Illinois Hoops Recruiting Thread

[Det_Illini_fan]

Thoughts:
I am disappointed in not pursuing blackwell.
I think there is a big difference between championship favorite and championship contender.
The last 3 or so years there has been a "super tier" of teams that the champion has come from. And granted, we are discussing the preseason expectations with fully completed seasons of basketball.
BUT, I will say it is disappointing to hear that a player that will vault us into that top tier, who insiders were saying that we had a really good chance of landing, along with all the retention, is now all of the sudden unnecessary. Could it cause ripples in the team? Sure, but I think with all these guys coming back, they want to win. and they didn't have a problem when a top150 freshman became the show.
I (and most people who are disappointed) are not saying Coleman can't be a star on this team.
I (and most people who are disappointed) are not saying we can't win a championship.
But when we were served with, "we can a championship favorite with blackwell", to we have all the pieces we need, it just seems... odd
Winning a national championships is one of the hardest trophies to win, why not go all in when you have such a good culture.

(also what is up with "adding a piece later", when brad wants everyone on campus as soon as possible? doesn't make much sense to me.)

and this isn't a shot at you insiders, I appreciate everything yall do. I think some of the things yall were putting in here hyped this board up to a point where it is championship or bust

Summed up very well. I find it strange that people are viewing this as “no one can ever be happy,” or being crazy and asking for too much trying to “build an NBA team on a college budget,” when a matter of less than a week ago that was very much the conversations we were having.

No one is saying this team won’t be great. It’s just a team that has a chance at a title, when there are realistic pieces (or were once realistic; which if no longer it might help to know to swallow) that place them in that favorites group instead.

 

[Heisenbobble]

Ok, this one just hit the portal... elite-athletic 6'3" senior combo guard recognized as a premier perimeter defender and dangerous transition scorer

View attachment 49993

Checks all of the Loyalty 'we need another guard' boxes

Another player hoping the 5 for 5 rule hits soon.

 

[wpr]

Why stop at just one inch? I mean didn't Rodman grow 7 inches after high school?

David Robinson grew during his time at the U.S. Naval Academy, starting as a 6'7" freshman and growing to roughly 7'0" by the time he graduated.
A.I assisted.

 

[80'sIllini]

I'd like to see the Illini add players for the last two open roster spots. And these are my 2 specific suggestions via the transfer portal.6'3", 190-pound, junior PG Tylen Riley (Tulsa) and 6'10", 210-pound, senior PF Kyle Evans (UC Irvine). [If they are still available in the portal.]

Tylen Riley played his first 2 years at Cal Baptist. He played last year for Tulsa, a team that lost by 6 points to Auburn in the championship game of the NIT. Riley made the All-Tournament Team for the NIT. For the season, Riley averaged 15.0/3.9/4.4 while shooting 44.8/38.9/87.1 for Tulsa. Those numbers show he is a decent rebounding guard (which Brad likes), and a very good 3-point shooter (which the Illinois offense always needs), while averaging 15 points/game... all in 27.7 minutes/game. I think that a player like Riley, who has worked his way up the collegiate basketball ladder, would love the opportunity to play for a championship caliber team like Illinois, and earn more NIL money than he's previously been paid at Cal Baptist or Tulsa. I also think that Tylen could easily play 15 minutes/game for the Illini next season (maybe more if injuries to Vaaks and/or Coleman) without upsetting the apple cart of playing time for the other guards on the roster. I'd envision Vaaks and Coleman as starting guards for the Illini next season, with Riley and Morillo coming off the bench as very solid backups.

Kyle Evans was at Colorado State his first 2 seasons (including a RS year). He played the last 2 seasons at UC Irvine. Last season, Evans averaged 12.1/8.7/0.9 while shooting 62.0/20.0/78.8 for UCI. Those numbers show that he is a very good rebounder, with a great FG percentage (I assume that's lots of shots/dunks in the paint), but not a very good 3-point shooter (on a minimum number of attempts). He's also a very good FT shooter for a big man. Evans played 28.6 minutes/game this past season. I think that Evans could average 10-12 minutes/game for Illinois (more if Mirk is injured or sick). Based on where he's played, I think that Evans would like to play a role on a championship caliber team like Illinois, all while getting paid more NIL money at IL than he's been paid at his previous two stops.

I'm guessing that Illinois could pay BOTH Riley AND Evans for far LESS than it was willing to pay for ONE player, namely John Blackwell.

I'd really like to see a roster including Tomi/Z, Mirk/Evans, Andrej/Jake, Coleman/Morillo, and Vaaks/Riley. Yes, I know that's 10 players. And that Brad only plays an 8-to-9-man rotation. But that roster provides solid depth at all 5 positions on the court, particularly important in case of injuries/illness, which WILL happen at points in the upcoming season. And like other posters have noted, that type of depth, and a deeper rotation, really paid off for Michigan this past season. I also think that there would still be some minutes available for developing players like Ethan Brown and Jason Jakstys... especially in our blowout wins!

Good post.
What's not talked about much is that having 10 solid players capable of playing meaningful minutes makes for more competitive and game-like scrimmages during practices which can only help players improve more readily. With only 8 guys, or even 9 who are game ready, scrimmages have less resemblance to an actual game.

 

[BackThatPassUp]

Scottie

Scottie grew 7 and Dennis grew 9 or 10 inches after high school.

 

[OneTime3]

I haven’t read everything the last 24/48 hours….so I don’t know who said Blackwell was unnecessary. Did the staff want Blackwell yes, do they still want him yes, but not at the cost of potentially causing issues with returning players and with Blackwell being finicky on his usage here. We’re still getting a top 5 roster next year as has been pointed out. You return I think it’s around 65% of your production from a final 4 team….you add a piece in Vaaks that imo keeps the offense potential in the top 3 in the country. Show me a team that’s 10 deep…kids have to want to come here for the role you guys are clamoring about…not many kids out there that want that.

I feel like every "big time" player we have previously brought in that had some kind of guarantee of having the ball, having a starting line up spot etc, ended up crashing out in spectacular fashion.

 

[skyIdub]

Who do you guys think will be the X-Factor this year?

Loyalty: "OMG WHAT ABOUT THE Y-FACTOR???"

 

[davisic]

Anthony Davis grew 8 inches between Junior and Senior year of high school. Rumor has it his eyebrows grew together over the same period

 

[DocMorgan]

This is going to be the 24 offseason all over again, isn't it.

I agree. I have a love/hate relationship with our fans because of the never-ending hot takes. I had to take an extended break from Loyalty, because my hate rapidly outgrew the love part of the relationship!

 

[Emerson Bigguns]

Good post.
What's not talked about much is that having 10 solid players capable of playing meaningful minutes makes for more competitive and game-like scrimmages during practices which can only help players improve more readily. With only 8 guys, or even 9 who are game ready, scrimmages have less resemblance to an actual game.

We have 5 freshmen coming in. Are you saying that Ethan Brown, Zavier Zens (Mr. Basketball in Wisconsin, no less), and Landon Davis aren't even good enough for practice?

Frankly, those guys will need the practice reps... You can't develop your "developmental" guys by having them watch practice.

 

[RabidDawgClassic]

Loyalty: "OMG WHAT ABOUT THE Y-FACTOR???"

 

[davisic]

This is going to be the 24 offseason all over again, isn't it.

 

[PeoriaIllini03]

Good post.
What's not talked about much is that having 10 solid players capable of playing meaningful minutes makes for more competitive and game-like scrimmages during practices which can only help players improve more readily. With only 8 guys, or even 9 who are game ready, scrimmages have less resemblance to an actual game.

The idea of it is great. Try selling two 3rd year college players that averaged double digit points on their respective teams last year to be the 8-9th players for us. Any players with 2+ years of experience already should not be moving to a program to get 15 min/game. No program would be paying them life altering money for that role and it would certainly hurt their ability to play after college.

This is why Brad is going after more high schoolers. Much easier to sell a kid on earning his minutes when if it doesn't work out they still have 3 more years of eligibility.

 

[80'sIllini]

He already put on 25 this season. He is listed at 6'7" 180 on 247 but im sure he is bigger. Now your implying he is here to play a 6'7" version of TKR? Do you actually think he came to Illinois to play the 4? I dont. If you do fine. Odds are if Jason is healthy enough to play entering his 3rd season he will be behind Z at 6'10 or 11 and likely 260lbs. He is still likely just a redshirt/medical redshirt freshman. I do think we add someone for Bens role. At least i hope we do.

No, I don't think he came here to play the 4 as his main position. My point is that he can for spot minutes if needed to do so. How many 4's would be happy to guard him on the perimeter since he can hit 3 point shots? I can't recall where but I saw him listed at 215 and he looks to weigh that amount.

Anyway, and perhaps unfair because the minutes were so limited, but I didn't see much to convince me that JJ can play at this level except for providing some resistance defensively at the rim only. Take his assigned man more than 5-7 feet from the basket and I don't see him as being a good defender and really don't see him having any contribution on offense except maybe cleaning up a few missed layups. Hope I am wrong or we get a legit decent big from mid major whose will to trade down in minutes played for being on a high profile national championship contender who can offer more NIL $ as well. Or, we get a euro player to fit that profile during the summer.

 

[IllinitripleJ]

Scottie

And also Anthony Davis from Chicago. Bruce Weber was the first one in on Davis and if the Illini had gotten him in 2011 who is to say how long Weber would have kept coaching at Illinois. But there was 100,000 reasons why Davis signed with Kentucky and led them to their last national championship on a stacked roster in 2011-2012.

 

[millineum]

Who do you guys think will be the X-Factor this year?

Hoping for morillo. Seems like a glue guy and I think he will be surprisingly good

 

[wc_illini]

Loyalty is so back. If we were told this would be the squad 2 weeks ago everyone would be ecstatic.

Some of you are delusional with this depth concern. Brad and Co. have clearly decided on how they want to build a roster and that starts with retaining your best talent, which costs $$$$. Then fill the gaps with talented freshmen that fit our style of play who are cheaper than portal guys.

Even if we have the additional $$ to add another experienced guard, we'd then have to sell them on taking 15-20 min/game in a reduced usage. What player would want that?

Werner described this perfectly in the pod from Friday when Drej announced.

If we had no idea what was going on behind the scenes, and we were told this is the roster, I think the reactions would generally be better (though I'm sure not without criticism). But the talk of preseason #1 and Blackwell only to miss on him and not pivot to another star transfer stoked the fire.

As for "cheaper" freshman: Michigan did well with a #18 recruit last year. Duke had 5 top 35 recruits (3 in the top 20)! Arizona had 3 in the top 30 (2 in the top 10). UConn had 2 in the top 30. Of these, the ones outside the top 20 didn't play a major role except Dame Sarr (and he really struggled on offense). That doesn't mean Coleman and Morillo can't be good, it just calibrates the probabilities in my mind.

So my perspective isn't that we need a guard to back up Vaaks and Coleman. It's that there's real risk that one of them doesn't pan out at all. I'd prefer that we get a star in the portal so we're only counting on one of those two to be great. If we can't get a star, then the goal I suppose is to get more options to throw at the wall and hope enough stick (maybe with a defensive-oriented guard as an option).

 

[Illini2010-11]

I haven’t read everything the last 24/48 hours….so I don’t know who said Blackwell was unnecessary. Did the staff want Blackwell yes, do they still want him yes, but not at the cost of potentially causing issues with returning players and with Blackwell being finicky on his usage here. We’re still getting a top 5 roster next year as has been pointed out. You return I think it’s around 65% of your production from a final 4 team….you add a piece in Vaaks that imo keeps the offense potential in the top 3 in the country. Show me a team that’s 10 deep…kids have to want to come here for the role you guys are clamoring about…not many kids out there that want that.

It is almost baffling to me how shortsighted some players/agents have become. It really is simple to me:

1) Illini have a big bag of money available
2) The staff has proven able to get players into the pros (with Wagler it will be 4 first round picks in the last 3 seasons)
3) Have the possibly to win a national championship with a solid core of returning players

If the above is not reason enough to jump on board, then it is best for a player to look elsewhere. It is just sad that Blackwell is finicky on potential usage here, especially considering the success that Illinois has had in recent past (as well as being a legacy).

Either way, this Illini squad will be in strong contention for the third weekend of the tourney again.

 

[PepeSilvia]

Loyalty is so back. If we were told this would be the squad 2 weeks ago everyone would be ecstatic.

Some of you are delusional with this depth concern. Brad and Co. have clearly decided on how they want to build a roster and that starts with retaining your best talent, which costs $$$$. Then fill the gaps with talented freshmen that fit our style of play who are cheaper than portal guys.

Even if we have the additional $$ to add another experienced guard, we'd then have to sell them on taking 15-20 min/game in a reduced usage. What player would want that?

Werner described this perfectly in the pod from Friday when Drej announced.

The rumor was that Illinois was retaining all the main guys and still had money for Blackwell. See the #retention and #theaddition stuff was going on and then when Stojakovic signed, it seemed like Blackwell cooled on an Illinois and now the roster is all set despite supposedly having the money to make an offer for Blackwell.

So, you basically have the same roster as last year but are swapping Vaaks for Wagler, Coleman for Boswell, and probably Morillo for Ben.

Now it's obviously a very good roster and should hopefully continue to improve but it still doesn't really address the issue with lack of athleticism on the perimeter. Wagler to Vaaks seems like a wash though Vaaks has a bigger frame. Boswell to Coleman seems like similar to a wash though Coleman might be a bit taller. Boswell was likely stronger though. Morillo should be a bit more athletic than Ben.

If the money was there for Blackwell then why not address that issue and add another guard? And there is no reason that it needs to be sold as a 15-20 minute role since you don't want to hand a freshman a starting gig. There is easily a 25 minute role in there even if it's simply backing up Vaaks and Coleman. Trey Mckenney just averaged 22 minutes off the bench as a top 20 recruit in the country(similar to Coleman).

 

[Chase321]

I haven’t read everything the last 24/48 hours….so I don’t know who said Blackwell was unnecessary. Did the staff want Blackwell yes, do they still want him yes, but not at the cost of potentially causing issues with returning players and with Blackwell being finicky on his usage here. We’re still getting a top 5 roster next year as has been pointed out. You return I think it’s around 65% of your production from a final 4 team….you add a piece in Vaaks that imo keeps the offense potential in the top 3 in the country. Show me a team that’s 10 deep…kids have to want to come here for the role you guys are clamoring about…not many kids out there that want that.

Sure. And that all makes sense. But if the staff still wants Blackwell and can’t get him or don’t like his usage mandates why is it considered nuts by some people here to suggest the team go get a different guard?

 

[bavanga3]

He already put on 25 this season. He is listed at 6'7" 180 on 247 but im sure he is bigger. Now your implying he is here to play a 6'7" version of TKR? Do you actually think he came to Illinois to play the 4? I dont. If you do fine. Odds are if Jason is healthy enough to play entering his 3rd season he will be behind Z at 6'10 or 11 and likely 260lbs. He is still likely just a redshirt/medical redshirt freshman. I do think we add someone for Bens role. At least i hope we do.

I don't get why some people can't see that you don't bring in a freshman pg to play the 4 in the BIG. Its not about height, he would be physically abused.

Another thing that bothers me regarding Morillo is people saying he has no shot. Thats outdated. Dude shot 40% from 3 this year. He's just gotta be good enough to be respected so people can't sag off. People are acting like he's sophomore year Ty which couldn't be further from the truth. Im excited to see his improvement.

 

[Get yourself a new map]

Hope Coleman can transition from a small private school in St. Louis County, MO to the BIG. The change in completion will be a huge change for him. Being Wagler 2.0 would be like finding 2 needles in 2 haystacks or discovering 2 matching snowflakes. Sure hope he is IT. Wagler has certainly spoiled us.

I’d never heard of Principia until this year. I looked into their schedule and am surprised they even play in the Missouri association playoffs. Place feels like a La Lumiere, which has two teams - one that plays a national schedule and one that operates as a typical high school team.
Principia won all of its playoff games, championship included, by 50 points. But they played a pretty decent schedule otherwise. They beat one of the best teams in Illinois (East St Louis) handily and played a bunch of other out of state powers. They have multiple players who are definitely not local kids, including a few from Ghana/Ivory Coast.
All this to say that Coleman is at least familiar with excellent comp and saw it in practice every day.

 

[aaeismacgychel]

Fully agreed. That 05-06 had so little support for Auggie and Dee Brown. There was plenty of hype around some others like Brian Randle but really there were just two reliable scorers in that squad.

Meanwhile Freshman Jamar Smith smoothly buries another 3 at a near 50% clip...

McBride also shot threes over 40% at Alfonso Plummer volume, and a young Shaun Pruitt and Randle were nothing to scoff at. Team had talent, they were just young outside Dee, Augie, and Rich. And they were a Top 20 offensive team in the nation that year.

Some of the takes in this thread are bizarre. What are we doing here? We could sign the 90s Bulls to the roster this year and people would be angry Dickey Simpkins was on the roster instead of going after Charles Barkley to back up Mirk for 10min

 

[Combo]

If we had no idea what was going on behind the scenes, and we were told this is the roster, I think the reactions would generally be better (though I'm sure not without criticism). But the talk of preseason #1 and Blackwell only to miss on him and not pivot to another star transfer stoked the fire.

As for "cheaper" freshman: Michigan did well with a #18 recruit last year. Duke had 5 top 35 recruits (3 in the top 20)! Arizona had 3 in the top 30 (2 in the top 10). UConn had 2 in the top 30. Of these, the ones outside the top 20 didn't play a major role except Dame Sarr (and he really struggled on offense). That doesn't mean Coleman and Morillo can't be good, it just calibrates the probabilities in my mind.

So my perspective isn't that we need a guard to back up Vaaks and Coleman. It's that there's real risk that one of them doesn't pan out at all. I'd prefer that we get a star in the portal so we're only counting on one of those two to be great. If we can't get a star, then the goal I suppose is to get more options to throw at the wall and hope enough stick (maybe with a defensive-oriented guard as an option).

That's a weak class for Duke. They usually have 2-3 top 10 guys and another couple a bit lower.

Coleman would be their lowest ranked guy a lot of years.

 

[PeoriaIllini03]

If we had no idea what was going on behind the scenes, and we were told this is the roster, I think the reactions would generally be better (though I'm sure not without criticism). But the talk of preseason #1 and Blackwell only to miss on him and not pivot to another star transfer stoked the fire.

As for "cheaper" freshman: Michigan did well with a #18 recruit last year. Duke had 5 top 35 recruits (3 in the top 20)! Arizona had 3 in the top 30 (2 in the top 10). UConn had 2 in the top 30. Of these, the ones outside the top 20 didn't play a major role except Dame Sarr (and he really struggled on offense). That doesn't mean Coleman and Morillo can't be good, it just calibrates the probabilities in my mind.

So my perspective isn't that we need a guard to back up Vaaks and Coleman. It's that there's real risk that one of them doesn't pan out at all. I'd prefer that we get a star in the portal so we're only counting on one of those two to be great. If we can't get a star, then the goal I suppose is to get more options to throw at the wall and hope enough stick (maybe with a defensive-oriented guard as an option).

Vaaks is the "star" in the portal. By most experts this kid is ranked as a Top 10 transfer.

So you want 2 stars in the portal on top of retaining Mirk, Drej, T, and Z. Priority was always to retain our guys and bet on them improving. I understand what you're saying but it's not realistic.

Money isn't the only issue. If it was we would have Blackwell or another star. You have to sell another ball dominant kid on taking less minutes/usage. Very, very few people will do that.