Northwestern 70, Illinois 66 OT Postgame

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#476      
Oracle21
lstewart53x3 said:
The fact that this thread has 29k views, but the postgame thread for our win against Northwestern in football to go 9-3 and have our best season 15 years has just 22k views tells you everything you need to know.
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The NW football game wasn’t an upset loss. It was an expected outcome so there was less to discuss.

The NW basketball game was an upset loss, and thus more to discuss/question/concern.
 
#477      
BalloonsTheElephant
Second place is 1st loser said:
I think that the expectations need to be tempered because the unrealistic expectations are probably the reason for the board meltdown. As THIS point, this team is a LONG way from worrying about one loss being the difference in seeding and conference finish. The focus needs to be on improvement and growth as we move along.

Given the turnover and youth, a top 4 finish in conference and a 4, 5 or 6 seed would be a heck of a year and a phenomenal coaching job. I think that a more realistic expectation would be a 6th, 7th or 8th place conference finish and a 7 thru 10 seed in the tournament.

This feels very similar to the Matt Meyer team of a couple of years ago. We had some great wins, but some befuddling losses because BU was mixing and matching all season. He had to completely change is defensive philosophy and had the same issue with the launching of threes as the offense situation.

I think that we have a couple of supremely talented guys, but we have more holes than we probably have answers for this year. When you put 99% of your roster together on the fly, this is going to be the result 95% of the time. I despise how the off-season worked out and I'm hoping that we don't have to do it again next year. We should be supplementing a really good roster each year, not totally rebuilding it.

Yesterday's game is going to be a microcosm of the year. There are going to be a lot of wow moments mixed in with a lot of what the heck was that moments.

That was a long post.
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I'm going to be honest, I only read like the first paragraph. ADHD millennial here, sorry.

In my mind this team losing to Northwestern in early December doesn't hurt them for what this team was built for, and what they were built for was winning in March. My statement is purely about the effect it has on the conference championship and maybe the difference in seeding in the NCAA tournament. That could impact how far we go. The difference of a 3 seed vs 4 seed is playing UConn in the Elite 8 vs the Sweet 16.

I'm on board for the rollercoaster ride this season will be.
 
#478      
2qtslow
OrangeKrush1981 said:
Selecting Riley in the first round next June is NOT dumb. It is adventurous though. I've seen FAR worse picks made. The kid can play. He's not remotely ready for the next level yet, though. It seems evident he will on-and-off struggle at the collegiate level, this year. But if a team invests early? Maybe that's smart. I'd love to have him back next year, if he decides to be back.
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I have just a little less than zero inside information on this, but based on what I have read here, the argument is that Will won't declare for the draft if it looks like he will be a low first round pick. His mom wants him to stay for another year, get coached up by Fletch and Brad, and then go as a lottery pick in the following year of a much less loaded draft. How well will his NIL package compare to a low first round contract? Dunno, but I suspect the answer matters.
 
#479      
Brosky
This was a game we should have won. Next chapter in the mix and blend playbook is to play physically and mentally tough at crunch time.
 
#482      
RockfordIllini
At the risk of beating a dead horse, I would be interested to run some sort of win expectancy based on shot charts for this game. We were content to let Barnhizer and Martinelli shoot contested 2’s and Northwestern was content to let us shoot 3’s. Our 2 best shooters go 1-15, when 2-15 would have won us the game. I would think our expectancy was over 80%. Just got unlucky.
 
#483      
Se Il Illini
NashvILLe05 said:
More Morez please. MORE-REZ

The high-low between him and Tomi is a good way to slow down/break an opponent’s run. Bill Self loved doing that…I remember the Augustine to Brian Cook high-low fondly for a lot of layups. Need to work on it more but should be an option aside from 5 out NBA style offense.
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Self still runs a lot of low stuff.
 
#484      
Mr. Roberts
illiniguy24 said:
https://twitter.com/x/status/1866152360621527210

Well at least he is “coachable” 😂
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Bruce Willis Party GIF by IFC
 
#485      
WeWillWhen
So, three days later, I punished myself by going back to chart just how bad Ben was defensively in the second half. He was as bad as I remembered. Really, really bad. NW had 17 scoring plays in second half; Ben directly led to 11 of them. Malpractice for Brad not to show Ben the bench at some point. Here are all of the NW possessions in the 2nd half:

19:49 Martinelli dribble drive on HUMRICHOUS from top of key for 5 foot pull up Jumper.
19:09 Martinelli dribble drive on HUMRICHOUS from top of key, misses 3 foot pull up (Tomi partial contest).
18:41 KJ takes himself out of play going for a steal, Barnhizer straight line drives to hoop for Layup.
18:02 Martinelli made open Three Point Jumper after HUMRICHOUS goes under Nicholson ball screen
16:33 HUMRICHOUS lets Martinelli cut to hoop from corner for pass from driving Leach, White forced to foul him at rim (made 1 FT)
16:05 Barnhizer makes step back 2pt jumper from foul line, over KJ
15:25 Hunger Layup blocked by Ivisic; NW offensive rebound.
15:09 Leach missed Three Point Jumper over Ivisic contest
13:57 Barnhizer missed Jumper.
13:22 Hunger missed Three Point Jumper
12:45 KJ blocks Ty Berry Jumper; NW offensive rebound.
11:50 Barnhizer missed Three Point Jumper (late contest by DGL)
11:23 HUMRICHOUS gets caught in cross screen, allowing Barnheizer to pass to a free Martinelli under the hoop for a Layup.
10:37 Berry missed Three Point Jumper.
9:50 Leach missed Jumper.
9:15 Martinelli dribble drive on HUMRICHOUS from 3pt line all the way to hoop for a Layup.
8:28 Martinelli made Layup over HUMRICHOUS after Ben tried some sort of drop coverage(?) off the pick and roll
7:45 Leach made 18ft Jumper near top of circle over HUMRICHOUS, after Ben gets switched onto him from Martinelli pick and roll
7:22 Barnhizer missed partial break Dunk, contested by Tomi
7:10 DGL fouls Barnhizer at rim after Barnhizer steals from Tomi and breaks the other way (made 1 of 2 FT)
6:51 HUMRICHOUS fouls Nicholson at rim after getting caught in 2-on-1 (KJ’s fault for not slowing down Barnhizer in transition)(made 1of 2 FT)
6:06 Barnhizer missed Three Point Jumper.
5:24 Martinelli booty balls HUMRICHOUS from the 3pt line to the hoop, Ben fouls on shot, both FTs made.
4:53 Barnhizer missed Jumper (KJ contests).
4:20 Martinelli made 5 ft spinning Jumper from baseline over KJ .
3:48 Barnhizer backs down HUMRICHOUS into center of lane, makes 8 ft turnaround Jumper.
2:46 Leach missed Three Point Jumper.
1:56 Tomi unnecessarily fouls Leach in backcourt following rebound of Riley missed three, Leach makes both FTs
1:37 HUMRICHOUS blocks(!) Nick Martinelli jumper from five ft missed Layup.
1:11 Justin Mullins gets easy layup after HUMRICHOUS releases him during transition (poor recognition by Ben and Tomi)
0:41 Brooks Barnhizer made fade-away 12 ft jumper in lane over KJ
0:01 Brooks Barnhizer missed Three Point Jumper (KJ contested)
 
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#486      
AZILL
BU said BH had a good game defensively.....
 
#488      
NarrowJ
WeWillWhen said:
So, three days later, I punished myself by going back to chart just how bad Ben was defensively in the second half. He was as bad as I remembered. Really, really bad. NW had 17 scoring plays in second half; Ben directly led to 11 of them. Malpractice for Brad not to show Ben the bench at some point. Here are all of the NW possessions in the 2nd half:

19:49 Martinelli dribble drive on HUMRICHOUS from top of key for 5 foot pull up Jumper.
19:09 Martinelli dribble drive on HUMRICHOUS from top of key, misses 3 foot pull up (Tomi partial contest).
18:41 KJ takes himself out of play going for a steal, Barnhizer straight line drives to hoop for Layup.
18:02 Martinelli made open Three Point Jumper after HUMRICHOUS goes under Nicholson ball screen
16:33 HUMRICHOUS lets Martinelli cut to hoop from corner for pass from driving Leach, White forced to foul him at rim (made 1 FT)
16:05 Barnhizer makes step back 2pt jumper from foul line, over KJ
15:25 Hunger Layup blocked by Ivisic; NW offensive rebound.
15:09 Leach missed Three Point Jumper over Ivisic contest
13:57 Barnhizer missed Jumper.
13:22 Hunger missed Three Point Jumper
12:45 KJ blocks Ty Berry Jumper; NW offensive rebound.
11:50 Barnhizer missed Three Point Jumper (late contest by DGL)
11:23 HUMRICHOUS gets caught in cross screen, allowing Barnheizer to pass to a free Martinelli under the hoop for a Layup.
10:37 Berry missed Three Point Jumper.
9:50 Leach missed Jumper.
9:15 Martinelli dribble drive on HUMRICHOUS from 3pt line all the way to hoop for a Layup.
8:28 Martinelli made Layup over HUMRICHOUS after Ben tried some sort of drop coverage(?) off the pick and roll
7:45 Leach made 18ft Jumper near top of circle over HUMRICHOUS, after Ben gets switched onto him from Martinelli pick and roll
7:22 Barnhizer missed partial break Dunk, contested by Tomi
7:10 DGL fouls Barnhizer at rim after Barnhizer steals from Tomi and breaks the other way (made 1 of 2 FT)
6:51 HUMRICHOUS fouls Nicholson at rim after getting caught in 2-on-1 (KJ’s fault for not slowing down Barnhizer in transition)(made 1of 2 FT)
6:06 Barnhizer missed Three Point Jumper.
5:24 Martinelli booty balls HUMRICHOUS from the 3pt line to the hoop, Ben fouls on shot, both FTs made.
4:53 Barnhizer missed Jumper (KJ contests).
4:20 Martinelli made 5 ft spinning Jumper from baseline over KJ .
3:48 Barnhizer backs down HUMRICHOUS into center of lane, makes 8 ft turnaround Jumper.
2:46 Leach missed Three Point Jumper.
1:56 Tomi unnecessarily fouls Leach in backcourt following rebound of Riley missed three, Leach makes both FTs
1:37 HUMRICHOUS blocks(!) Nick Martinelli jumper from five ft missed Layup.
1:11 Justin Mullins gets easy layup after HUMRICHOUS releases him during transition (poor recognition by Ben and Tomi)
0:41 Brooks Barnhizer made fade-away 12 ft jumper in lane over KJ
0:01 Brooks Barnhizer missed Three Point Jumper (KJ contested)
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The guys he guarded barely shot 40%

Care to list all of the misses too?

Barnhizer and Martinelli take 70% of NW's field goal attempts, so Ben is going to be guarding them and a few of the shots will go in. Our problem wasn't allowing them a high shooting percentage, it was that we couldn't put the ball in the basket ourselves.
 
#489      
I-L-L 1318
Our defense is built on giving up tough 2's. NW's offense is built on shooting a high volume of tough 2's through 2 guys. We just didn't hit open shots when we needed to and didn't get to the foul line.
 
#490      
BalloonsTheElephant
NarrowJ said:
The guys he guarded barely shot 40%

Care to list all of the misses too?

Barnhizer and Martinelli take 70% of NW's field goal attempts, so Ben is going to be guarding them and a few of the shots will go in. Our problem wasn't allowing them a high shooting percentage, it was that we couldn't put the ball in the basket ourselves.
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When we got up ten, I saw a lot of lazy possessions as it seemed we thought the game was over. Then when we needed a basket, we had no rhythm and we just kept shooting 3s seemingly hoping for one to go in.

Edit: this seemed to be the same as the Loyola game when Brad knew he had a better team, but the strategy he used all season wasn't working. He just kind of expected his guys to eventually overcome it.
 
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#491      
RockfordIllini
I-L-L 1318 said:
Our defense is built on giving up tough 2's. NW's offense is built on shooting a high volume of tough 2's through 2 guys. We just didn't hit open shots when we needed to and didn't get to the foul line.
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Yes. We gave up 56 points in regulation. That should be a 20 point win most nights. Our 2 best 3 point shooters went 1-15, and 2-15 would have won the game. 4-15 (27%) and we win comfortably.
 
#493      
WyattEarp
I-L-L 1318 said:
Our defense is built on giving up tough 2's. NW's offense is built on shooting a high volume of tough 2's through 2 guys. We just didn't hit open shots when we needed to and didn't get to the foul line.
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IMG_4250.jpeg

I’d like to see us have an alternate type of attack outside of the: spaced pick n’ pop, penetrate and kick out stuff. Something a little more structured, but still intuitive we could roll into…as fall back if…if our bread and butter gets stale.
 
#494      
Illiniguy13
A philosphy Brad pounds into his teams is learning how to win when shots aren't falling. Shots weren't falling for either team and unsurprisingly, the more experienced team came out on top
 
#495      
Snoopy
First B1G road trip for most of the team and at times on offense in particular they seemed sped up. Hope that goes away as they get more used to playing on the road in tight games.

Brad's current offense does seem susceptible to teams willing to extend their D beyond the 3 point line and stay at home on our shooters while parking a 7 footer in the paint as a rim protector.

While analytics may show midrange 2s aren't the best shot, never taking them is information your opponents can and do use against you.
 
#496      
Fan Since '70
Illini can play better than they did. They can play with more effort, especially on defense, and fully maximize their powerful offense which was underutilized vs NW. I expect a better effort versus Wisconsin and from here on out.
 
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