Michigan 84, Illinois 70 Postgame

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#626      
I think the problem with a lot of folks right now is literally thinking championship or bust. Just FYI, Illinois has never won a national championship.

From 2015 to 2024 - that's 9 years, almost a decade - gonzaga made 9 straight sweet sixteens, 3 elite eights, and twice the national champion runner up.

If that's our stretch for the next 9 years, sign me up right now lol.

Plus, they legitimately never miss the tournament (I get they play in an awful conference, still noteworthy).
I guess the question is whether it’s preferred to be a program like Gonzaga that gets close but never gets it done or a program like Baylor or Syracuse that has won a title, but now is not close to that level.

Personally, I’m tired of being in the conversation of “biggest/best program not to have won a title”. Win a championship, then we can be content with what Gonzaga has achieved.
 
#627      
1. Don't have the athletes to defend teams that do. 2. Boswell 's shot is so broken they're sagging and it's not spreading the floor. 3. We don't play inside out enough.
Yes, I think our offense depends on all players being a threat from 3. That’s what opens driving lanes for Wagler, Boswell and AS. More inside out action would help when defense sags. Edey’s Purdue teams ran this brilliantly. I think Tomi can be very effective, too.
 
#628      
Remember all the folks on the board pretending that Morez was someone addition by subtraction?
I remember a few “good riddance” posts but I don’t recall a bunch of people saying that. He was a huge loss and I pin that squarely on Brad’s shoulders. He mismanaged, and quite frankly, f@&$%* up that whole situation and it started early on in that season.
 
#629      
Would we rather have won and Friday and lost one of our top 5-6 players to an ACL injury? Michigan won the battle but lost a pretty big piece of their puzzle in the process. Cason has arguably been their best guard in many games. If their frontcourt plays like they did Friday it may not matter, but there's a lot less room for error.

I'll take the L (as much as it sucked) and the healthy roster heading into March.
 
#630      
I remember a few “good riddance” posts but I don’t recall a bunch of people saying that. He was a huge loss and I pin that squarely on Brad’s shoulders. He mismanaged, and quite frankly, f@&$%* up that whole situation and it started early on in that season.
I may be misremembering a bit, but early last year, Morez kept getting into foul trouble (which is common for Freshman bigs). By the heart of B1G season he was actually getting starter minutes, and then he broke his wrist.

I can agree that the situation may have been mismanaged a bit (for playing time), but I think we are exaggerating the extent of it.

NIL deal is a whole different scenario. I simply do not have enough information to make a valid assessment. If Morez truly signed a deal and then backed out, he deserves ridicule, as does May for tampering. But it is the Wild West and we have benefited on the whole.
 
#631      
I ask this sincerely because I keep seeing it (again) repeated often lately: is there clear proof Morez actually signed something for a second year with Illinois before backing out and going to Michigan - all within the week following the season?

Also, Brad seemed to indicate he doesn't really value pursuing/winning a conference season championship because of the lack of balance in schedules and instead plays more toward analytics and March. Maybe it shouldn't, but hearing him state that surprised me. I wonder if that was a comment stemming from frustration/anger regarding the way we played (have been playing) or if that is an ingrained sentiment and a core principle.

Nevertheless, on to Oregon.
This would make sense…if our teams historically excelled in March
 
#632      
I remember a few “good riddance” posts but I don’t recall a bunch of people saying that. He was a huge loss and I pin that squarely on Brad’s shoulders. He mismanaged, and quite frankly, f@&$%* up that whole situation and it started early on in that season.
You never saw one practice to see effort or issues, he couldn't stay on the floor because he generally had two fouls by the 10 minute mark, he started midway through the season and per our insiders, a deal was in place to return, the document was signed, but his father(and Morez) for a better offer and left.

To add on to that, we have no clue what he agreed to versus what Michigan magically came up with. We thought we were one of the top programs from an NIL standpoint and as two off-seasons have gone by, we clearly aren't.

If you want to say that we mismanaged the additions/subtractions that did occur.....I suppose that can be of question. Not sure anyone thought Drej was going to bust (which is an extremely strong term), don't think anyone knew that Tomi was going to regress, etc. Those are both players that we absolutely needed to come through and they haven't. Tomi's shooting has been extremely unpredictable. Nobody foresaw that. We were a LOT better last year when he came back from being ill. We got steamrolled a couple of times when he was out. He and Boswell were the only players that played even remotely well when we played Kentucky. Everyone else(including Morez) were bad.

All that said, Morez plays next to absolute proven studs. Would he be this good without Mara there? Would he be this good without Yaxal there? Those are two NBA players. Those are two phenomenal players that all take pressure off of each other. They can be aggressive and not worry about fouls because there's depth. Michigan has a ton of NIL money to make that happen + Cadeau.

He wanted to shoot threes and with all due respect to our front line players, he would have been the ONLY big on our roster and he'd have to carry a much bigger load. Could he have done it? We have no clue. When Mirk goes off, the comments around here were Morez who? Now that he's hitting a bit of a wall and our bigs got really taught a lesson, there are comments and hot takes, especially yours, that are baseless. There are WAY too many unknowns to assign blame and come to any sort of conclusions. There are too many moving parts with the portal/NIL with players that have their own agendas.

Sorry for the long post, but that type of hot take when we still have two regular season games, the Big Ten Tournament and the NCAA Tournament ahead. If Tomi gets hot and goes on an offensive heater.....it'll be amazing how different the takes will be.
 
#633      
I think the problem with a lot of folks right now is literally thinking championship or bust. Just FYI, Illinois has never won a national championship.

From 2015 to 2024 - that's 9 years, almost a decade - gonzaga made 9 straight sweet sixteens, 3 elite eights, and twice the national champion runner up.

If that's our stretch for the next 9 years, sign me up right now lol.

Plus, they legitimately never miss the tournament (I get they play in an awful conference, still noteworthy).
I understand your point here, and it's a very valid one.

I give BU a lot of credit for having National Championship expectations and trying his best to get Illinois to that point. Whether he is doing it completely the right way or not, is up for debate.

There are valid reasons to critique him; however, there are valid reasons to praise him as well because the last 4 years, the Illini have been in the spotlight.

For this year, I truly feel this is an Elite 8-type team. The Gonzaga example is a great one--I'd love for that to be the next step for Illinois basketball.
 
#634      
I remember a few “good riddance” posts but I don’t recall a bunch of people saying that. He was a huge loss and I pin that squarely on Brad’s shoulders. He mismanaged, and quite frankly, f@&$%* up that whole situation and it started early on in that season.
Morez signed a financial agreement to return. He then received a larger offer from Michigan. So Brad went to donors to secure a larger financial package. Morez then signed a second financial agreement to return. Afterwards, Morez came back a third time asking for another increase in compensation and at that point it was no longer feasible to meet his demands. But yes, it’s all Brad’s fault.
 
#635      
Morez signed a financial agreement to return. He then received a larger offer from Michigan. So Brad went to donors to secure a larger financial package. Morez then signed a second financial agreement to return. Afterwards, Morez came back a third time asking for another increase in compensation and at that point it was no longer feasible to meet his demands. But yes, it’s all Brad’s fault.

Came back a third time???? I never heard that one..
 
#636      
I guess the question is whether it’s preferred to be a program like Gonzaga that gets close but never gets it done or a program like Baylor or Syracuse that has won a title, but now is not close to that level.

Personally, I’m tired of being in the conversation of “biggest/best program not to have won a title”. Win a championship, then we can be content with what Gonzaga has achieved.
I prefer to be a program like Duke or Kansas where good coaches would leave a decent P4 school to take a coaching job at Illinois. I agree with you. I am also tired of being in the conversation of biggest/best program to have not won a title.
 
#637      
Came back a third time???? I never heard that one..
I want to make sure I’m explaining that correctly. As far as I understand, Morez:

- Signed an agreement
- Asked for more money
- Signed a second agreement
- Asked for more money

So he wanted a third financial agreement, but only asked for more money a second time.
 
#638      
I want to make sure I’m explaining that correctly. As far as I understand, Morez:

- Signed an agreement
- Asked for more money
- Signed a second agreement
- Asked for more money

So he wanted a third financial agreement, but only asked for more money a second time.
If a player is not going to honor a signed agreement, then I'm with the Admin decision to cut bait regardless of how good that player turns out..
 
#640      
Happy March 1St GIF
 
#641      
I wholeheartedly agree. Focus on pounding Oregon and Maryland--regaining that confidence.

If they can stay a two seed, their "potential" opponents in a "possible" S16 game could be PU, Nebraska, Kansas, Gonzaga & MSU.

All these games are winnable for the Illini, imo. If they become a three seed, I sense a possible S16 matchup with a Florida.

In the end, though, as you posit, need to focus on Oregon.

I get flashbacks to the football season when I kept trying to figure out how to by whatever seed and what needed to happen to make it to the playoff - when that wasn’t really the overall point

Just regroup. Win some games. And when you play well, let everything else fall where it may
 
#642      
Michigan is a team that was hard to mismatch hunt against.
There were a couple of times Mirk had a guard posted up and no one on the perimeter even looked his way. (I think Mara was out or on the perimeter.). Hopefully we can work on some entry passes into the post and quick moves for all of the players to go up right away and take advantage of post mismatches.
 
#643      
I understand everyone wants to give Andrej his walking papers given his last couple of games. But we desperately need his athleticism against the top level teams. If we don’t figure out how to get good Andrej back going again we can forget about winning a second weekend game (or maybe even getting to the second weekend).

What is good Andrej ?

He can’t shoot … He doesn’t rebound … He drives into double teams and turns it over … He doesn’t consistently defend …

What exactly does he do that warrants PT at this point ?
 
#645      
What is good Andrej ?

He can’t shoot … He doesn’t rebound … He drives into double teams and turns it over … He doesn’t consistently defend …

What exactly does he do that warrants PT at this point ?
He just had 17 and 7 against MSU a few weeks ago. Many games in double digits and 5+ rebounds. And he actually had some great defensive performances shutting guys down when Kylan was out — remember the whole 1A stopper talk. (I’ll put aside big offensive performances against Texas Tech and Alabama when we ran more offense through him.)

Last couple of games have been rough. And he’s an imperfect player for sure. But we desperately need some athleticism on the court. If Andre is locked in he makes us better defensively for sure, and he can put the ball in the hole.

I see this like when Tre White was benched last year. I recall Tre being bad in a few limited minute performances, but it became clear we were just too slow and unathletic without him out there. I see the same thing without AS against good, athletic teams.
 
#646      
There were a couple of times Mirk had a guard posted up and no one on the perimeter even looked his way. (I think Mara was out or on the perimeter.). Hopefully we can work on some entry passes into the post and quick moves for all of the players to go up right away and take advantage of post mismatches.
I am watching the Indiana Michigan State game. On the first possession of the game MSU ran action and entered the ball to the post, who immediately got fouled.
 
#647      
There were a couple of times Mirk had a guard posted up and no one on the perimeter even looked his way. (I think Mara was out or on the perimeter.). Hopefully we can work on some entry passes into the post and quick moves for all of the players to go up right away and take advantage of post mismatches.
At this point, we are what we are. We're nearly 30 games into the season. We aren't likely to develop a post game now.
 
#649      
At this point, we are what we are. We're nearly 30 games into the season. We aren't likely to develop a post game now.
I agree with you here. You can change mentality or emphasis with 2 regular season games to go. Part of what helps Brad recruit is he's adopted the NBA philosophy of getting shots off. Who can argue with it when we're pumping guys into the first round of the NBA draft? It's a huge recruiting pitch because it's proven to make guys millions and having them live their dreams, but I don't think it's necessarily great for building a dominant college team.

We've adopted the Euro style of play, which is built around supreme skill vs supreme strength and athleticism. It's really a glaring weakness when we look at the games we lost this year and going back to our loss to Kentucky last year. Speed, quickness and athleticism is our kryptonite.

I'm hoping that we move away from this style next year, but who knows what that'd do to recruiting. If you're a wing or guard, it's like fishing with dynamite recruiting. If you're a true big, it would take a lot of convincing that the offense would be a fit. The Morez situation is going to be a living room weapon against us.
 
#650      
Yeah, no use for a guy averaging 13 ppg.

Nearly all of his points come from the line …

He can’t create for himself and can’t make open shots …

And most all of his “good games” … Come from us blowing out bottom half Big Ten teams …

MSU, Tx Tech and Bama come to mind as good games when we needed him to step up … Otherwise, he hasn’t …

No show against Michigan, UCLA, Nebraska, Purdue, Tennessee, UConn …

Need more from your “alpha”/highest paid guy …
 
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