Nebraska 83, Illinois 80 Postgame

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#901      
LouDou
LouDou said:
What is this?
13IllinoisB108-3+26.32126.0399.74068.4194-.046266+8.4128112.631104.228+4.3974
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If I have misinterpreted the meaning of these numbers, my apologies.

But, while we are net #3, it seems to me there are many gremlins lurking below that number. For example, our tempo ranking, which I mentioned, and our offensive ranking based on our overall schedule - which looks to me like it is #31.

Post #821 summarized things quite nicely. Our good is probably not good enough, which is a much better, and more accurate way of stating the point I was trying to make.

I said we are not good - which is not exactly accurate (frustration surfacing).

I should have said...not good enough based on the reasons I put forth - has been true and probably true again.

I should give the devil his due - we have won the Big 10 and that is a big deal.
 
#902      
LouDou
LouDou said:
If I have misinterpreted the meaning of these numbers, my apologies.

But, while we are net #3, it seems to me there are many gremlins lurking below that number. For example, our tempo ranking, which I mentioned, and our offensive ranking based on our overall schedule - which looks to me like it is #31.

Post #821 summarized things quite nicely. Our good is probably not good enough, which is a much better, and more accurate way of stating the point I was trying to make.

I said we are not good - which is not exactly accurate (frustration surfacing).

I should have said...not good enough based on the reasons I put forth - has been true and probably true again.

I should give the devil his due - we have won the Big 10 and that is a big deal.
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Yep. Okay i see it now.

I still don't feel any better. I guess we will see how the season goes.

Not a big fan of Taylor Swift either.
 
#903      
LouDou
LouDou said:
Yep. Okay i see it now.

I still don't feel any better. I guess we will see how the season goes.

Not a big fan of Taylor Swift either.
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One more question...

Do these rankings and adjustments contain conference biases?
 
#904      
FlyinIllini1
Chase321 said:
You must not be watching him play when he’s been in.
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PSA-TO ALL OF THE PEOPLE HATING ON MIHAILO PETROVICH:

The kid hasn’t played more than 3 consecutive minutes, not more than 16 min in a game (12 points and 4 assists should have been 10 assists). And 7 min in the last 3 games…. If you go back and watch tape, take a look at how often MP has the ball in his hands. (more than KB and KW). Guys are CONSTANTLY looking to get it to him. There’s a high level of trust from his teammates that ‘he is the guy who will create and make things happen.’ Is he lacking defensively? Yes. But so is the entire team…that’s not a justifiable excuse anymore.

In what world is a ball dominant PG expected to feel comfortable & get into a rhythm when he’s terrified to make a mistake + hasn’t been afforded more than 3 consecutive min?

We all know Brad doesn’t like MP because of his defense but NOBODY played defense against Nebraska. Yet Jake Davis and Ben Humrichous are getting extended run time every game?!? Bottom line- MP is the only true PG we have and an elite passer/distributor who makes guys around him better and shoots better than most of the guys out there. And yes I get it, MP plays a different position than those guys….doesnt matter. You can find a way to get all 3 guys — MP, KB and KW — minutes if you really want to.

Imagine Keaton’s ceiling when he doesn’t have to dig deep in his bag to get every bucket. MP can get him high %, open looks, while reducing the pressure on him from his current ball handling duties. & KB isn’t a PG. Never has been. He actually thrives off ball.

So far, Mihailo has been nothing but a scape goat for BU. It’s impossible not to notice his mistakes because every time he makes a mistake, he is immediately benched for the game. It actually doesn’t even have to be him that makes a mistake. In the UConn game he was benched for a botched PnR coverage by Humrichous.

He has the shortest leash in Brads history with Illinois and it doesn’t make sense.

NOTHING should be set in stone rn. Coaching staff has a LOT to figure out, and should be trying various combinations to see what different actions look like, what works/doesn’t & identify what sticks

Just give him a REAL chance with EXTENDED minutes to show what he can do. And then we can all at least have a more valid opinion of why he’s great or why he sucks (he doesn’t). But for the love of god, ENOUGH of Humrichous & Davis 🤮🤢
 
#905      
the juiceman cometh
LouDou said:
If I have misinterpreted the meaning of these numbers, my apologies.

But, while we are net #3, it seems to me there are many gremlins lurking below that number. For example, our tempo ranking, which I mentioned, and our offensive ranking based on our overall schedule - which looks to me like it is #31.

Post #821 summarized things quite nicely. Our good is probably not good enough, which is a much better, and more accurate way of stating the point I was trying to make.

I said we are not good - which is not exactly accurate (frustration surfacing).

I should have said...not good enough based on the reasons I put forth - has been true and probably true again.

I should give the devil his due - we have won the Big 10 and that is a big deal.
Click to expand...
I already told you what it is. Post #816. The 112.6 is the average adjusted efficiency of our opponents' offenses, and #31 is where that metric (opponents' offense, not ours) ranks. You are just way off.

1765916168042.png


Also, you keep harping on tempo, but when UConn beat Purdue to win the Natty two years ago UConn ranked #330 in tempo and Purdue ranked #221. You can be a low tempo offense and still be good.
 
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#906      
LouDou
the juiceman cometh said:
I already told you what it is. Post #816. The 112.6 is the average adjusted efficiency of our opponents' offenses, and #31 is where that metric (opponents' offense, not ours) ranks. You are just way off.

View attachment 45762

Also, you keep harping on tempo, but when UConn beat Purdue to win the Natty two years ago UConn ranked #330 in tempo and Purdue ranked #221. You can be a low tempo offense and still be good.
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My comments about tempo are not about the number of possessions per 40 minutes, but about the tempo at which we run our offense...how quickly we move the ball, how many passes we have per possession, how hard we cut, how we screen on the ball, how we cut an screen off the ball. How hard we make it for the other team to guard us. How hard we make it for all five defensive players to play defense all at the same time. I'm talking about something different than what that statistic is illuminating.

If the goal is a Final Four or National Championship, I don't think what we are doing is going to get us there.

Honestly, I hope I am wrong about that.

You should hear me harp about our defense.

I fear we have reached our ceiling with Underwood.
 
#907      
the juiceman cometh
LouDou said:
My comments about tempo are not about the number of possessions per 40 minutes, but about the tempo at which we run our offense...how quickly we move the ball, how many passes we have per possession, how hard we cut, how we screen on the ball, how we cut an screen off the ball. How hard we make it for the other team to guard us. How hard we make it for all five defensive players to play defense all at the same time. I'm talking about something different than what that statistic is illuminating.
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Then why did you cite the Tempo ranking on Kenpom to make that point?

Also, if we are the third most efficient scoring team in the country, why is it particularly important how we get there? In an earlier post you complained that our ability to get to the line was masking our poor offense...but points scored from getting to the line count too and help us score more, so why is that bad? If you want to complain that our offense is not fun to watch, that's another conversation entire from whether it's good or bad.
 
#908      
Chase321
FlyinIllini1 said:
PSA-TO ALL OF THE PEOPLE HATING ON MIHAILO PETROVICH:

The kid hasn’t played more than 3 consecutive minutes, not more than 16 min in a game (12 points and 4 assists should have been 10 assists). And 7 min in the last 3 games…. If you go back and watch tape, take a look at how often MP has the ball in his hands. (more than KB and KW). Guys are CONSTANTLY looking to get it to him. There’s a high level of trust from his teammates that ‘he is the guy who will create and make things happen.’ Is he lacking defensively? Yes. But so is the entire team…that’s not a justifiable excuse anymore.

In what world is a ball dominant PG expected to feel comfortable & get into a rhythm when he’s terrified to make a mistake + hasn’t been afforded more than 3 consecutive min?

We all know Brad doesn’t like MP because of his defense but NOBODY played defense against Nebraska. Yet Jake Davis and Ben Humrichous are getting extended run time every game?!? Bottom line- MP is the only true PG we have and an elite passer/distributor who makes guys around him better and shoots better than most of the guys out there. And yes I get it, MP plays a different position than those guys….doesnt matter. You can find a way to get all 3 guys — MP, KB and KW — minutes if you really want to.

Imagine Keaton’s ceiling when he doesn’t have to dig deep in his bag to get every bucket. MP can get him high %, open looks, while reducing the pressure on him from his current ball handling duties. & KB isn’t a PG. Never has been. He actually thrives off ball.

So far, Mihailo has been nothing but a scape goat for BU. It’s impossible not to notice his mistakes because every time he makes a mistake, he is immediately benched for the game. It actually doesn’t even have to be him that makes a mistake. In the UConn game he was benched for a botched PnR coverage by Humrichous.

He has the shortest leash in Brads history with Illinois and it doesn’t make sense.

NOTHING should be set in stone rn. Coaching staff has a LOT to figure out, and should be trying various combinations to see what different actions look like, what works/doesn’t & identify what sticks

Just give him a REAL chance with EXTENDED minutes to show what he can do. And then we can all at least have a more valid opinion of why he’s great or why he sucks (he doesn’t). But for the love of god, ENOUGH of Humrichous & Davis 🤮🤢
Click to expand...

Defense is not the only reason. If he came in and took care of the ball then I’m sure he’d get more time. You just can’t come in and turn the ball over. Yet he is. In what game are you going to be ok with extra TOs because you wanted to give him a chance? The third issue is rebounding.

Brad and staff seem him play in practice every day. How you practice has a lot to do with if you get time. Brad has said this many times. You and I don’t see practice. If he was showing reliability in practice then I’m sure he’d be given more than a few minutes.
 
#910      
lstewart53x3
the juiceman cometh said:
Then why did you cite the Tempo ranking on Kenpom to make that point?

Also, if we are the third most efficient scoring team in the country, why is it particularly important how we get there? In an earlier post you complained that our ability to get to the line was masking our poor offense...but points scored from getting to the line count too and help us score more, so why is that bad? If you want to complain that our offense is not fun to watch, that's another conversation entire from whether it's good or bad.
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It’s an interesting conversation because if this team misses the S16 this year, it won’t be because of offense, it’ll be because of defense.

The Nebraska game moved us up 2 spots on offense but dropped us ~20 on defense.

To make the 2nd weekend, we really need to see the defense get into the top 20, while keeping offense top 10.
 
#911      
Scoregasm
lstewart53x3 said:
It’s an interesting conversation because if this team misses the S16 this year, it won’t be because of offense, it’ll be because of defense.

The Nebraska game moved us up 2 spots on offense but dropped us ~20 on defense.

To make the 2nd weekend, we really need to see the defense get into the top 20, while keeping offense top 10.
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It's mostly fixable stuff, so it will be extra frustrating if we aren't a top 25 defense in March.
 
#912      
OB positive
the juiceman cometh said:
I already told you what it is. Post #816. The 112.6 is the average adjusted efficiency of our opponents' offenses, and #31 is where that metric (opponents' offense, not ours) ranks. You are just way off.

View attachment 45762

Also, you keep harping on tempo, but when UConn beat Purdue to win the Natty two years ago UConn ranked #330 in tempo and Purdue ranked #221. You can be a low tempo offense and still be good.
Click to expand...
Well tempo isn't as big a deal when you have a monster post player and rim protector like they both had two years ago.
 
#913      
Fly Illini Fly!
lstewart53x3 said:
It’s an interesting conversation because if this team misses the S16 this year, it won’t be because of offense, it’ll be because of defense.

The Nebraska game moved us up 2 spots on offense but dropped us ~20 on defense.

To make the 2nd weekend, we really need to see the defense get into the top 20, while keeping offense top 10.
Click to expand...
Every national champion in the Kenpom era has had:

- a top 25 defense
- a top 40 offense

Our focus right now should absolutely be about improving the defense, while still recognizing that we’re fortunate enough to have an offense that’s capable of keeping us in most, if not all of our games (and one that, if accompanied by an adequate defense, can take us to an elite level). That guy’s complaints are just in the wrong place (and completely out of line).
 
#915      
WhereDoWeStandWithStorr?
Fly Illini Fly! said:
Every national champion in the Kenpom era has had:

- a top 25 defense
- a top 40 offense

Our focus right now should absolutely be about improving the defense, while still recognizing that we’re fortunate enough to have an offense that’s capable of keeping us in most, if not all of our games (and one that, if accompanied by an adequate defense, can take us to an elite level). That guy’s complaints are just in the wrong place (and completely out of line).
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I feel like that may be a bit of a problem though. If you constantly think you're good enough offensively to make up any of your flaws on the other end, you won't be motivated to get stops with your hair on fire.
 
#916      
Fly Illini Fly!
WhereDoWeStandWithStorr? said:
I feel like that may be a bit of a problem though. If you constantly think you're good enough offensively to make up any of your flaws on the other end, you won't be motivated to get stops with your hair on fire.
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My simple point was that we shouldn't be referring to the #3 offense in the nation as a bad offense, that's all (see the discussions above for reference if you may wish).

Especially given that we're fresh off a game scoring >1.2ppp. It's idiotic and irrelevant.
 
#918      
NarrowJ
Fly Illini Fly! said:
I actually think after today we'll move up to the #2 offense as LVille looks very inept thus far.
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I rewatched the Tenn game a few days ago (because I'm insane like that) and was amazed how good of looks we got against their defense... their bigs are physical, Okpara is a top-level shot blocker, and they have athletic defenders around the perimeter. I actually think with our combined effort on offense and defense in that particular game, that it should be our template moving forward.
 
#919      
mysterio2525
NarrowJ said:
I rewatched the Tenn game a few days ago (because I'm insane like that) and was amazed how good of looks we got against their defense... their bigs are physical, Okpara is a top-level shot blocker, and they have athletic defenders around the perimeter. I actually think with our combined effort on offense and defense in that particular game, that it should be our template moving forward.
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it's literally our best win as of today... and likely going to be top 3-5 of our wins by the end of the season. so I approve this message
 
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