Pregame: Illinois vs Wisconsin, Friday, March 13th, 1:30pm CT, BTN

I agree..We're in trouble not only in the BIG tournament but next week too...I have never been more down on this team than I am now

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Number 2 seeded teams will do that to you

rdk573 said:

The problem is not the season record and the 2 seed (deserved) but where we are trending now at this time of season..

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I don’t disagree

But would you a feel a lot different if dent didn’t go coast to coast?

You’d be 4-1 since Boswell was back with 3 road games and 2ish (lol USC) Q1 wins along with 2 blowouts.

ThePortalMadeMeDoIt said:

Not playing nearly as well as we were back then.

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Aren’t we, though?

20 point win over Indiana
36 point win at USC
1 point OT loss at UCLA
14 point loss to Michigan
26 point win over Oregon
6 point win at Maryland.

Three 20+ point wins
One double digit loss
One close OT loss
One close regulation win

4-2 since Wisky…. Three of the wins blowouts. But because we sleepwalked through the last game we’re not playing as well???

Absolutely outstanding post and analysis.

I have some real bad news for him next year in the league if this is frustrating. Keaton is not a big, physical guard and really lacks explosiveness. I'm not sure if he's dunked more than 5 times this year and the amount of times he gets into the lane and gets blocked is alarming.

MSU is the team that started blitzing him the second he gets the ball. It was only a matter of time. Once enough film gets out there, it's a copycat game. The excuse that he gets fouled in a bad excuse. NBA guards finish through contact. He's nowhere close to being there yet. He's a physically undeveloped freshman. He is unquestionably skilled, but if he's going to get run off the three point line, he has to have more in his bag.

He struggled against Mills yesterday. He's got, at least, one year of the developmental league in front of him once he gets to the NBA. Riley had a very similar issue with dealing with physicality, BUT Will is the far superior athlete. Any pass up by the rim, he'd get up and stuff it.

We'll see what he does in March. He's going to be counted on to get us where we want to be and they are absolutely unfair expectations of him.

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Lol

RabidDawgClassic said:

Aren’t we, though?

20 point win over Indiana
36 point win at USC
1 point OT loss at UCLA
14 point loss to Michigan
26 point win over Oregon
6 point win at Maryland.

Three 20+ point wins
One double digit loss
One close OT loss
One close regulation win

4-2 since Wisky…. Three of the wins blowouts. But because we sleepwalked through the last game we’re not playing as well???

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i actually thought there was more sleepwalking in the second half against oregon than there was yesterday

oregon was atrocious and maryland looked fiesty and made a ton of tough shots

though some sleepwalking maybe, idk, it was said we had a couple guys sick

EmpoweredIllini said:

i actually thought there was more sleepwalking in the second half against oregon than there was yesterday

oregon was atrocious and maryland looked fiesty and made a ton of tough shots

though some sleepwalking maybe, idk, it was said we had a couple guys sick

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Who other than Andrej (and underwood) have been confirmed to be sick? Pretty awful timing hopefully it runs its course through the team in the next 5 days.

Second place is 1st loser said:

Absolutely outstanding post and analysis.

I have some real bad news for him next year in the league if this is frustrating. Keaton is not a big, physical guard and really lacks explosiveness. I'm not sure if he's dunked more than 5 times this year and the amount of times he gets into the lane and gets blocked is alarming.

MSU is the team that started blitzing him the second he gets the ball. It was only a matter of time. Once enough film gets out there, it's a copycat game. The excuse that he gets fouled in a bad excuse. NBA guards finish through contact. He's nowhere close to being there yet. He's a physically undeveloped freshman. He is unquestionably skilled, but if he's going to get run off the three point line, he has to have more in his bag.

He struggled against Mills yesterday. He's got, at least, one year of the developmental league in front of him once he gets to the NBA. Riley had a very similar issue with dealing with physicality, BUT Will is the far superior athlete. Any pass up by the rim, he'd get up and stuff it.

We'll see what he does in March. He's going to be counted on to get us where we want to be and they are absolutely unfair expectations of him.

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So spot on IMO and it just shows, to me anyway, that Illini Nation are observant and objective fans. Far different than many fans (Iowa) I know.

And it's twofold with Keaton. 1. He's not naturally strong and not naturally explosive so he can't always play through physicality, AND, 2. not only can't he play through it but he actually falls down or loses balance from it at times and many think it's a foul. Its often not.

He is a very good freshman player and we desperately need him to hit from outside at a high rate in the next 4 weeks.
It's a ton to ask of him, but we have to have it.

thefalcon5 said:

The past 4 games we’ve shot 31% or worse from 3.

Bump that up to our season average of 35% and I think we’re singing a different mood tune.

I still have both high hopes and expectations for this team. Gotta beat Wisconsin (who’s been playing extremely well since our first matchup) and show up against Michigan.

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Here are the results of each team since we played one another.

Wisconsin 5-2
Lost by 17 at Ohio State (Net #30)
Lost by 14 at Oregon (102)

Illinois 4-2
Lost by 1 at UCLA (34) in overtime
Lost by 14 at home to Michigan (2)

Rooftop said:

Agree. Potential framework for evaluating an entire season, which is NCAAT driven. Ultimate goal for every season is a NCAAT championship season. Period.

Don't make it: Not acceptable season
First round exit: Bad season
2nd round exit: Average season
Sweet 16 exit: Good
Elite 8 exit: Very good
F4 or Runner up: Great
F4 Winner: Championship season

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By that logic 2005 team was only "great"? IMO any season you get to the Final 4 is a fantastic season.

Heck, making the E8 and hanging a BTT banner is a great season. Reading this and I would think that we were Duke, Kansas, or UNC.

Illini in Italy said:

Sorry I was derelict in my duties, I’m in Italy for the next few weeks working on my Mediterranean diet - you know - pizza, pasta & vino.


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I've probably said this before, but your Italy pictures are so much preferred over your topless Farmer Fran Waterboy pictures!

I was on the Ticketmaster website today, and I am kind of surprised by BTT sales. Of course, we just learned the bracket last night, so there will probably be a lot of movement in the coming days. However, I really thought Illinois' session (Session 6 - Friday morning) would have less availability. I guess that is good news for Illini fans who wish to attend!!

Session 1 | Tuesday, March 10 - Evening
#16 Oregon at 4:00 pm
#17 Maryland at 4:00 pm
#15 Northwestern at 6:30 pm
#18 Penn State at 6:30 pm




Session 2 | Wednesday, March 11 - Morning
#9 Iowa at 11:00 am
TBD at 11:00 am (#16 Oregon or #17 Maryland)
#12 Washington at 1:30 pm
#13 USC at 1:30 pm




Session 3 | Wednesday, March 11 - Evening
#10 Indiana at 5:30 pm
TBD at 5:30 pm (#15 Northwestern or #18 Penn State)
#11 Minnesota at 8:00 pm
#14 Rutgers at 8:00 pm




Session 4 | Thursday, March 12 - Morning
#8 Ohio State at 11:00 am
TBD at 11:00 am (#9 Iowa, #16 Oregon or #17 Maryland)
#5 Wisconsin at 1:30 pm
TBD at 1:30 pm (#12 Washington or #13 USC)




Session 5 | Thursday, March 12 - Evening
#7 Purdue at 5:30 pm
TBD at 5:30 pm (#10 Indiana, #15 Northwestern or #18 Penn State)
#6 UCLA at 8:00 pm
TBD at 8:00 pm (#11 Minnesota or #14 Rutgers)




Session 6 | Friday, March 13 - Morning
#1 Michigan at 11:00 am
TBD at 11:00 am (presumably #8 Ohio State or #9 Iowa)
#4 Illinois at 1:30 pm
TBD at 1:30 pm (presumably #5 Wisconsin)




Session 7 | Friday, March 13 - Evening
#2 Nebraska at 5:30 pm
TBD at 5:30 pm (presumably #7 Purdue or #10 Indiana)
#3 Michigan State at 8:00 pm
TBD at 8:00 pm (#6 UCLA, #11 Minnesota or #14 Rutgers)



Don't think the irony is lost on me that the literal reason I cannot go on Friday is because it's during a workday, but ... color me shocked that the Session 6 tickets are not moving faster when you have Michigan and especially Illinois 100% playing then and Wisconsin fans presumably feeling good about winning on Thursday and thus playing then, as well. Those are three fan bases that traditionally help to fill up the UC. If I were to just subjectively rank fan bases by how much I would expect them to show up this year absent of obviously relevant factors like game time, what other fan bases share that session, etc., it would look something like this.

Tier 1 = Illinois
Tier 2 = Michigan, MSU, Wisconsin, Purdue, Indiana
Tier 3 = Nebraska, Iowa
Tier 4 = Ohio State
Tier 5 = Minnesota, Northwestern
Tier 6 = Maryland, Oregon
Tier 7 = UCLA, Rutgers, Washington, Penn State, USC

So if you just accepted my tiers on faith, our Session 6 would have the best collection of fan bases to maximize ticket sales. Let's hope Illini fans can take advantage of these available seats and decisively outnumber Wisconsin and Michigan fans on Friday!!!!

Absolutely outstanding post and analysis.

I have some real bad news for him next year in the league if this is frustrating. Keaton is not a big, physical guard and really lacks explosiveness. I'm not sure if he's dunked more than 5 times this year and the amount of times he gets into the lane and gets blocked is alarming.

MSU is the team that started blitzing him the second he gets the ball. It was only a matter of time. Once enough film gets out there, it's a copycat game. The excuse that he gets fouled in a bad excuse. NBA guards finish through contact. He's nowhere close to being there yet. He's a physically undeveloped freshman. He is unquestionably skilled, but if he's going to get run off the three point line, he has to have more in his bag.

He struggled against Mills yesterday. He's got, at least, one year of the developmental league in front of him once he gets to the NBA. Riley had a very similar issue with dealing with physicality, BUT Will is the far superior athlete. Any pass up by the rim, he'd get up and stuff it.

We'll see what he does in March. He's going to be counted on to get us where we want to be and they are absolutely unfair expectations of him.

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You are absolutely right he needs to stay another year to bulk up for the league.../s

INSIDER LATEST!!
IZZO OUT AT MSU AFTER NCAA’S
FORCED RETIREMENT!!!
It’s about time! It’s all about his terrible handling of that little punk Fears.

Fighter of the Nightman said:

I was on the Ticketmaster website today, and I am kind of surprised by BTT sales. Of course, we just learned the bracket last night, so there will probably be a lot of movement in the coming days. However, I really thought Illinois' session (Session 6 - Friday morning) would have less availability. I guess that is good news for Illini fans who wish to attend!!

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Through yesterday, I believe that you could only purchase all session packages for tickets (that is how I had to purchase my seats to ensure Illini session). They are probably now separating those out. Therefore, I am not surprised by the number of available seats. Expect the Friday-Sunday sessions to start selling fairly fast.

I thought we were the better team vs Wisconsin the first time we played them, but now I question that. We won't defend them all that well plus if the threes aren't falling and Tomi doesn't give us anything, then we definitely lose. I hope this team has it's confidence back, but idk.

Retro62 said:

I believe we will come out of our funk for the game against (likely) Wisconsin and win. The big test is how we play Michigan the next game. If we come out and lay down like we did at home, it will be very disappointing going into the Tourney. If we play them tough, even in a loss, we'll all feel better going forward.

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Hate like hell that we have to think about coming out of a funk at this time of year. Duke FL et al don't seem to be dealing with funk.

Illini2010-11 said:

Through yesterday, I believe that you could only purchase all session packages for tickets (that is how I had to purchase my seats to ensure Illini session). They are probably now separating those out. Therefore, I am not surprised by the number of available seats. Expect the Friday-Sunday sessions to start selling fairly fast.

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I'm not excited for 120/seat in the 300 level.

HensonHall71 said:

I think we handle Wisconsin this time around - we didn't have Boswell or Andrej to guard Boyd/Blackwell and we still were up 8 and let is slip late. Their starting center Winters might not be full strength either even if he does play which makes them very thin up front. They can get hot from three - like they did against us the first time around and will be difficult, but I like our matchup with them. We should be plenty motivated as well after losing to them at home.

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This.....

Agree. Potential framework for evaluating an entire season, which is NCAAT driven. Ultimate goal for every season is a NCAAT championship season. Period.

Don't make it: Not acceptable season
First round exit: Bad season
2nd round exit: Average season
Sweet 16 exit: Good
Elite 8 exit: Very good
F4 or Runner up: Great
F4 Winner: Championship season

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Yes but, you have to add the variable of that season’s team talent level. If I told you that the entire starting 5 is in the top 75 on the draft boards, would you say sweet 16 is good (enough)?

I wouldnt

Agree. Potential framework for evaluating an entire season, which is NCAAT driven. Ultimate goal for every season is a NCAAT championship season. Period.

Don't make it: Not acceptable season
First round exit: Bad season
2nd round exit: Average season
Sweet 16 exit: Good
Elite 8 exit: Very good
F4 or Runner up: Great
F4 Winner: Championship season

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Very rational and well thought out. I think making to the first Sunday every year given where the program is now is very reasonable in terms of creatng expectations.

Second place is 1st loser said:

Absolutely outstanding post and analysis.

I have some real bad news for him next year in the league if this is frustrating. Keaton is not a big, physical guard and really lacks explosiveness. I'm not sure if he's dunked more than 5 times this year and the amount of times he gets into the lane and gets blocked is alarming.

MSU is the team that started blitzing him the second he gets the ball. It was only a matter of time. Once enough film gets out there, it's a copycat game. The excuse that he gets fouled in a bad excuse. NBA guards finish through contact. He's nowhere close to being there yet. He's a physically undeveloped freshman. He is unquestionably skilled, but if he's going to get run off the three point line, he has to have more in his bag.

He struggled against Mills yesterday. He's got, at least, one year of the developmental league in front of him once he gets to the NBA. Riley had a very similar issue with dealing with physicality, BUT Will is the far superior athlete. Any pass up by the rim, he'd get up and stuff it.

We'll see what he does in March. He's going to be counted on to get us where we want to be and they are absolutely unfair expectations of him.

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Is this just me or does it feel like you’ve been trying to forecast Wagler’s downfall for literally the entire season? I swear it started off with calling for Petro to start over him back in November, and even on our 12 game winning streak, you always had comments subtly undermining Keaton. Just a tad weird to me.

Second place is 1st loser said:

He struggled against Mills yesterday. He's got, at least, one year of the developmental league in front of him once he gets to the NBA. Riley had a very similar issue with dealing with physicality, BUT Will is the far superior athlete. Any pass up by the rim, he'd get up and stuff it.

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I mean… that’s not true at all? Yes he had more dunks, but that’s because he’s 6”9. Majority of Will’s points came from operating out of the mid post. He wasn’t a great shooter (32% from 3pt) but was very crafty (a bit like Domask) and was a solid decision maker.

I actually recall him being pretty limited athletically.

Keaton is usually maneuvering his way to the rim. He’s very good at finishing by using the backboard. Who cares if he doesn’t get runouts for dunks (until they start giving extra points for dunks)? In fact, I wish Andrej would copy his layups and attempt fewer dunks.

Second place is 1st loser said:

MSU is the team that started blitzing him the second he gets the ball. It was only a matter of time. Once enough film gets out there, it's a copycat game. The excuse that he gets fouled in a bad excuse. NBA guards finish through contact. He's nowhere close to being there yet. He's a physically undeveloped freshman. He is unquestionably skilled, but if he's going to get run off the three point line, he has to have more in his bag.

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I’ve never really understood the term “bad excuse” or “not an excuse” when it pertains to FACT. When something is 100% true, why use the term “excuse” to contextualize?

This is 1000% a FOUL. That’s literally 3 armbars just shoving him into the ground with a minute left in the game. Any other player in the B10 is getting that call.


Even on the shot — if you pay close attention, he miraculously re-gathers, but completely HACKED again:



Against Wisconsin — completely changed the course of the game. This is a FOUL. Should’ve been 2 FTs on one end, results in 2pts the other way… 4pt swing. What is this ref staring at???



Against Indiana — yes this wasn’t nearly as critical as the first two, but this might be the most egregious thing I’ve seen all year. Should’ve been a flagrant, but is somehow ruled a no call with High Knees standing 3ft away.



You could literally go on and on….

Fly Illini Fly! said:

I’ve never really understood the term “bad excuse” or “not an excuse” when it pertains to FACT. When something is 100% true, why use the term “excuse” to contextualize?

This is 1000% a FOUL. That’s literally 3 armbars just shoving him into the ground with a minute left in the game. Any other player in the B10 is getting that call.

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Even on the shot — if you pay close attention, he miraculously re-gathers, but completely HACKED again:

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Against Wisconsin — completely changed the course of the game. This is a FOUL. Should’ve been 2 FTs on one end, results in 2pts the other way… 4pt swing. What is this ref staring at???

View attachment 48146

Against Indiana — yes this wasn’t nearly as critical as the first two, but this might be the most egregious thing I’ve seen all year. Should’ve been a flagrant, but is somehow ruled a no call with High Knees standing 3ft away.

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You could literally go on and on….

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He just needs to fall to the ground on the 1st one. IMO that’s the freshman mistake if anything.

i actually thought there was more sleepwalking in the second half against oregon than there was yesterday

oregon was atrocious and maryland looked fiesty and made a ton of tough shots

though some sleepwalking maybe, idk, it was said we had a couple guys sick

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NCAA doesn't care if you're sick