laundry. When your favorite player from a given team retires or graduates, do you stop following the team? If your favorite baseball player gets traded, do you throw away all your team gear and go buy the gear from his new team?

Yes, it's nice to watch a player grow over a 4-year span but even back then you loved guys that weren't doing that. Meyers Leonard, on your list, was here 2 seasons and barely played the first. By the end of this season, Boswell, Tomi, and BH will all have played more minutes as an Illini than Leonard, and may also have a shot at eclipsing other Illini greats such as Kenny Battle, Nick Anderson, and Marcus Liberty.

And if this is all about wanting to root for guys from Illinois, why is that so important? Deron Williams was from Texas. Did that put you off the '05 team? Spoon was from Ohio and Derek Harper from Florida, should we not have taken them? The thing is people used to go to college close to where they grew up, and now they don't. It is very common to go to college out of state these days, and international students are also very common. Why on Earth should athletics limit its recruiting when even the academic side of the University doesn't limit their recruiting?

Oracle21 said:
Right now college basketball is what JUCO basketball is every year. And there’s a reason JUCO ball isn’t very popular even in the towns where the JUCOs are located
Click to expand...
Yeah, and it's the same reason DIII sports, which don't have the issues you're talking about, aren't popular either. It's because it's a lower level of competition. People who are going to spend time and money watching a sport want to watch it played well. Better players = more eyeballs, even if those better players are from Eastern Europe or transferred in from another school.
 
#209      
Emerson Bigguns
Oracle21 said:
If you don’t understand how rooting for the Manual Trio, Brian Cook, James Augustine, Ayo Donsunmu, Kiwanis Garris, Deon Thomas, Meyers Leonard, Dee Brown, Luther Head, is different than say rooting for…“EURO Big 1, Transfer A, Transfer B, Transfer C, Euro Pro 2”…then we just have different takes on what you like about the sport. I can’t just be interested in laundry.

Even Kentucky fans who were used to the random nature of their teams changing each year due to one and dones could be following the next group of burger boys in. We don’t really have that.

Right now college basketball is what JUCO basketball is every year. And there’s a reason JUCO ball isn’t very popular even in the towns where the JUCOs are located
Click to expand...
Why do you think JUCO isn't more popular? My theory was always because the players aren't as good. Much like how Jr. High Basketball is less popular than High School... If it were really about where kids were from, JUCO's would be much more popular, as they are much more likely to pull kids from the area than the major Universities.
 
#210      
thefalcon5
I don’t mind the discussion, but I frankly don’t see why as a fan we should care where talent comes from if at the end of the day we win games at a high level.

In terms of enjoyment, I’d rather see 15 guys win 25+ games a year and not have a single one born in Illinois (or America for that matter) or who wasn’t on the team the year before, as opposed to Malcolm hill, nunn, and Tate struggle for three years to sniff the bubble.

Not trying to diminish the impact or excitement over development and loyalty, but if you’re watching sports solely for that, you’re watching sports for reasons most fans are not. Again, winning cures everything and that’s objectively universal for every sports team at any level.
 
#212      
ptgrd23
MustangWally said:
Tom Izzo rips NCAA for 'ridiculous' decision to allow NBA G Leaguers to play college ball: 'Got to regroup'

www.foxnews.com

Tom Izzo rips NCAA for 'ridiculous' decision to allow NBA G Leaguers to play college ball: 'Got to regroup'

Michigan State coach Tom Izzo slammed NCAA officials for allowing former G League players in college basketball, saying the sport has "no rules."
www.foxnews.com www.foxnews.com
Click to expand...
once ncaa made European paid players eligible they lost ability to win in court on usa paid players
 
#216      
Kendall Gill’s Uncle
Emerson Bigguns said:
Why do you think JUCO isn't more popular? My theory was always because the players aren't as good. Much like how Jr. High Basketball is less popular than High School... If it were really about where kids were from, JUCO's would be much more popular, as they are much more likely to pull kids from the area than the major Universities.
Click to expand...
Great point. I feel like professional sports are more popular than college sports and their rosters churn.

It’s also not like most JUCOs are in densely populated areas to draw fans from either.

Honestly, if they put JUCO games on TV, I would be more likely to watch them than the G League or most regular season NBA games.
 
#217      
BrownTown
Not to mention watching Meyers Leonard reinvigorate the team after a spectacular senior year and postseason run.

Jumped over a kid to dunk in the super sectionals. Then made a 3 quarter court buzzer beater in the state semis. Everyone lit up (even some opposing team fans) when the announcers mentioned he was committed to Illinois.

Had never seen a player like him at the IHSA championship.
 
#218      
FrankNitty30
Oracle21 said:
If you don’t understand how rooting for the Manual Trio, Brian Cook, James Augustine, Ayo Donsunmu, Kiwanis Garris, Deon Thomas, Meyers Leonard, Dee Brown, Luther Head, is different than say rooting for…“EURO Big 1, Transfer A, Transfer B, Transfer C, Euro Pro 2”…then we just have different takes on what you like about the sport. I can’t just be interested in laundry.

Even Kentucky fans who were used to the random nature of their teams changing each year due to one and dones could be following the next group of burger boys in. We don’t really have that.

Right now college basketball is what JUCO basketball is every year. And there’s a reason JUCO ball isn’t very popular even in the towns where the JUCOs are located
Click to expand...
I felt every bit of this. Spot on.
 
#220      
the juiceman cometh
New Creation said:
https://twitter.com/x/status/1980835813534626049
Click to expand...
He's 100% right. There needs to be some kind of guideline, that is clearly delineated, including as clear a possible line of where eligibility ends. If that guideline is that anyone is eligible to play college basketball that hasn't already used up 4 years of eligibility, then so be it. I might not like it at least it'll be good to have it defined, and maybe one day we can get Ayo's senior year.
 
#221      
IllinoisssssssVarsity
Oracle21 said:
If you don’t understand how rooting for the Manual Trio, Brian Cook, James Augustine, Ayo Donsunmu, Kiwanis Garris, Deon Thomas, Meyers Leonard, Dee Brown, Luther Head, is different than say rooting for…“EURO Big 1, Transfer A, Transfer B, Transfer C, Euro Pro 2”…then we just have different takes on what you like about the sport. I can’t just be interested in laundry.

Even Kentucky fans who were used to the random nature of their teams changing each year due to one and dones could be following the next group of burger boys in. We don’t really have that.

Right now college basketball is what JUCO basketball is every year. And there’s a reason JUCO ball isn’t very popular even in the towns where the JUCOs are located
Click to expand...
If they win us a national championship this year are you gonna say man I wish it was done with some Peoria kids?
 
#223      
Oracle21
the juiceman cometh said:
Yes, it's nice to watch a player grow over a 4-year span but even back then you loved guys that weren't doing that. Meyers Leonard, on your list, was here 2 seasons and barely played the first. By the end of this season, Boswell, Tomi, and BH will all have played more minutes as an Illini than Leonard, and may also have a shot at eclipsing other Illini greats such as Kenny Battle, Nick Anderson, and Marcus Liberty.

And if this is all about wanting to root for guys from Illinois, why is that so important? Deron Williams was from Texas. Did that put you off the '05 team?


Yeah, and it's the same reason DIII sports, which don't have the issues you're talking about, aren't popular either. It's because it's a lower level of competition.
Click to expand...


First off, I want to root and be interested in US high school players (it’d be better if they were from IL but I can still follow guys from other states. I never wrote that I wanted an all Illinois team). Guys like Deron Williams and Trent Frazier are just as attached to IL lore as any in state guys.

We could all follow Meyers Leonard’s career before he even got to Illinois. Same with Morez. For me, that’s part of being invested in college sports. That’s what made it DIFFERENT from other pro leagues.

Right now, with this current group and how college basketball is for every team that isn’t Purdue basically, that allure has been taken away.

And level of competition has nothing to do with fan interest. ZERO! There’s more talent in the G League than the Big 10. Yet, nobody watches those games on NBA TV and their attendance is awful. There’s more talent at the D3 college football level than say 3A Texas High School Football, but the high school teams are having way more highly attended games. There’s more talent in Class A baseball than all the SEC schools combined, yet SEC baseball draws way more fans on a per game basis.

College sports had their own unique thing that made it special. If you remove that, it doesn’t matter if the players are better. You have to have some attachment to the team. And you can’t develop any attachment if the roster flips literally every year. NFL/MLB/NHL/NBA don’t have this type of free agency literally every season.

And if you are just attached to whether the team wins or not, then you’re just a bandwagon fan.

If you asked Florida Gator fans in say 5-10 years….”hey, which team do you remember most? The 06/07 back to back with Noah/Horford/Green/Brewer…or the 2025 with a collection of transfers….call me crazy but I think that first group is going to be fondly beloved far Moreso than 2025
 
Last edited:
#224      
Oracle21
Emerson Bigguns said:
Why do you think JUCO isn't more popular? My theory was always because the players aren't as good. Much like how Jr. High Basketball is less popular than High School... If it were really about where kids were from, JUCO's would be much more popular, as they are much more likely to pull kids from the area than the major Universities.
Click to expand...

I grew up in a town with a prominent JUCO. Tyron Lee/Antwain Barbour/Tony Allen all played there (along with lot of other D1 players). The way JUCO basketball works at the highest level is they pull different guys in every year from around the country who have issues with academics. Guys that are D1 caliber players. This is high level basketball for that level. They never take local players. Yet the local high school team drew way more fans than the JUCO. Why? Bc nobody in the community can get attached to a team that cycles in and out players even if they were great and the caliber of basketball was high. The players had zero ties to the community. They were there a year at most usually and gone.

That’s what the current D1 landscape is now. There will be a lessening of interest even for teams that are good. It’s not “well these Euro pros and G Leaguers are better players than high schoolers, and since they are better, more people will watch”. Doesn’t work like that. Never has really.
 
#225      
the juiceman cometh
Oracle21 said:
First off, I want to root and be interested in US high school players (it’d be better if they were from IL but I can still follow guys from other states. I never wrote that I wanted an all Illinois team). Guys like Deron Williams and Trent Frazier are just as attached to IL lore as any in state guys
Click to expand...
Well you didnt actually tell us what you didn't like so we had to parse it from what you said, and you specifically listed only in-state guys.

And also, guys like Kofi (Jamaican) aren't attached to IL lore? Why? Seems like arbitrary line-drawing.

Oracle21 said:
We could all follow Meyers Leonard’s career before he even got to Illinois. Same with Morez. For me, that’s part of being invested in college sports. That’s what made it DIFFERENT from other pro leagues.
Click to expand...
Huh? You can very much follow the careers of foreign players before they get here too. In fact there are many posts on this website dedicated to that, and I'm sure you can figure out a way to watch ABA games online. Probably actually easier than following a given HS player.

Oracle21 said:
Right now, with this current group and how college basketball is for every team that isn’t Purdue basically, that allure has been taken away.
Click to expand...
Confused Tim Robinson GIF by NETFLIX


Oracle21 said:
And level of competition has nothing to do with fan interest. ZERO! There’s more talent in the G League than the Big 10.
Click to expand...
I dunno, maybe? I mean, there are plenty of Big Ten games that feature multiple 1st round draft picks. Most G League games the best player is a guy who might one day get a cup of coffee in the NBA.

Oracle21 said:
Yet, nobody watches those games on NBA TV and their attendance is awful. There’s more talent at the D3 college football level than say 3A Texas High School Football, but the high school teams are having way more highly attended games. There’s more talent in Class A baseball than all the SEC schools combined, yet SEC baseball draws way more fans on a per game basis.
Click to expand...
Ok decent point, some laundry has more of a following than other laundry.

Oracle21 said:
College sports had their own unique thing that made it special. If you remove that, it doesn’t matter if the players are better. You have to have some attachment to the team. And you can’t develop any attachment if the roster flips literally every year. NFL/MLB/NHL/NBA don’t have this type of free agency literally every season.

And if you are just attached to whether the team wins or not, then you’re just a bandwagon fan.
Click to expand...
Man, this is just bush league. Nobody is saying this. You're the one that only wants to root for your team if everyone has American passports or something. The rest of us here are ready to cheer for anyone who dons the O & B, while you're here acting like

South Park Jobs GIF


Oracle21 said:
If you asked Florida Gator fans in say 5-10 years….”hey, which team do you remember most? The 06/07 back to back with Noah/Horford/Green/Brewer…or the 2025 with a collection of transfers….call me crazy but I think that first group is going to be fondly beloved far Moreso than 2025
Click to expand...
Well yeah, because back to back championships are more memorable and a bigger deal than a one-off. Your point? Do you think Gator fans are unhappy that they won with transfers?
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back