Pregame: Illinois vs Michigan, Wednesday, January 11th, 8:00pm CT, BTN

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#26      
ItsFootballTime
Still on target.

Lose the games we supposed to lose by a trillion points

Win the games we need to win by one point

And we go dancing

Beat scUM by one point!
 
#28      
Joel Goodson
Absolutely crucial game. Must hold serve at home. Groce's job on the line. Let's see how the players respond.
 
#29      
BillMo
Here is hoping JG has seen enough to start playing the younger guys, Just like with Hill and Nunn as FR it took for ever for them to really see the court tons and start. Maybe just maybe we are going to see more of the younger guys. Personally and everyone can jump on me if they want to, but our best stretch of mins lately have been with HIll on the bench, I am not saying Hill isn't our best player nor am I saying he doesn't need to play a lot. BUT I think 25-30 mins so he is able to go all out all the time would be better then seeing him not hustle all the time.
I would start
Finke -mav and Throne mins as needed
Black - Kipper about 15 mins
Hill - DJW 10-15 min keep hill fresh
JCL- Jordan same as above maybe alittle less as
TA - TL 15-20 mins Tate if both arein foul trouble
 
#30      
GortTheRobot
We need both of these games. I see a few sure losses, at least one of those at home against Wisky, and a whole bunch of toss-up games. The only road games that look close to a sure thing are PSU and Rutgers, and I'm not even that sure about those. That means we need to hold home court, while admitting that a Wisky win would be a major surprise.
 
#31      
CoalCity
GortTheRobot said:
We need both of these games. I see a few sure losses, at least one of those at home against Wisky, and a whole bunch of toss-up games. The only road games that look close to a sure thing are PSU and Rutgers, and I'm not even that sure about those. That means we need to hold home court, while admitting that a Wisky win would be a major surprise.
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PSU looks pretty good. They're more athletic than we are and they seem to have that Philly toughness that their coach displays. I wouldn't call them even close to a sure thing this season. I've watched a lot of B1G hoops so far this season and I'm really concerned about what might happen to this team over the next few weeks. I hope I'm wrong but....
 
#32      
JIllini
GortTheRobot said:
We need both of these games. I see a few sure losses, at least one of those at home against Wisky, and a whole bunch of toss-up games. The only road games that look close to a sure thing are PSU and Rutgers, and I'm not even that sure about those. That means we need to hold home court, while admitting that a Wisky win would be a major surprise.
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I don't think PSU and Rutgers on the road are even close to sure wins, especially PSU. That being said, I don't think the home game against Wiscy is a sure loss. I think it's more likely we win that one than at Purdue.
 
#33      
MItrump
LurkLongandProsper said:
Agreed. We're seriously at a point where we're excusing a senior laden team losing HOME GAMES to mediocre teams just because the students are gone? This is worse than I thought.
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The Band will be there loud and proud! Bet on it!;)
 
#34      
ejam21
BillMo said:
Here is hoping JG has seen enough to start playing the younger guys, Just like with Hill and Nunn as FR it took for ever for them to really see the court tons and start. Maybe just maybe we are going to see more of the younger guys. Personally and everyone can jump on me if they want to, but our best stretch of mins lately have been with HIll on the bench, I am not saying Hill isn't our best player nor am I saying he doesn't need to play a lot. BUT I think 25-30 mins so he is able to go all out all the time would be better then seeing him not hustle all the time.
I would start
Finke -mav and Throne mins as needed
Black - Kipper about 15 mins
Hill - DJW 10-15 min keep hill fresh
JCL- Jordan same as above maybe alittle less as
TA - TL 15-20 mins Tate if both arein foul trouble
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I would start mav, not finke.....in 18 mins finke gave us 0 pts and 1 board
mav gave us 18 and 2, which is more point production than finke in all 3 big 10 games combined.

Plus mav is avg about 13 and 6 over the last 5 games
 
#35      
GortTheRobot
JIllini said:
I don't think PSU and Rutgers on the road are even close to sure wins, especially PSU. That being said, I don't think the home game against Wiscy is a sure loss. I think it's more likely we win that one than at Purdue.
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Yeah, I agree with PSU, hadn't been paying them much attention, just going on past history. I stand corrected on that one. I still think we can take Rutgers on any court. Wisky? I would like to share your optimism, but I just don't see us stopping them defensively. Purdue? That one could be there. Still, I'm just not seeing how we add enough wins to go dancing. I hope I am wrong and we go on the same kind of run we went on in Groce's first year after that sweet IU victory.
 
#36      
jrichisamazing
WesterveltVictoryCigar said:
I guess you're "content" with the NIT as well?
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Not at all. It's obvious that the B1G is a gigantic mediocre mess right now. Most of our games will be toss ups. I'm still confident that we will steal some road games. Home court advantage isn't what it used to be. Almost everyone loses home games in the B1G. And almost everyone wins some road games in the B1G.
 
#37      
89illinigrad
gibb52 said:
We only have 7 more B1G road games. I can't see us going 3-4 in them. Winning at home and stealing at the most 2 on the road. Even 2 is stretching it with how we've looked away from SFC so far.

I hope to be wrong.
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6 of those road games are against middle of the pack or lesser BIG teams (Michigan, PSU, NW, Iowa, Nebraska and Rutgers). Its reasonable to expect that we could at least split those 6 games, thus giving us 3 road wins.
 
#38      
GoIllini40
ItsFootballTime said:
Still on target.

Lose the games we supposed to lose by a trillion points

Win the games we need to win by one point

And we go dancing

Beat scUM by one point!
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They're not making the tournament if they can't beat anyone better than them.
 
#39      
MadSeason
GoIllini40 said:
They're not making the tournament if they can't beat anyone better than them.
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Exactly.

What an odd notion that has entered this fanbase by totally conceding certain games and pretending that theres nothing to be gleaned from getting pounded in games you are "supposed to lose."

I suppose this is what a bad program looks like. Hope to win enough to sneak in the tournament every few years and write off beating good teams or competing in the conference.
 
#40      
MrOizo
FatGreg said:
Of course we're not supposed to be happy rolling over for anyone. And of course the current direction is concerning: this is an unprecedented period of futility for a top-15 all-time program. But obviously making the tourney is still the goal and there's still a path for us. What's confusing about that?

Unless you're insinuating that we should be hoping to lose against fellow mediocre teams so that we miss the tournament, sealing Groce's dismissal. If that's the case, I'm confused, because I'm the kind of fan that roots for a win every time we step on the court and a tournament appearance every year. I'm not currently optimistic about the team's prospects this year or going forward under Groce, but I hope like heck they prove me wrong.
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Well said, sums up my feelings well.
 
#41      
TriCityBurbs
BillMo said:
Here is hoping JG has seen enough to start playing the younger guys, Just like with Hill and Nunn as FR it took for ever for them to really see the court tons and start. Maybe just maybe we are going to see more of the younger guys. Personally and everyone can jump on me if they want to, but our best stretch of mins lately have been with HIll on the bench, I am not saying Hill isn't our best player nor am I saying he doesn't need to play a lot. BUT I think 25-30 mins so he is able to go all out all the time would be better then seeing him not hustle all the time.
I would start
Finke -mav and Throne mins as needed
Black - Kipper about 15 mins
Hill - DJW 10-15 min keep hill fresh
JCL- Jordan same as above maybe alittle less as
TA - TL 15-20 mins Tate if both arein foul trouble
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Mav minutes when needed? He has been our most consistent and best big all year outside of that 3-4 game stretch where Black was playing fantastic. Even then he was our best 5.
 
#42      
WesterveltVictoryCigar
jrichisamazing said:
Not at all. It's obvious that the B1G is a gigantic mediocre mess right now. Most of our games will be toss ups. I'm still confident that we will steal some road games. Home court advantage isn't what it used to be. Almost everyone loses home games in the B1G. And almost everyone wins some road games in the B1G.
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I'm not so easily dismissive of home court advantage. A few notable upsets doesn't mean it ceases to exist. If you can't beat middle of the road teams on your home court, unlikely you can get it done on theirs.

89illinigrad said:
6 of those road games are against middle of the pack or lesser BIG teams (Michigan, PSU, NW, Iowa, Nebraska and Rutgers). Its reasonable to expect that we could at least split those 6 games, thus giving us 3 road wins.
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I'd say that's an optimistic take given our road performance so far. When you're on the road, you really need your defense to carry the day and that's not our forte.
 
#43      
Illini1221
WesterveltVictoryCigar said:
I'm not so easily dismissive of home court advantage. A few notable upsets doesn't mean it ceases to exist. If you can't beat middle of the road teams on your home court, unlikely you can get it done on theirs.



I'd say that's an optimistic take given our road performance so far. When you're on the road, you really need your defense to carry the day and that's not our forte.
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Especially since a lot of those teams are very explosive offensively. The Iowa game could be in the one hundreds.:eek:
 
#44      
ntsillinifan
I coach youth soccer, and after my keeper gives up a goal, I try to teach them, have a short memory. Don't let it get you down. Shake it off and go from here. That's what this team needs to do. They totally got punched in the guy by IU this weekend. And yet, with as terribly as they've played in their first 2 road conference road games this season, they are 1 game out of 1st in the loss column, and it's still quite early. Two home games coming up this week. I know MD punched them in the gut at their place, too, but MD is really not all that much better than IL imo and can be beat at our place. Play smart, play tough, pick up these next 2 wins at home, and go from there. There's my optimistic post for the day! :)
 
#45      
sbillini
MadSeason said:
Exactly.

What an odd notion that has entered this fanbase by totally conceding certain games and pretending that theres nothing to be gleaned from getting pounded in games you are "supposed to lose."

I suppose this is what a bad program looks like. Hope to win enough to sneak in the tournament every few years and write off beating good teams or competing in the conference.
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+1000000. This is why i think JFG needs to go regardless of whether we make the tournament or not assuming we can find a suitable replacement. I supported him for a long time, but this season has, so far, confirmed that he's unable to get any of his teams to play at a high level with any sort of consistently and, without this, we have no chance of being a regular competitor for B1G championships. Barely sneaking into the tourney should not be the case for a deep, experienced team with (at least) decent talent and a weaker than normal conference (I know I'm making an assumption here, but hard to argue against that based on what we've seen so far).

yes, we have a great recruiting class, but, honestly, there's nothing here to provide confidence that next year's team will play to the level a team with next year's composition should be able to. Then, we're going to end up having the same conversation next year that we're having now but with the "the new kids aren't experienced enough yet" excuses.
 
#46      
FeelYourPaign
First of two back to back must win games.
We're a bubble team, that doesn't currently look like it can register a surprise win. Given that, we have to win the games that we can win. This is a game that we can win. So, we must. Need guys to play like their hair is on fire. 40 minutes of that, please.
 
#47      
Greensboro
Seems to be a lot of debate on value of home court, and for reference I'm all in that it needs to start with being good at home, but here is what last 3 yrs look like in conference:
2015-16 (3-6 overall) - 3-6 home; 2-7 road (road wins; Rutgers/Minn)
2014-15 (9-9 overall) - 7-2 home; 2-7 road (road wins; NW/MSU)
2013-14 (7-11 overall) - 3-6 home; 4-5 road (this was 2 win start, drop 8 in a row, then finish strong year; so not sure you can draw many conclusions)
 
#48      
Greensboro
sbillini said:
+1000000. This is why i think JFG needs to go regardless of whether we make the tournament or not assuming we can find a suitable replacement. I supported him for a long time, but this season has, so far, confirmed that he's unable to get any of his teams to play at a high level with any sort of consistently and, without this, we have no chance of being a regular competitor for B1G championships. Barely sneaking into the tourney should not be the case for a deep, experienced team with (at least) decent talent and a weaker than normal conference (I know I'm making an assumption here, but hard to argue against that based on what we've seen so far).

yes, we have a great recruiting class, but, honestly, there's nothing here to provide confidence that next year's team will play to the level a team with next year's composition should be able to. Then, we're going to end up having the same conversation next year that we're having now but with the "the new kids aren't experienced enough yet" excuses.
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I personally think if we make the tournament this year it will be experience, we aren't that good & our talent level isn't that high. You can argue JCL & Black are talented, but there not that experienced. You can probably argue that Morgan/Thorne are experienced, but I'm not arguing they are that talented.

I don't expect us to be that good next year, I haven't really followed MSU this year, but they are struggling with a lot of freshman in a freshman class that is a fair bit better on paper than our class next year. Our freshman won't be riding in on a white horse next year to save the season no matter who is the coach. I think they will give us a good foundation to build on in the future and have the potential for big things down the road but that will be a few years down the road.
 
#49      
WesterveltVictoryCigar
Greensboro said:
I don't expect us to be that good next year, I haven't really followed MSU this year, but they are struggling with a lot of freshman in a freshman class that is a fair bit better on paper than our class next year. Our freshman won't be riding in on a white horse next year to save the season no matter who is the coach. I think they will give us a good foundation to build on in the future and have the potential for big things down the road but that will be a few years down the road.
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MSU lost their 2 experienced bigs in Schilling and grad xfer Carter. As we now from last year, that can really be tough to overcome. And their best frosh Miles Bridges missed 7 games with an ankle injury. They'll still be pretty good by the end of the season. And yes, much better next year even though Bridges is probably one and done.
 
#50      
breadman
PSU looked pretty gosh darn good over the weekend against Mich St.
 
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