Nebraska 78, Illinois 67 POSTGAME

#101      

Soxfreak64

Soxfreak64
Bloomington
Soxfreak64
SFH was mausoleum and the Illini played like they were at a funeral. I'm only going to rub this in once:

"Glynn Watson is overrated"
"Jaylon Tate is gonna be good this year"
"Tate just needs more time"
"Watson isn't a B1G PG"

That was half the recruiting thread last year. I warned everybody that Watson was gonna be good and questioned why Groce didn't want him; got some rude PM's. All I have to say to those who sent them?

Told you so.
 
#102      

skyIdub

skyIdub
Winged Warrior
skyIdub
Soxfreak64 said:
SFH was mausoleum and the Illini played like they were at a funeral. I'm only going to rub this in once:

"Glynn Watson is overrated"
"Jaylon Tate is gonna be good this year"
"Tate just needs more time"
"Watson isn't a B1G PG"

That was half the recruiting thread last year. I warned everybody that Watson was gonna be good and questioned why Groce didn't want him; got some rude PM's. All I have to say to those who sent them?

Told you so.
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Dish that crow! You don't have to read through too many posts to realize there are many posters here that have absolutely no clue what they are talking about. I've read three or four in this thread alone that make me weep for humanity. Zero perspective. Zero clue. I've seen them on the road too, texting and driving. Also in McDonalds, staring at the menu like it's this brand new thing full of tough choices.
 
#103      

LurkLongandProsper

L
C-U
LurkLongandProsper
Jreed322 said:
It's one game for Watson and one game for djw and Jordan. It's easy to project right now based off that but our freshman have done a lot of good things this year especially JCL who you conspicuously left out.
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I didn't ignore JCL to prove any point. He's playing with a much higher degree of confidence than the other two.

That said, it's not "just one game" for AJ and DJW.

Per-game stats for each team's freshmen (JCL, AJ, DJW, Morrow, Mcveigh, Watson):

Jalen Coleman-Lands: 23.1 MPG, 9.1 PPG, 40.5% FG, 40.9% 3PT, 70% FT, 1.6 RPG, 0.8 APG, 0.6 SPG, 1.3 TO

Aaron Jordan: 14.8 MPG, 4.4 PPG, 31.7% FG, 32.6% 3PT, 85.7% FT, 1.1 RPG, 0.8 APG, 0.6 SPG, 0.2 TO

DJ Williams: 9.7 MPG, 1.5 PPG, 27.3% FG, 0% 3PT, 53.8% FT, 1.3 RPG, 0.2 APG, 0.2 SPG, 0.6 TO

As a trio: 15PPG, 4 RPG, 1.8 APG, 1.4 SPG, 2.1 TO


Glynn Watson: 21.1 MPG, 7.3 PPG, 36.4% FG, 27.8% 3PT, 76.5% FT, 1.9 RPG, 2.7 APG, 1.3 SPG, 1.0 TO

Ed Morrow: 13.6 MPG, 3.8 PPG, 61.7% FG, 52.6% FT, 3.4 RPG, .1 APG, 0.0 SPG, 1.1 TO

Jack McVeigh: 17.2 MPG, 5.4 PPG, 37.2% FG, 32.7% 3PT, 65.2% FT, 3.1 RPG, 1.1 APG, 0.6 SPG, 0.8 TO

As a trio: 16.5 PPG, 5.1 RPG, 3.9 APG, 1.9 SPG, 2.9 TO

Here were their composite rankings per 24/7:

Glynn Watson - 77
Ed Morrow - 112
Jack McVeigh - 318

Jalen Coleman-Lands - 37
DJ Williams - 78
Aaron Jordan - 117

But that's just numbers. Are you really going to say Aaron Jordan or DJ Williams have looked remotely comfortable in ANY B10 games this season, or more than 1-2 noncons a piece? JCL has been good, but Glynn Watson is way ahead of him, as we saw today. JCL hasn't done anything at all off the bounce. Morrow played good defense and attacked the glass - something none of our freshmen have done consistently, let alone for 28 minutes. It's also important to note that their freshmen are making more of an impact even before the scoring than ours.
 
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#105      

Soxfreak64

Soxfreak64
Bloomington
Soxfreak64
Didn't see anything from Morrow we didn't get from Leron as a freshman. Not bothered by that pass.

Malcolm Hill played great today, 2nd half free throws being the sole exception. Made some unstoppable shots today and did great job setting the table for others. If he had more athleticism, he'd be a surefire NBA guy. Love watching Hill play.
 
#106      

LurkLongandProsper

L
C-U
LurkLongandProsper
Soxfreak64 said:
Didn't see anything from Morrow we didn't get from Leron as a freshman. Not bothered by that pass.

Malcolm Hill played great today, 2nd half free throws being the sole exception. Made some unstoppable shots today and did great job setting the table for others. If he had more athleticism, he'd be a surefire NBA guy. Love watching Hill play.
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Leron Black has played exactly one game with more than 28 minutes (what Morrow played today). Morrow also only had 2 fouls in his 28 minutes.

Malcolm has been great, I do agree with that. I do have issues with some of his shot selection; however
 
#107      

Illini B-Ball Fan

Illini B-Ball Fan
Illini B-Ball Fan
LurkLongandProsper said:
Leron Black has played exactly one game with more than 28 minutes (what Morrow played today). Morrow also only had 2 fouls in his 28 minutes.

Malcolm has been great, I do agree with that. I do have issues with some of his shot selection; however
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Unfortunately, Malcolm appears to be forcing shots to try and compensate for the rest of the team's deficiencies - it's supposed to be a five-man team effort when working efficiently to be balanced.
 
#108      

muskyman99

M
muskyman99
1. Are we 100 percent sure that Watson liked UI and Groce didn't want him? As I have said before Groce was a 50-50 coach at Ohio and his sweet sixteen run put him on the radar. He may have been a good recruiter for Matta but the head coach finalizes the deal. By the way, Matta can coach. In fact I have a tough time finding another B1G coach that I would not take over Groce. Groce is a good man but he was our third or fourth choice. I am going to sit back and hopefully watch our freshman continue to develope for next year. That's my only goal and that way I will live for another season.
 
#109      

LurkLongandProsper

L
C-U
LurkLongandProsper
muskyman99 said:
1. Are we 100 percent sure that Watson liked UI and Groce didn't want him? As I have said before Groce was a 50-50 coach at Ohio and his sweet sixteen run put him on the radar. He may have been a good recruiter for Matta but the head coach finalizes the deal. By the way, Matta can coach. In fact I have a tough time finding another B1G coach that I would not take over Groce. Groce is a good man but he was our third or fourth choice. I am going to sit back and hopefully watch our freshman continue to develope for next year. That's my only goal and that way I will live for another season.
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I tend to agree with the bolded.

I think the list I WOULDN'T take over Groce is as follows (typing this one out because it's shorter):

Pat Chambers

Eddie Jordan

Richard Pitino

Greg Gard

That's it on the for sure list. Tim Miles is a toss-up.
 
#110      

Hoppy2105

H
Little Rock, Arkansas
Hoppy2105
If you haven't already, you might want to emotionally detach yourself from this season. The injuries to start it off left us in a hole that has helped create inconsistency and a trend I don't think we will pull out of. Groce may get another year, and if he does, let's use that one as his final grade.

Also, not sure if this will make some of you sad or will lift your spirits with a memory of what once was, but when I contemplate our struggles or after a rough game, I go watch the "comeback." It makes me feel good inside. :thumb: Link below.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XTbE4eC-AIc
 
#111      

IlliniFoLife

I
IlliniFoLife
Soxfreak64 said:
Didn't see anything from Morrow we didn't get from Leron as a freshman. Not bothered by that pass.

Malcolm Hill played great today, 2nd half free throws being the sole exception. Made some unstoppable shots today and did great job setting the table for others. If he had more athleticism, he'd be a surefire NBA guy. Love watching Hill play.
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Morrow doesn't foul and make stupid decisions. That already puts him at Leron's level. Now, if he makes leaps in his game, he will end up being better than Leron. There's nothing about how Leron played last year that screams excitement, especially if he is spending 1/2 the game on the bench in foul trouble b/c he is undisciplined.
 
#113      

temperedexpectations

T
temperedexpectations
Hoppy2105 said:
If you haven't already, you might want to emotionally detach yourself from this season. The injuries to start it off left us in a hole that has helped create inconsistency and a trend I don't think we will pull out of. Groce may get another year, and if he does, let's use that one as his final grade.

Also, not sure if this will make some of you sad or will lift your spirits with a memory of what once was, but when I contemplate our struggles or after a rough game, I go watch the "comeback." It makes me feel good inside. :thumb: Link below.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XTbE4eC-AIc
Click to expand...


My very being is detachment.
 
#114      

Illiniaaron

I
Geneseo, IL
Illiniaaron
Before the Michigan game I had the over-under on Illini conference wins at 6. That looks optimistic at this point.
 
#115      

HeartofaChampion

H
HeartofaChampion
Disappointing lack of intensity today. Realize JG was pursuing Evans and Brunson, but Watson would be a significant upgrade over JT with a bright future. Oh well. With the spate of injuries, this is the way the rest of the season will play out (up and down) unless MT and LB return. If we knew the NCAA would grant MT a sixth year of eligibility and that MT would want to come back, we should shelve him for next year.
 
#116      

illini80

illini80
Forgottonia
illini80
HeartofaChampion said:
Disappointing lack of intensity today. Realize JG was pursuing Evans and Brunson, but Watson would be a significant upgrade over JT with a bright future. Oh well. With the spate of injuries, this is the way the rest of the season will play out (up and down) unless MT and LB return. If we knew the NCAA would grant MT a sixth year of eligibility and that MT would want to come back, we should shelve him for next year.
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According to Tate today, the sixth year should be a lock, but also said he is close to being back and wants to play this year.
 
#117      

jrichisamazing

J
jrichisamazing
LurkLongandProsper said:
Oh, by no means am I saying we are better than them (similar/equal at best), but they aren't good. They are very similar to us, I agree. What I don't understand is how their freshman are playing with so much more confidence than ours. DJ and AJ look scared - Watson was playing like a senior. His finish through contact to put them back up 8 or 10 towards the end? Wow. They're just not a team we can afford to lose to at home.
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I think we do have more talent than them, but the difference is they are more balanced. Right now we are just a team full of shooters. DJ should be red shirting this year. I don't think AJ is playing scared at all, he's just forcing it too much. But back to the balance thing, how much easier would AJ's and JCL's job be if they had a PG to create or a C who collapsed defenses? Unfortunately we have both of those sitting on the bench.
 
#118      

Deleted member 586966

D
Guest
Deleted member 586966
jrichisamazing said:
I think we do have more talent than them, but the difference is they are more balanced. Right now we are just a team full of shooters. DJ should be red shirting this year. I don't think AJ is playing scared at all, he's just forcing it too much. But back to the balance thing, how much easier would AJ's and JCL's job be if they had a PG to create or a C who collapsed defenses? Unfortunately we have both of those sitting on the bench.
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They would help but if you're placing the burden of being a savior on Abrams and Thorne you're bound to be disappointed. They're ok yet unremarkable players. Even if this team was fully healthy all year, making the bubble would be a toss up.
 
#119      

themudflap

T
themudflap
Watson and Morrow played like Illinois high school players pissed off the home school passed on them. Both players would make us better. Watson as he is a much better pg than JT. Morrow as he does the dirty work and we do not have that. How do you let two guys go better than JT and not recruit a kid much better than all of them? For a guy that needs a pg bad for his 'system' to work, it makes no sense. JG better learn soon that you take guys like Watson and Morrow because they are from Illinois and probably, can play. It is those guys mixed in with the superstars that get you to FF's.
 
#120      

jrichisamazing

J
jrichisamazing
themudflap said:
Watson and Morrow played like Illinois high school players pissed off the home school passed on them. Both players would make us better. Watson as he is a much better pg than JT. Morrow as he does the dirty work and we do not have that. How do you let two guys go better than JT and not recruit a kid much better than all of them? For a guy that needs a pg bad for his 'system' to work, it makes no sense. JG better learn soon that you take guys like Watson and Morrow because they are from Illinois and probably, can play. It is those guys mixed in with the superstars that get you to FF's.
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I still think Watson may have told Groce he wasn't coming to UI because he clearly had the talent to at least be a plan C guy. But that's just a guess, maybe he completely whiffed on that one. The fun thing about recruiting is if TJL turns out to be a stud then nobody cares about missing Watson. As for Morrow, we already have that guy but he's injured. Morrow may have looked great in this game but that's because he played against a team with no C. He smelled blood in the water and took advantage of it.
 
#121      

Cymoin

C
Cymoin
Something I think everyone is missing

All this talk about passing or missing on recruits like Watson and Morrow...one of the byproducts of going after all these 4 & 5 star players is that you only have so many schollys and if you offer the 3 star kid and they accept, that likely takes the 4/5 star off the board. So ILL holds off on offering many of these 3 star players until they are sure the higher rated players are opting to go elsewhere. The problem is that we are not going to get a high %age of those offers because most of the 4/5 guys are going to take their time and most 3 star players will not wait. The Pickett commitment is a perfect example. Javon has already committed because look at his other offers...ILL is his best option. Don't even start to think this guy is going to create a domino effect. I have always held that the way to build your program is to show you can coach which is by taking 3 star guys who have a chip on their shoulder and are ready to commit and who fit the identity you want to establish...and win with those guys. And when you start getting some of those to the NBA, then you can confidently go after the 4/5 stars.
 
#122      

Deleted member 11241

D
Guest
Deleted member 11241
I really wish someone could provide a link where Morrow and Watson stated they wanted to come to Illinois but we backed off. Because I have been following these boards for 5 years and I have yet to see proof of that. All I read is hearsay. Maybe it was posted before and I had the flu, but I highly doubt that. So can we squash the rumors that we backed off, when in fact nobody really knows what happened. I also really hope that someday, some of these coaching experts gets a chance to coach at the D1 level so we can really see what they know
 
#123      

IlliniFoLife

I
IlliniFoLife
Cymoin said:
All this talk about passing or missing on recruits like Watson and Morrow...one of the byproducts of going after all these 4 & 5 star players is that you only have so many schollys and if you offer the 3 star kid and they accept, that likely takes the 4/5 star off the board. So ILL holds off on offering many of these 3 star players until they are sure the higher rated players are opting to go elsewhere. The problem is that we are not going to get a high %age of those offers because most of the 4/5 guys are going to take their time and most 3 star players will not wait. The Pickett commitment is a perfect example. Javon has already committed because look at his other offers...ILL is his best option. Don't even start to think this guy is going to create a domino effect. I have always held that the way to build your program is to show you can coach which is by taking 3 star guys who have a chip on their shoulder and are ready to commit and who fit the identity you want to establish...and win with those guys. And when you start getting some of those to the NBA, then you can confidently go after the 4/5 stars.
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Problem is this: John Groce has not gotten a single player to the NBA. He needs some luck, like what Johnny Jones at LSU got with Ben Simmons. Even with Ben Simmons, LSU is struggling to stay on the bubble although they've gotten some good wins recently. What does that tell you about their coach? I feel that we are in a similar situation, albeit, at least Groce has had a little more success when it comes to the NCAA's.
 
#124      

karmapoliceman

karmapoliceman
STL, MO
karmapoliceman
:congrats: I thought we would win after being in Champaign for 10 days in a row.

No road games. No travel. Just a bunch of 3 point attempts with a low conversion rate and no adjustments.

What a joke. Foolishly optimistic after the Purdue game.

When Tim Miles is coaching circles around you as the road team (spare me the injuries: how many 4 star recruits did he bag this past season? How many did we pursue for them to go to NEB?), there's an issue.

That rotation of Austin, Tate, and a couple of other non-scoring threats with 16 to go in the first half was a complete joke and indictment if the JFG era. Sorry I can't recall specifics on the particular abomination.

The thing I don't understand is how great we were defensively JFG's 2nd season with Ekey. Yeah, we had Abrams and Egwu. Were those two absolutely essential to playing team D (I miss the latter more and more every game from that perspective)?

Oh well. We'll get better or something.
 
#125      

Monte Carlo

Monte Carlo
Monte Carlo
I do understand all the injuries this season etc., but the bottom line is this team is, like his teams of the last couple of years, so frustratingly inconsistent. We are a terrible rebounding team because we don't make a effort. I don't know if Groce tells them not to attempt to rebound on the offensive end because that is exactly what it looks like on every shot attempt. The shot goes up and every Illini player is headed the other way. Those are things Groce should be able to address and hasn't. Couple that with some of the most ridiculous lineups over the last couple of games and you have recipe for disaster. Injuries or no injuries, barring a dramatic turnaround, our new AD will give Groce the heave-ho and get someone new.