Illinois Hoops Recruiting Thread

#501      
A lot of guys out for multiple games in 2025. Kind of an anomaly.
But that's the thing, right? Situational need for quality contributions from more players than your core rotation isn't an anomaly at all, it would be an anomaly if that WEREN'T the case.

You need too many in order to have enough, that's just kind of a truism of basketball.

Everything is frozen right now because of Andrej's draft process, that's the reality of it.
 
#502      
When does Brad ever play more than 8 in high level conference games?
I agree. Brad typically doesnt go more than 8 deep. That being said, i do expect that we will add a 4 to be someone who is more suited to back up at the power 4 spot. Maybe not on Ben's level but possibly. Last year we had 4 guys that played the 4/5 in T, Z, Mirk and Ben. We needed all of them last season due to injuries and at times fouls. Currently to play the 4/5 especailly on the defensive end we only have 3 for those roles in T, Z and Mirk. For depth incase of injury or foul trouble i do expect us to fill that void in our rosters construction. How much they play im.not sure. We are stocked at the w7ng but not at the 4/5 if someone goes down or has foul trouble. Mayb s9me dont exoectvus to add a 4 man but i do expect that to happen eventually. Players get sick, hurt and get in foul trouble. The teams we are facing will have some big strong dudes at the 4/5 and we will need some back ups for depth or if someine does go down we arent in big trouble.
 
#503      
Well we’re gonna have to find that 9th man somewhere.

IMO that’s a gamble. Both guys are ranked much lower than where Lee was ranked.

Counting on either to come in and be a functioning role player will hurt if it doesn’t pay off. Ideally you’d want your 9th man capable of playing a 5-10min role.
I think the key is fit. We have no shortage of guys who can play on the wing, and play well.

Clearly, playing time was Lee's primary motivation for leaving, or he wouldn't have gone the mid-major route. He has a chance to start and be one of their top usage players. We didn't kick him out. He decided to leave.

Zens is barely behind where Lee was in their respective final rankings. (like 4 spots?) Zens is a much more versatile player, in that he has a low post game, so he is likely able to play small ball 4 or out on the wing. Brown is a shooter, plain and simple, but that skill is essential for our offense to function properly.

Lee wouldn't have been able to give us minutes at the 4, and would have to earn his respect from the arc. I'm not sure shooting from range is going to be his calling card... but his wasn't even about that. It was about what Brandon wanted. He didn't want 5-10 mpg. He wants 20-30.
 
#504      
I think the key is fit. We have no shortage of guys who can play on the wing, and play well.

Clearly, playing time was Lee's primary motivation for leaving, or he wouldn't have gone the mid-major route. He has a chance to start and be one of their top usage players. We didn't kick him out. He decided to leave.

Zens is barely behind where Lee was in their respective final rankings. (like 4 spots?) Zens is a much more versatile player, in that he has a low post game, so he is likely able to play small ball 4 or out on the wing. Brown is a shooter, plain and simple, but that skill is essential for our offense to function properly.

Lee wouldn't have been able to give us minutes at the 4, and would have to earn his respect from the arc. I'm not sure shooting from range is going to be his calling card... but his wasn't even about that. It was about what Brandon wanted. He didn't want 5-10 mpg. He wants 20-30.
College Basketball GIF by NCAA March Madness


Hope they’re either showing Zens 2026 Ben film or somehow getting him in the gym this offseason. That would be sick.
 
#505      
Significant role? A 9th man isn't a significant role.

Also, the staff felt like at least one of Zens/Brown will be an upgrade over Lee.
Wow. I find this hard to believe but I will defer to your judgement. I actually really liked all of the minutes that Brandon Lee got. The Feliz comparisons were very accurate IMO
 
#508      
I hope there is a nice surprise coming after the draft stuff(more than just Stojakovic returning) because I'm confused why both of Ty and Lee transferred with the current roster composition.

Currently have:

Vaaks
Coleman(freshman)
Stojakovic
Mirkovic
Tomislav
Zvonimir
Jake Davis
Morillo(freshman)

Jakstys
Zens(freshman)
Brown(freshman)
Landon Davis

I don't see why one of Ty or Lee couldn't have played a significant role on a team with title aspirations with that outlook.

I'm hoping there is a #theaddition(outside of Vaaks) to go alongside the retention. Right now, basically just running it back with Coleman and Vaaks in place of Wagler and Boswell. Which don't get me wrong that is a great place to be, but I still think the goal should be a title and beating the likes of the Duke, UConn, and Florida's of the world. Another guard would probably help a ton especially one with defensive versatility.

Supposedly there was the money to add Blackwell to this group so it should be there to add another piece.
late to the party

1) they aren't good shooters
2) significant role? 9/10 on the roster
3) What was the NIL offer?

Good for them an offer at another D1 school.
 
#509      
Fun fact:
Since Brad has been here, four times has a "9th man" appeared in the majority of conference games and averaged 9 or more mpg.

Jake in 2025
Adonis De La Rosa in 2019
Mark Smith and Greg Eboigbodin in 2018

I'd say probably not a coincidence that those are 3 of the 4 worst years of BU's tenure.
In the Mark Smith (17-18) year, DeMonte played the 9th most minutes. 10 guys played in at least 27 games and averaged over 10 mpg. Obviously, a team searching for an identity.

Last year the guy who played the 9th most minutes was Petrovic...(about 100 minutes total)

In the Ayo years and beyond, Jake Davis played the most minutes of the guys who had the 9th most in a given season. (Around 300 minutes) Only thre other guys played over 200. De la Rosa, Omar Payne, and DGL (Fr). (I'm not counting Skyy, who played the 9th most in his short tenure. Goode was 10th at about 150 min)
 
#510      
In the Mark Smith (17-18) year, DeMonte played the 9th most minutes. 10 guys played in at least 27 games and averaged over 10 mpg. Obviously, a team searching for an identity.

Last year the guy who played the 9th most minutes was Petrovic...(about 100 minutes total)

In the Ayo years and beyond, Jake Davis played the most minutes of the guys who had the 9th most in a given season. (Around 300 minutes) Only thre other guys played over 200. De la Rosa, Omar Payne, and DGL (Fr). (I'm not counting Skyy, who played the 9th most in his short tenure. Goode was 10th at about 150 min)
So if you exclude garbage time minutes, the 9th guy can expect to play 3-5 minutes per game. Pretty sure one of the freshman can fill that role.
 
#511      
I think Ty could have easily been in line for first perimeter player off the bench over Morillo or Davis.

He stuck around last season for a similar role if you expected Petrovic, Boswell, and Stojakovic to start preseason.

I get wanting to play but Ty seems like a guy that wants to win and I think being a good role player on a final four team might be more fun than playing for Boise State.

Keep in mind this kid started as a sophomore on an elite 8 team and has been around for 2 more years.
Pulp Fiction Butch Coolidge GIF
 
#512      
In the Mark Smith (17-18) year, DeMonte played the 9th most minutes. 10 guys played in at least 27 games and averaged over 10 mpg. Obviously, a team searching for an identity.

Last year the guy who played the 9th most minutes was Petrovic...(about 100 minutes total)

In the Ayo years and beyond, Jake Davis played the most minutes of the guys who had the 9th most in a given season. (Around 300 minutes) Only thre other guys played over 200. De la Rosa, Omar Payne, and DGL (Fr). (I'm not counting Skyy, who played the 9th most in his short tenure. Goode was 10th at about 150 min)
Measuring by total minutes is tricky because there's so much early season garbage time built in. That's why, when I think about our "real" rotation, I tend to focus on what the rotation looks like in conference. But yeah, ^ that's all true.

I think sometimes people think that having a 9th man who is a key cog in the rotation is a sign of a roster's strength. But I'd argue more often it means that one / some of your top five players aren't good enough to stay on the floor. Kinda related to the football adage "If you have two quarterbacks, you have none."
 
#513      
But that's the thing, right? Situational need for quality contributions from more players than your core rotation isn't an anomaly at all, it would be an anomaly if that WEREN'T the case.

You need too many in order to have enough, that's just kind of a truism of basketball.

Everything is frozen right now because of Andrej's draft process, that's the reality of it.
You still need someone who will accept that role at a relatively low price point and won't cause locker room discontent.

The silly parts about this conversation is that Ty redshirted rather than take on that role in the past... We know how he feels about the 8th / 9th slot.

And even if stoj announced he was coming back tomorrow the message we've gotten from insiders is the staff wants to see the freshman over the summer and then consider an overseas add.

We've seen those overseas players typically come later in the summer anyways and that Illinois showing interest in players can create a bidding war...so the current approach seems awfully reasonable
 
#514      
So if you exclude garbage time minutes, the 9th guy can expect to play 3-5 minutes per game. Pretty sure one of the freshman can fill that role.
The thing about thinking this is that neither Petro or Brandon Lee filled that role last year. Hence, in our game against Wisconsin, we were forced to play a 6-man team, with both of those guys playing 0 minutes.

Last year's team was very successful, but would prefer that part to get corrected. Those guys should be good enough to get into the game.
 
#515      
The thing about thinking this is that neither Petro or Brandon Lee filled that role last year. Hence, in our game against Wisconsin, we were forced to play a 6-man team, with both of those guys playing 0 minutes.

Last year's team was very successful, but would prefer that part to get corrected. Those guys should be good enough to get into the game.

But the whole point is that you can't get starter/6th man level guys to come here for a role where you (a) play maybe 30 garbage time minutes the entire season if there are minimal/no injuries or (b) hope they can maybe grab a 5-10 minute role if in the small off chance there ARE significant injuries.

Nobody is signing up for that except your incoming freshmen who know they have some work cut out for them (even sophomore Brandon Lee doesn't want this role).
 
#516      
Measuring by total minutes is tricky because there's so much early season garbage time built in. That's why, when I think about our "real" rotation, I tend to focus on what the rotation looks like in conference. But yeah, ^ that's all true.

I think sometimes people think that having a 9th man who is a key cog in the rotation is a sign of a roster's strength. But I'd argue more often it means that one / some of your top five players aren't good enough to stay on the floor. Kinda related to the football adage "If you have two quarterbacks, you have none."
Michigan and UConn both had 9 guys play >30% of their minutes on the season, though their rotations shrunk by the end (at least partly due to injury for UM).

Among Torvik's top 10, Duke and Purdue had 9, while Houston had 9-10.

So it's certainly not a bad strategy to have 9+ guys who can contribute meaningfully over a season, even if it's just to keep your core fresh and/or to fill in for injuries.
 
#517      
But the whole point is that you can't get starter/6th man level guys to come here for a role where you (a) play maybe 30 garbage time minutes the entire season if there are minimal/no injuries or (b) hope they can maybe grab a 5-10 minute role if in the small off chance there ARE significant injuries.

Nobody is signing up for that except your incoming freshmen who know they have some work cut out for them (even sophomore Brandon Lee doesn't want this role).
I mean we got Jake Davis from Mercer 2 years ago, for a pretty similar role.
 
#518      
I keep seeing the argument of "But Ty was a starter 3 years ago on an elite 8 team, he must be good enough to crack the rotation this year"

Ty's numbers from 2024 would have been good enough for the 9th best player on the team last season, below Z (and Jake and Ben).

Keeping 5 players from last year's rotation and adding Vaaks, Coleman and Morillo promises at best more of the same, and at worst less opportunity behind some combination of Zens, Brown and Davis.

An incoming freshman looking to prove himself could understandably deal with 3-5 minutes a game plus garbage time. A 5th year player is going to want to go somewhere he's getting some actual playing time, so that's what happened.
 
#519      
You still need someone who will accept that role at a relatively low price point and won't cause locker room discontent.
Well that's the other universal truism of basketball, no matter how great and perfectly constructed a basketball team is on the floor, behind closed doors guys want more playing time and more shots than they're getting.

Andrej Stojakovic was not a happy camper last year. He deserves enormous credit for fighting through that and adapting his game to what the team needed, and his flexibility and sacrifice will not have gone unnoticed by scouts either. And he got his reward in the end and we can see what that meant to him whenever he talks about it. But he wants to be the go-to scorer, make no mistake.

So we wait, lock him back on board, and then we go get the piece that will make us the kind of superteam that's adaptable against any opponent.
 
#520      
But the whole point is that you can't get starter/6th man level guys to come here for a role where you (a) play maybe 30 garbage time minutes the entire season if there are minimal/no injuries or (b) hope they can maybe grab a 5-10 minute role if in the small off chance there ARE significant injuries.

Nobody is signing up for that except your incoming freshmen who know they have some work cut out for them (even sophomore Brandon Lee doesn't want this role).
Michigan's #7-9 guys in minutes played were: senior, senior, sophomore (all returning players who played fewer minutes than prior season)
UConn's were: senior, freshman, junior (one transfer and one returning, both played less than prior year)
Duke's were: freshman, sophomore, sophomore (all returning and played more than prior season)
Purdue's were: freshman, freshman, sophomore (returning player who played more than prior season)
Houston's #7-10 (all played 20-30% of minutes) were: senior, freshman, sophomore, senior (one transfer who played less than prior year, two returning who played more)

So 16 guys in Torvik's top ten played at the bottom end of 9-10 man rotations. Five freshman, five sophomores, one junior, and five seniors.

All the transfers played fewer minutes than their prior year
 
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#522      
I keep seeing the argument of "But Ty was a starter 3 years ago on an elite 8 team, he must be good enough to crack the rotation this year"

Ty's numbers from 2024 would have been good enough for the 9th best player on the team last season, below Z (and Jake and Ben).

Keeping 5 players from last year's rotation and adding Vaaks, Coleman and Morillo promises at best more of the same, and at worst less opportunity behind some combination of Zens, Brown and Davis.

An incoming freshman looking to prove himself could understandably deal with 3-5 minutes a game plus garbage time. A 5th year player is going to want to go somewhere he's getting some actual playing time, so that's what happened.

right, it's not exactly rocket surgery. mind boggling that some are hung up on this
 
#523      
Michigan's #7-9 guys in minutes played were: senior, senior, sophomore (all returning players who played fewer minutes than prior season)
UConn's were: senior, freshman, junior (one transfer and one returning, both played less than prior year)
Duke's were: freshman, sophomore, sophomore (all returning and played more than prior season)
Purdue's were: freshman, freshman, sophomore (returning player who played more than prior season)
Houston's #7-10 (all played 20-30% of minutes) were: senior, freshman, sophomore, senior (one transfer who played less than prior year, two returning who played more)

So 16 guys in Torvik's top ten played at the bottom end of 9-10 man rotations. Five freshman, five sophomores, one junior, and five seniors.

All the transfers played fewer minutes than their prior year

What do I do with this data?

EDIT: Looks like it basically shows that 9th/10th man is kind of a crapshoot (ie, whoever earns it out of the bottom of the roster), but certainly unlikely to be top end talent level players who have been lured to play this role for less NIL and playing time than they could get elsewhere.

I mean we got Jake Davis from Mercer 2 years ago, for a pretty similar role.

Jake Davis, who was an unestablished single-digit ppg scorer at Mercer, the 209th ranked KP team his lone season there... you honestly think we can't go get a guy like that? If so, then I don't see the problem. If not, then why?
 
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#524      
So if you exclude garbage time minutes, the 9th guy can expect to play 3-5 minutes per game. Pretty sure one of the freshman can fill that role.
I do not feel any of our freshman can defend in the post and fill Ben's role vs the teams we are playing. The only type of option that could rebound and defend a true power 4 with any size would be Jason J. if he is medically cleared. He did rebound well and has some size. I really hope he is at 6'10" likely 240 by now and i guess he is a third year freshman eligabilty wise with a redshirt and med redshirt season. He could play spot minutes if guys miss time or have fouls. I think we add someone else besides Jason to help at the 4/5 as depth to help Z back up the 4/5 in B10 play and ither big boys should someone hod forbid go down or foul alot.
 
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