Pregame: Illinois vs Missouri, Monday, December 22nd, 7:00pm CT, FS1

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#101      
On that point about dead space behind the basket, I found a good before and after comparison at similar angles ... W-H-Y did they start having seats be like this?? It's so much lamer!
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They used to have actual temporary stands that extended down to the court, and now they just leave that dead space from the hockey rink and throw out some folding chairs that don't even fill the space??
Please, for the love of god, remove the NBA line from the floor!
 
#102      
This topic also comes up each year (mostly thanks to me! :ROFLMAO: ), but it seems like the Illini side is nearly ALWAYS 80%+ full, with it quite often being close to 100%. It seems like the years with sub-par attendance is often driven by Mizzou failing to fill its side. I would be curious to hear from regular / annual attendees if this matches their experience. With capacity at around 22K, that would be 11K fans from each side. In the two years I have been, this is my totally random "eye test" of the attendance, with the actual attendance (per Wikipedia) posted, as well.

2021-22
- Illini side approximately 90% full
- Mizzou side approximately 45% full
---> Attendance guess = 9,900 ILL + 4,950 MIZ = 14,850
---> Estimated crowd split = 67% ILL, 33% MIZ
---> Actual attendance = 14,953

2022-23

- Illini side approximately 90% full
- Mizzou side approximately 80% full
---> Attendance guess = 9,900 ILL + 8,800 MIZ = 18,700
---> Estimated crowd split = 53% ILL, 47% MIZ
---> Actual attendance = 18,452

Those high-level calculations obviously don't include no-shows and rival fans sitting on the opposite side ... but I feel like there is regularly WAY more orange on the Mizzou side than vice versa.

TL;DR

It seems like Illini Nation pulls its weight every single year at Braggin' Rights, and it is Mizzou fans who either drag down attendance or help get it back up. Any yearly attendees agree or disagree?
 
#103      
This topic also comes up each year (mostly thanks to me! :ROFLMAO: ), but it seems like the Illini side is nearly ALWAYS 80%+ full, with it quite often being close to 100%. It seems like the years with sub-par attendance is often driven by Mizzou failing to fill its side. I would be curious to hear from regular / annual attendees if this matches their experience. With capacity at around 22K, that would be 11K fans from each side. In the two years I have been, this is my totally random "eye test" of the attendance, with the actual attendance (per Wikipedia) posted, as well.

2021-22
- Illini side approximately 90% full
- Mizzou side approximately 45% full
---> Attendance guess = 9,900 ILL + 4,950 MIZ = 14,850
---> Estimated crowd split = 67% ILL, 33% MIZ
---> Actual attendance = 14,953

2022-23

- Illini side approximately 90% full
- Mizzou side approximately 80% full
---> Attendance guess = 9,900 ILL + 8,800 MIZ = 18,700
---> Estimated crowd split = 53% ILL, 47% MIZ
---> Actual attendance = 18,452

Those high-level calculations obviously don't include no-shows and rival fans sitting on the opposite side ... but I feel like there is regularly WAY more orange on the Mizzou side than vice versa.

TL;DR

It seems like Illini Nation pulls its weight every single year at Braggin' Rights, and it is Mizzou fans who either drag down attendance or help get it back up. Any yearly attendees agree or disagree?
I've been every year for the last 9-10 years, and generally, yes, the Illinois side is usually more filled out than the Mizzou side, on average.
 
#104      
I’m trying my best to keep this defense in perspective considering the personnel we have, but it’s becoming very evident that over the course of even individual games, we have at best stayed about the same on that end of the ball.

Truly frustrating considering the past couple seasons. I’m not asking for a top 15 defense, but somewhere in the 20-30 range feels obtainable.

I'm still cautiously optimistic about our defense. It feels like we have competed on D better than last season, especially against Bama and UConn. But the results haven't been there yet.

It seems like we have a lot of communication issues, which is a sign of needing more time to gel together. Luckily that is fixable. Ben H is playing much tougher this year which is good to see. Big Z gives us better rim protection. If we just compare the top 8 guys from last year I would say.
 
#105      
I believe the 2022 game it was like -30 with the wind chill and me and my buddies walked from the pregame bar to the game. It was a little chilly.

Also, unfortunately, I have had to go with primarily Mizzou fans for the past several years, and at the 2022 game when Mizzou was destroying us, they had the best time ever and I had to sit there and take. But the next year, when we destroyed Mizzou (by a larger margin), my friends were complaining and were trying to leave by half. I refused. Said that I sat through the whole game last year, I'm making them do the same!
We left the 2022 game at the first tv timeout of 2nd half. Headed back home to Springfield area. We were somewhere past Litchfield when the game ended.
 
#106      
Also, in case anyone needs a reminder of this great rivalry's long and often streaky history ... here is your trip down memory lane on the eve of the 44th Braggin' Rights Game played in St. Louis. In the spirit of the event, I will both not include the pre-St. Louis games and omit the 2020-21 game played in Columbia. Also, I put a few fun section breaks in there for Illini head coach changes and when the event switched arenas.

--- Brad Underwood Era ---
2024-25 |
Illinois 80, Missouri 77
2023-24 | #13 Illinois 97, Missouri 73

2022-23 | Missouri 93, #16 Illinois 71
2021-22 | Illinois 88, Missouri 63
2020-21 | N/A - Played in Columbia, MO Due to COVID
2019-20 | Missouri 63, Illinois 56
2018-19 | Missouri 79, Illinois 63

2017-18 | Illinois 70, Missouri 64
--- John Groce Era ---
2016-17 |
Illinois 75, Missouri 66
2015-16 | Illinois 68, Missouri 63
2014-15 | Illinois 62, Missouri 59
2013-14 | Illinois 65, #23 Missouri 64

2012-13 | #12 Missouri 82, #10 Illinois 73
--- Bruce Weber Era ---
2011-12 |
#10 Missouri 78, #25 Illinois 74
2010-11 | #9 Missouri 75, #21 Illinois 64

2009-10 | Missouri 81, Illinois 68
2008-09 | Illinois 75, #25 Missouri 59
2007-08 | Illinois 59, Missouri 58
2006-07 | Illinois 73, Missouri 70
2005-06 | #6 Illinois 82, Missouri 50
2004-05 | #1 Illinois 70, Missouri 64
2003-04 | #21 Illinois 71, #11 Missouri 70

--- Bill Self Era ---
2002-03 |
#12 Illinois 85, #11 Missouri 70
2001-02 | #9 Illinois 72, #8 Missouri 61
2000-01 | #5 Illinois 86, Missouri 81 (OT)

--- Lon Kruger Era ---
1999-00 |
Missouri 78, #15 Illinois 72
1998-99 | #15 Missouri 67, Illinois 62
1997-98 | Missouri 75, Illinois 69

1996-97 | Illinois 85, Missouri 69
--- Lou Henson Era ---
1995-96 |
#14 Illinois 96, #15 Missouri 85 (OT)
1994-95 | Missouri 76, #23 Illinois 58
------ Game Moved From St. Louis Arena / Checkerdome to Current Arena ------
1993-94 | Missouri 108, #19 Illinois 107 (3OT)
1992-93 | Missouri 66, Illinois 65
1991-92 | #16 Missouri 61, Illinois 44

1990-91 | Illinois 84, Missouri 81
1989-90 | #5 Illinois 101, #4 Missouri 93
1988-89 | #6 Illinois 87, #10 Missouri 84
1987-88 | Illinois 75, #17 Missouri 63
1986-87 | #9 Illinois 92, Missouri 74
1985-86 | #15 Illinois 67, Missouri 55
1984-85 | #7 Illinois 65, Missouri 50
1983-84 | #20 Illinois 66, Missouri 60

1982-83 | N/A - No Game
1981-82 | #13 Missouri 78, Illinois 67 (OT)
1980-81 | Illinois 84, #14 Missouri 62

Any super fans been to them all?? :cool: A couple fun series notes.

1. It really has been a great rivalry, more often than not. 4 games have gone to overtime (including the 3OT thriller in 1993-94), and 16 games have either been decided by 5 points or fewer, or gone to at least one OT.

2. The "records go out the window" thing is absolutely true. Not even counting all of the times where a heavily favored team has struggled to grind out a win, the lower-ranked team has won 13 different times over the years, and an unranked team has beaten the ranked team 8 separate times.

3. While it hasn't happened in several years now, this rivalry game has been a top 25 matchup between two ranked teams a total of 9 times - 1988-89, 1989-90, 1995-96, 2001-02, 2002-03, 2003-04, 2010-11, 2011-12 and 2012-13.

4. And lastly, and to pump up our Illini pride, here is a comparison of the two programs all-time.

Final Fours: ILL 5, MIZ 0
Elite Eights: ILL 10, MIZ 3
Sweet Sixteens: ILL 14, MIZ 7
NCAAT Appearances: ILL 35, MIZ 29
NCAAT Wins: ILL 46, MIZ 23
NCAAT #1 Seeds: ILL 4, MIZ 1
NCAAT Top 4 Seeds: ILL 16, MIZ 8
AP Top 25 Finishes: ILL 30, MIZ 15
Weeks in AP Top 25: ILL 526, MIZ 311
All-Time Winning Percentage: ILL .642, MIZ .581

And yet your average Mizzou fan has this inexplicable and totally unjustifiable cockiness that they like deserve to be good. :ROFLMAO: Let's go get a win at what is easily one of my favorite sporting events of the year. I-L-L!
 
#109      
Also, in case anyone needs a reminder of this great rivalry's long and often streaky history ... here is your trip down memory lane on the eve of the 44th Braggin' Rights Game played in St. Louis. In the spirit of the event, I will both not include the pre-St. Louis games and omit the 2020-21 game played in Columbia. Also, I put a few fun section breaks in there for Illini head coach changes and when the event switched arenas.

--- Brad Underwood Era ---
2024-25 |
Illinois 80, Missouri 77
2023-24 | #13 Illinois 97, Missouri 73

2022-23 | Missouri 93, #16 Illinois 71
2021-22 | Illinois 88, Missouri 63
2020-21 | N/A - Played in Columbia, MO Due to COVID
2019-20 | Missouri 63, Illinois 56
2018-19 | Missouri 79, Illinois 63

2017-18 | Illinois 70, Missouri 64
--- John Groce Era ---
2016-17 |
Illinois 75, Missouri 66
2015-16 | Illinois 68, Missouri 63
2014-15 | Illinois 62, Missouri 59
2013-14 | Illinois 65, #23 Missouri 64

2012-13 | #12 Missouri 82, #10 Illinois 73
--- Bruce Weber Era ---
2011-12 |
#10 Missouri 78, #25 Illinois 74
2010-11 | #9 Missouri 75, #21 Illinois 64

2009-10 | Missouri 81, Illinois 68
2008-09 | Illinois 75, #25 Missouri 59
2007-08 | Illinois 59, Missouri 58
2006-07 | Illinois 73, Missouri 70
2005-06 | #6 Illinois 82, Missouri 50
2004-05 | #1 Illinois 70, Missouri 64
2003-04 | #21 Illinois 71, #11 Missouri 70

--- Bill Self Era ---
2002-03 |
#12 Illinois 85, #11 Missouri 70
2001-02 | #9 Illinois 72, #8 Missouri 61
2000-01 | #5 Illinois 86, Missouri 81 (OT)

--- Lon Kruger Era ---
1999-00 |
Missouri 78, #15 Illinois 72
1998-99 | #15 Missouri 67, Illinois 62
1997-98 | Missouri 75, Illinois 69

1996-97 | Illinois 85, Missouri 69
--- Lou Henson Era ---
1995-96 |
#14 Illinois 96, #15 Missouri 85 (OT)
1994-95 | Missouri 76, #23 Illinois 58
------ Game Moved From St. Louis Arena / Checkerdome to Current Arena ------
1993-94 | Missouri 108, #19 Illinois 107 (3OT)
1992-93 | Missouri 66, Illinois 65
1991-92 | #16 Missouri 61, Illinois 44

1990-91 | Illinois 84, Missouri 81
1989-90 | #5 Illinois 101, #4 Missouri 93
1988-89 | #6 Illinois 87, #10 Missouri 84
1987-88 | Illinois 75, #17 Missouri 63
1986-87 | #9 Illinois 92, Missouri 74
1985-86 | #15 Illinois 67, Missouri 55
1984-85 | #7 Illinois 65, Missouri 50
1983-84 | #20 Illinois 66, Missouri 60

1982-83 | N/A - No Game
1981-82 | #13 Missouri 78, Illinois 67 (OT)
1980-81 | Illinois 84, #14 Missouri 62

Any super fans been to them all?? :cool: A couple fun series notes.

1. It really has been a great rivalry, more often than not. 4 games have gone to overtime (including the 3OT thriller in 1993-94), and 16 games have either been decided by 5 points or fewer, or gone to at least one OT.

2. The "records go out the window" thing is absolutely true. Not even counting all of the times where a heavily favored team has struggled to grind out a win, the lower-ranked team has won 13 different times over the years, and an unranked team has beaten the ranked team 8 separate times.

3. While it hasn't happened in several years now, this rivalry game has been a top 25 matchup between two ranked teams a total of 9 times - 1988-89, 1989-90, 1995-96, 2001-02, 2002-03, 2003-04, 2010-11, 2011-12 and 2012-13.

4. And lastly, and to pump up our Illini pride, here is a comparison of the two programs all-time.

Final Fours: ILL 5, MIZ 0
Elite Eights: ILL 10, MIZ 3
Sweet Sixteens: ILL 14, MIZ 7
NCAAT Appearances: ILL 35, MIZ 29
NCAAT Wins: ILL 46, MIZ 23
NCAAT #1 Seeds: ILL 4, MIZ 1
NCAAT Top 4 Seeds: ILL 16, MIZ 8
AP Top 25 Finishes: ILL 30, MIZ 15
Weeks in AP Top 25: ILL 526, MIZ 311
All-Time Winning Percentage: ILL .642, MIZ .581

And yet your average Mizzou fan has this inexplicable and totally unjustifiable cockiness that they like deserve to be good. :ROFLMAO: Let's go get a win at what is easily one of my favorite sporting events of the year. I-L-L!
I have been to a total of 16 Braggin Rights games through the years…mostly in the 80’s-90’s and here recently the last 2-4 years…it is always a great game day atmosphere and so much fun…Thanks for the info Fighter…as usual…excellent work!
 
#110      
Also, in case anyone needs a reminder of this great rivalry's long and often streaky history ... here is your trip down memory lane on the eve of the 44th Braggin' Rights Game played in St. Louis. In the spirit of the event, I will both not include the pre-St. Louis games and omit the 2020-21 game played in Columbia. Also, I put a few fun section breaks in there for Illini head coach changes and when the event switched arenas.

--- Brad Underwood Era ---
2024-25 |
Illinois 80, Missouri 77
2023-24 | #13 Illinois 97, Missouri 73

2022-23 | Missouri 93, #16 Illinois 71
2021-22 | Illinois 88, Missouri 63
2020-21 | N/A - Played in Columbia, MO Due to COVID
2019-20 | Missouri 63, Illinois 56
2018-19 | Missouri 79, Illinois 63

2017-18 | Illinois 70, Missouri 64
--- John Groce Era ---
2016-17 |
Illinois 75, Missouri 66
2015-16 | Illinois 68, Missouri 63
2014-15 | Illinois 62, Missouri 59
2013-14 | Illinois 65, #23 Missouri 64

2012-13 | #12 Missouri 82, #10 Illinois 73
--- Bruce Weber Era ---
2011-12 |
#10 Missouri 78, #25 Illinois 74
2010-11 | #9 Missouri 75, #21 Illinois 64

2009-10 | Missouri 81, Illinois 68
2008-09 | Illinois 75, #25 Missouri 59
2007-08 | Illinois 59, Missouri 58
2006-07 | Illinois 73, Missouri 70
2005-06 | #6 Illinois 82, Missouri 50
2004-05 | #1 Illinois 70, Missouri 64
2003-04 | #21 Illinois 71, #11 Missouri 70

--- Bill Self Era ---
2002-03 |
#12 Illinois 85, #11 Missouri 70
2001-02 | #9 Illinois 72, #8 Missouri 61
2000-01 | #5 Illinois 86, Missouri 81 (OT)

--- Lon Kruger Era ---
1999-00 |
Missouri 78, #15 Illinois 72
1998-99 | #15 Missouri 67, Illinois 62
1997-98 | Missouri 75, Illinois 69

1996-97 | Illinois 85, Missouri 69
--- Lou Henson Era ---
1995-96 |
#14 Illinois 96, #15 Missouri 85 (OT)
1994-95 | Missouri 76, #23 Illinois 58
------ Game Moved From St. Louis Arena / Checkerdome to Current Arena ------
1993-94 | Missouri 108, #19 Illinois 107 (3OT)
1992-93 | Missouri 66, Illinois 65
1991-92 | #16 Missouri 61, Illinois 44

1990-91 | Illinois 84, Missouri 81
1989-90 | #5 Illinois 101, #4 Missouri 93
1988-89 | #6 Illinois 87, #10 Missouri 84
1987-88 | Illinois 75, #17 Missouri 63
1986-87 | #9 Illinois 92, Missouri 74
1985-86 | #15 Illinois 67, Missouri 55
1984-85 | #7 Illinois 65, Missouri 50
1983-84 | #20 Illinois 66, Missouri 60

1982-83 | N/A - No Game
1981-82 | #13 Missouri 78, Illinois 67 (OT)
1980-81 | Illinois 84, #14 Missouri 62

Any super fans been to them all?? :cool: A couple fun series notes.

1. It really has been a great rivalry, more often than not. 4 games have gone to overtime (including the 3OT thriller in 1993-94), and 16 games have either been decided by 5 points or fewer, or gone to at least one OT.

2. The "records go out the window" thing is absolutely true. Not even counting all of the times where a heavily favored team has struggled to grind out a win, the lower-ranked team has won 13 different times over the years, and an unranked team has beaten the ranked team 8 separate times.

3. While it hasn't happened in several years now, this rivalry game has been a top 25 matchup between two ranked teams a total of 9 times - 1988-89, 1989-90, 1995-96, 2001-02, 2002-03, 2003-04, 2010-11, 2011-12 and 2012-13.

4. And lastly, and to pump up our Illini pride, here is a comparison of the two programs all-time.

Final Fours: ILL 5, MIZ 0
Elite Eights: ILL 10, MIZ 3
Sweet Sixteens: ILL 14, MIZ 7
NCAAT Appearances: ILL 35, MIZ 29
NCAAT Wins: ILL 46, MIZ 23
NCAAT #1 Seeds: ILL 4, MIZ 1
NCAAT Top 4 Seeds: ILL 16, MIZ 8
AP Top 25 Finishes: ILL 30, MIZ 15
Weeks in AP Top 25: ILL 526, MIZ 311
All-Time Winning Percentage: ILL .642, MIZ .581

And yet your average Mizzou fan has this inexplicable and totally unjustifiable cockiness that they like deserve to be good. :ROFLMAO: Let's go get a win at what is easily one of my favorite sporting events of the year. I-L-L!

I recall the first game (1980), the University chartered a bus to Missouri for the students with Courtside seats all , if my memory serves me correctly for $20-$30.. To see Mark Smith, Eddie Johnson, and Derek Harper at Courtside for that price was something special...Good times...
 
#111      
I have been to a total of 16 Braggin Rights games through the years…mostly in the 80’s-90’s and here recently the last 2-4 years…it is always a great game day atmosphere and so much fun…Thanks for the info Fighter…as usual…excellent work!
My first Braggin Rights game was 1989. I have only missed 2. The one in Columbus and one 3 years ago because the roads were so bad that we could not travel.
 
#118      
As always, this will be a true neutral site game. Half the crowd will be orange. I think we are the better team, so we should win. I say "should"; no guarantees.
 
#119      
That team was so spectacular, it's hard to pick just one game. I think I still lean toward that game at LSU when we waxed them in their arena.and showcased our total arsenal. I think their coach's name was Dale Brown, but I'm not certain. Anyway, he said the Flyin' Illini were the best team he'd ever faced.
 
#121      
The Braggin Rights trophy may be the largest trophy in all of college sports.

It will fit into the trophy case nicely right next to the smallest trophy in all of college sports: The Purdue Cannon. That thing looks like a monopoly piece.
 
#122      
Somewhat OT, but I noticed that Oklahoma and Oklahoma State held a Braggin' Rights-style game this year in Oklahoma City with a 50/50 crowd ... but I think it was a one-off. In a college sports world where it seems we either get seemingly stale and pointless neutral site games in places irrelevant to both teams (e.g., USC and LSU playing football in Las Vegas rather than at either team's campus) or standard home-and-home series (and there's nothing wrong with those), I just want to take a moment to recognize how special the setup of Braggin' Rights is.

As far as I can tell, Braggin' Rights is one of just three CONSISTENT neutral site, 50/50 crowd rivalry setups in all of college sports. Again, you might get the aforementioned OKC setup or Indiana and Marquette splitting the tickets for a United Center game this year, but that is not at all the same. We are part of this elite club, and I hope no one ever has the short-sighted idea to move this game out of St. Louis!

Illinois vs. Missouri | St. Louis, MO
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Georgia vs. Florida | Jacksonville, FL
georgia-florida-102822.jpg


Oklahoma vs. Texas | Dallas, TX
red-river.jpg


P.S. If we ever found ourselves in a situation where Missouri wound up in the Big Ten, I would genuinely in favor of doing an "inverse" of a protected rivalry, where it is guaranteed that we only play them ONCE and that the game remains in St. Louis before Christmas, even if it is considered a conference game. The atmosphere is that special, and (I say this as a Chicagoan) St. Louis embraces it and is an excellent host.
 
#123      
The Braggin Rights trophy may be the largest trophy in all of college sports.

It will fit into the trophy case nicely right next to the smallest trophy in all of college sports: The Purdue Cannon. That thing looks like a monopoly piece.
From Wiki, "The name of the victorious team is engraved on a large trophy that, unlike other college rivalry trophies, does not travel home with the winning team. The trophy is displayed in a glass case in the Enterprise Center lobby, where it occupies either an orange-and-blue or black-and-gold space in the cabinet, depending on who won. The other side has a plastic square reading "THE TROPHY BELONGS HERE NEXT YEAR" in the position where the trophy would go."
 
#124      
This is the commentary you find regarding this game on the Mizzou message board on the St. Louis Post-Dispatch website...

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