I think Smith is also a special case in that he switched sports and quickly became an outstanding player at the high school level, in large part because he's a big athletic guard that could dominate on that basis. He's clearly having trouble with the speed and size of the college game at the high major level. I don't think his ceiling is lower because of it --it's just a case of can he figure out what works at this level, and keep improving his skills to catch up with his physical gifts. My expectation is that the light will go on, but I expect he's frustrated with it.
Michigan State 87, Illinois 74 POSTGAME
I think Smith is also a special case in that he switched sports and quickly became an outstanding player at the high school level, in large part because he's a big athletic guard that could dominate on that basis. He's clearly having trouble with the speed and size of the college game at the high major level. I don't think his ceiling is lower because of it --it's just a case of can he figure out what works at this level, and keep improving his skills to catch up with his physical gifts. My expectation is that the light will go on, but I expect he's frustrated with it.
I thought the game plan and defense were brilliant. They are bigger and more talented. Isn't MSU top 10 in the country in 3pt %? Would much rather give up a couple back door cuts than have them go off from 3.
They were 17 of 19 from the line in the second half and Frazier and Finke were a combined 1 for 12 on three pointers. We got the people we wanted shooting a bunch of pretty open shots.
Loved the effort.
They were 17 of 19 from the line in the second half and Frazier and Finke were a combined 1 for 12 on three pointers. We got the people we wanted shooting a bunch of pretty open shots.
Loved the effort.
IlliniDent
- Chicago, IL
Guessing you didn’t hear anything Izzo said right after the game about how that was one of the hardest fights he’s had all game and how we remind him of when he got to MSU and was trying to build a team with a culture and identity....
IlliniDent
- Chicago, IL
I think he still needs a lot of offseason work on strength, quickness, and flexibility in terms of being a basketball athlete vs a baseball athlete. The more he improves that the better he will get as well. The game is starting to slow down for him but he’s definitely not there yet.
ILL in IA
- Iowa City
In regards to Smith, I don't think we have a lineup that can use his size and strength as a mismatch right now. Teams can guard him with size and athletic ability because it's not needed against anyone else in our lineup. If Alstork commanded more attention from the opposing team D, I think Smith could get matched up with a smaller guard and take advantage of that.
t7nich
- Central IL
The game plan almost worked. We fought hard and hung with the #6 team in the country for most of the game. Not much you can do when you’re undersized and going up against multiple NBA guys, and Izzo.
Smith is a talented kid, he's having a tough freshman season, but he's only going to improve. Staff has some work to do on getting him better and getting him some good looks on offense. The offense is slowly starting to come together, but IMO there are still way too many moments where we run the offense and get 0 clean looks. Also, what’s with our transition offense? We’re supposed to be creating offense from defense, but my god I cringe anytime we get a fast break opportunity (unless it’s Frazier). Seems like this is a personnel thing and not a coaching thing. Ayo, you’re table is ready.
Smith is a talented kid, he's having a tough freshman season, but he's only going to improve. Staff has some work to do on getting him better and getting him some good looks on offense. The offense is slowly starting to come together, but IMO there are still way too many moments where we run the offense and get 0 clean looks. Also, what’s with our transition offense? We’re supposed to be creating offense from defense, but my god I cringe anytime we get a fast break opportunity (unless it’s Frazier). Seems like this is a personnel thing and not a coaching thing. Ayo, you’re table is ready.
JFGsCoffeeMug
BU:1 Trash cans:0
- Chicago
Tip of the hat to Trent Frazier: he's improved dramatically in his ability to finish layups. Hardly plays like a freshman any more.
Again, disclaimer that I generally don't know the nuances of things like this, but it definitely seemed to the naked eye that Mark Smith played better on defense last night. Obviously still made mistakes, but that's a freshman for ya (especially one that just started focusing on basketball not long ago).
I have a feeling that trying to learn defense better is having an effect on his confidence and that is affecting other parts of his game. Still needs to learn things on offense, but I just have a gut feeling that as his defense improves, so will the rest of his game. But it's gonna take time.
I have a feeling that trying to learn defense better is having an effect on his confidence and that is affecting other parts of his game. Still needs to learn things on offense, but I just have a gut feeling that as his defense improves, so will the rest of his game. But it's gonna take time.
mattcoldagelli
- The Transfer Portal with Do Not Contact Tag
Thought that was Mark Smith's best game in months. He was looking pretty comfortable when he picked up that second foul in the first half, which was a bummer.
Smith is a perfect example to have back door plays/screen cuts to basket ran for him...he has the body to take physical play, but is not quick enough to get shots on his own.
There were several back cut passes missed in last nights game as well, so teach when to pass, and whom to pass too...Smith should be one of them.
MSU knew exactly how we were going to come out defensively and we still made them very uncomfortable. They clearly won the battle, but we made it a war. The energy and effort on that side of the ball was excellent especially coming off a clunker in Madison.
IF.....this continues to be the Kipper we need, and NOT the one we have mostly gotten so far, then I for one will be corrected in my assessment of his play/abilities.
I still do not think he is as athletic as many articles/writers/fans make him out to be though.
Ransom Stoddard
Ordained Dudeist Priest
- Bloomington, IL
Yeah, but St. Johns lost to Mizzou, and we beat Mizzou, so....
On paper there seem to be a lot of similarities between how our and St. Johns' season is going.
Looking forward to the day when we have something to be excited about besides moral victories. Never thought I would see the program fall to this point. On the positive no where to go but up
Joel Goodson
- dawgville
Well, we'll always have this: we're the champions of hot takes! If you go into a gunfight with a knife, you're going to lose. Pretty simple stuff. Not absolving the staff (especially for what transpired in Madison), but we need more horses!
That was a tremendous team effort yesterday, might be the first game I re-watch this year. MSU likely has two NBA lottery picks this spring and a roster of experienced 4 star players. The Illini team fought hard yesterday, but the talent and size discrepancy are two deviations to the right of us.
For the many who complain of about Kipper, I have never seen attitude or play that made me think he can't be one of our top players. In fact, I think only Black, Frazier, and Kipper have the current game and physical tools to play against top 25 teams. Ebo, Smith, and Damonte all show they can contribute off the bench and be very good players in the future. Tejon, Finke, and Alstork could be players that could be good contributing off the bench but have been starters for the most part.
We can be a good competitive next year with the addition of 1-2 athletic bigs. I think our guards will be better than most teams we play next year. Hoping Kipper can slide to the 3 and play along Black and an athletic big.
For the many who complain of about Kipper, I have never seen attitude or play that made me think he can't be one of our top players. In fact, I think only Black, Frazier, and Kipper have the current game and physical tools to play against top 25 teams. Ebo, Smith, and Damonte all show they can contribute off the bench and be very good players in the future. Tejon, Finke, and Alstork could be players that could be good contributing off the bench but have been starters for the most part.
We can be a good competitive next year with the addition of 1-2 athletic bigs. I think our guards will be better than most teams we play next year. Hoping Kipper can slide to the 3 and play along Black and an athletic big.
I think Smith is going to need to get quicker and faster, possibly the game slows down for him next year as well. He isn't making shots or plays that we saw him make in high school even when left unguarded at the college level.
BananaShampoo
Captain 'Paign
- Phoenix, AZ
Please don't ever say that. As football has shown, it can always get worse.
Game summary briefs - positives: 15 fewer turnovers, 3 more steals, and nice game for Kipper with 27; negatives: 22 fewer rebounds, 14 fewer FTA, and B1G loss #8. Pretty hard to beat a team shooting 68% for the game, yet gotta play better overall to win.
http://fightingillini.com/documents/2018/1/22/MSU_87_Illinois_74.pdf
http://fightingillini.com/documents/2018/1/22/MSU_87_Illinois_74.pdf
You're right that it's hard to be worse than 0-8, but it's not hard to be worse than 10-3 in non-con. Consider that they easily could have lost against TN Martin, Austin Peay, Mizzou, and Grand Canyon. I do not think that this team coached by Groce wins all four of those. Look at this team play this year, and compare it to last year's. There's a big difference in the quality of play that I'm seeing. There's no hero ball. Last year the offense was pass around the arc and then give it to Malcolm with 5 seconds left so he could play hero ball. I'm not seeing that nearly as much this year. I'm not happy about the losses, and neither is anyone else, but at least I'm seeing an identity and a culture change in this team. I firmly believe that Underwood is a better coach than Groce.
Not sure people realize the talent on that MSU team. It just might be the best that Izzo has assembled and gosh knows he has had some great ones. I LOL at the people on here a few years ago talking about his recruiting demise. See below 247 rankings!!
Jackson, Jr--#8
Bridges--#12
Langford--#19
Ward---#42
McQuaid--#71
Nairn-#103
Tillman--#111
And we are trying to combat that with #515 EBo.
Jackson, Jr--#8
Bridges--#12
Langford--#19
Ward---#42
McQuaid--#71
Nairn-#103
Tillman--#111
And we are trying to combat that with #515 EBo.
Kind of tired of hearing we are one or two bigs short of competiting next year. Where are the two bigs for next year coming from? Right now we have one elite recruit for 18. Hate to say it but any bigs we get in spring signing are probably going to be projects who won’t help next year. We will be lucky to get one let alone two fifth year transfers who can help. If we compete next year we will have to do it with a lack of size
Deleted member 654622
D
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And WAY better shooting!
Ransom Stoddard
Ordained Dudeist Priest
- Bloomington, IL
Hopefully Juco and/or transfer.
Would you like cheese on the burger with your drive-thru order? Standby - next season hasn't arrived and we're not done recruiting yet.
opcorn: