The Illinois Coaching Search

haasi · Mar 13, 2017

Three interesting first round NCAA tourney matchups:

1. Archie v. Marshall in 7-10 game on Friday in Indy.
2. Bennett v. Keatts in a 5-12 game noon Thursday.
3. Northwestern v. Vandy in 8-9 game on Thursday in a matchup of up and coming coaches I'd be happy with but we're unlikely to get

CAHALL15 · Mar 13, 2017

Dvick217 said:
Was Groce really that good of a recruiter? I think we hyped him up a little to much in that department. Martin would be able to get those five stars in Chicago. With that being said OPEN the checkbook for Archie!

Why do you think Martin would get the 5 star guys in Chicago? The only Chicago recruit Martin has ever gotten was Charlie Moore. He certainly did land two MCDAA two years ago, but none since including a rather underwhelming class this year.

Whitman2020 · Mar 13, 2017

I may even call a Martin hire a downgrade.

Illini2018 · Mar 13, 2017

Whitman2020 said:
I may even call a Martin hire a downgrade.

I wouldn't go this far. Martin has had moderate power 5 level success while Groce had moderate mid major success before coming to Illinois.

StateFarmCenter · Mar 13, 2017

Whitman2020 said:
I may even call a Martin hire a downgrade.

This is absolutely insane. Martin may not be a good hire in his own right but it's not appreciating at all how far down the ladder the Groce hire was or how awful he was here. John Groce best conference finish ever was 3rd place in the MAC East. He never finished in the top half of the B1G or even above .500. Cuonzo Martin won the Missouri Valley, finished 2nd, 5th and 4th in the SEC, then 8th, 3rd, and 5th in the PAC 12.

Martin is a MASSIVE step up from Groce, which still doesn't necessarily mean he's a good coach, but the comparisons to Groce need to stop.

UofIChE06 · Mar 13, 2017

People hate on CM too much. There is something to be said about a legit HM coach with 6 yrs at the highest levels that would be willing to walk across a bed of glass to take the job. Sure his results don't jump out at you but how many candidates have as much experience running a program at this level. I don't see how people can definitively say he will be worse than someone that has had success at a mid major but never coached on the big stage. I think the only mid major guy I would put in front of him is Archie. That has a lot to do with his brother's success and his experience with Chicago recruiting.

I would be content albeit not blown away with Martin. He will continue what Groce has started with recruiting and likely take it to the next level. Will he win a NC? Who knows but he will consistently be in the dance and he will work his tail off for the home state school.

KBLEE · Mar 13, 2017

KrushCow31 said:
Martin is the Bruce Weber version of John Groce. It's like combining our last two coaches into a super coach who still isn't that good. If he's our coach consider me officially not interested in next season.

+1

drwillini · Mar 13, 2017

StateFarmCenter said:
This is absolutely insane. Martin may not be a good hire in his own right but it's not appreciating at all how far down the ladder the Groce hire was or how awful he was here. John Groce best conference finish ever was 3rd place in the MAC East. He never finished in the top half of the B1G or even above .500. Cuonzo Martin won the Missouri Valley, finished 2nd, 5th and 4th in the SEC, then 8th, 3rd, and 5th in the PAC 12.

Martin is a MASSIVE step up from Groce, which still doesn't necessarily mean he's a good coach, but the comparisons to Groce need to stop.

You must be mistaken. Mike Thomas was clear that the thing he cared about most was conference record.

ILHoff · Mar 13, 2017

UofIChE06 said:
People hate on CM too much. There is something to be said about a legit HM coach with 6 yrs at the highest levels that would be willing to walk across a bed of glass to take the job. Sure his results don't jump out at you but how many candidates have as much experience running a program at this level. I don't see how people can definitively say he will be worse than someone that has had success at a mid major but never coached on the big stage. I think the only mid major guy I would put in front of him is Archie. That has a lot to do with his brother's success and his experience with Chicago recruiting.

I would be content albeit not blown away with Martin. He will continue what Groce has started with recruiting and likely take it to the next level. Will he win a NC? Who knows but he will consistently be in the dance and he will work his tail off for the home state school.

Good post. People are falling in love with their own personal list of coaches. I hope that when we hire someone, whether it's Cuonzo or someone else, that the fan base will get behind that coach and create some positive vibes.

GortTheRobot · Mar 13, 2017

Two thoughts:

1. I've already seen at least one, "prepare to settle" statement made, and I am sure there will be others before this is over. Just stop it. It's exactly the same nonsense as Groce will be here again next year.

2. I know we all are aware that Illinois has not been very relevant the past ten years, but, unlike high school kids who do not remember our past, coaches out there do, and they know what potential a school like ours has.

I believe JW knows what he's doing, and I would love to see a hire following the outcome of the Dayton vs. WSU game. Whatever the case, I think our next coach is dancing right now, and we will have to be patient until said coach is through with this season.

Our new film: "The Return of The Chief!"

drwillini · Mar 13, 2017

Obelix said:
The rift between Kruger and Chicago had nothing to do with Bernie Lincicome sticking up for the Florida sportswriters. At the time, Florida sportswriters couldn't care less for the Florida basketball program, let alone care enough to carry a vendetta across the nation for Kruger leaving. Florida basketball was really nothing, despite having reached a surprise F4.

The rift started with Chicago, mainly all the powerful HS and AAU programs, boycotting UI for not promoting Jimmy Collins. Kruger ended up unfortunately at the wrong place at the wrong time (with respect to the Chicago feud). Chicago directed all their displeasure against UI towards Kruger and their menace was further exacerbated by DePaul and Pat Kennedy, who saw that as an opportunity to take advantage in recruiting (and also revenge against his old nemesis at Florida - a continuation of their FSU-Florida rivalry).

Kruger handled it very well, and took advantage of the Peoria and downstate talent (e.g., Brian Cook) but he understood that he was in the middle of an unfair situation, which was not going to get better. Atlanta actually offered the job to Izzo first, who turned it down and recommended Kruger. It was a great opportunity for Kruger and, realistically, it was a great opportunity for UI to bring someone like Self and patch up relationships with Chicago.

Kruger did a great job at UI, but long term, I do not believe it was going to work. It was a bad and unfair situation that was not getting better.

This pretty much jives with my memory, except for the last part. Kruger was indeed lucky that we had a great string of downstate talent: Brian Cook, Serg & Marcus, and Frankie, and that kind if mitigated the challenges in Chicago. They way Lon carried himself, I fully expect that over time he would have gotten some recruits in the Chicago area. Maybe not CPL, but the 'burbs for sure. I would think a guy like Scheyer would have loved Lon Kruger at Illinois, and I could see Lon and Dee connecting. I guess we will never know, but I would really like to see what our program would be looking like now after 20+ years of Lon Kruger at the helm.

Ga65 · Mar 13, 2017

The successful coach will not be successful because he is a great X's and O's guy or because he is a great recruiter. You can't recruit if you don't win and you can't win if you don't recruit. Actually believe JG could do both but the job is like any executive job in that no matter how hard you work you can't do it all. You must be an administrator who can hire the right people and based on their performance develop them, promote or fire them. The fact that JG had the same assistants when he wasn't successful is the clue. Loyalty was more important than performance and that didn't work. Reason any new coach will want to choose his people.

jmilt7 · Mar 13, 2017

Illinibirds said:
I think it is laughable when people on this board talk in definitive terms, like anyone on this board has any idea how Marshall would react.....maybe he wants to win a national championship and I don't think anyone would argue that road through WSU is much more difficult than through a school like Illinois. Bottom line, no one knows what Marshall is thinking.

Will be interesting to see who Whitman ends up getting.....I certainly don't think Marshall would not 'take a call from Illinois'....

Agree about the "talk in definitive terms" and the "no one knows". There were a couple of people on the Carousel board who were sure Groce would be retained for next year. At least I am pretty sure. Memory isn't the best nowadays.

IlliNYC · Mar 13, 2017

StateFarmCenter said:
This is absolutely insane. Martin may not be a good hire in his own right but it's not appreciating at all how far down the ladder the Groce hire was or how awful he was here. John Groce best conference finish ever was 3rd place in the MAC East. He never finished in the top half of the B1G or even above .500. Cuonzo Martin won the Missouri Valley, finished 2nd, 5th and 4th in the SEC, then 8th, 3rd, and 5th in the PAC 12.

Martin is a MASSIVE step up from Groce, which still doesn't necessarily mean he's a good coach, but the comparisons to Groce need to stop.

Agree. BUT I do wish Cal had made the tournament. The team's collapse down the stretch would make this hire VERY difficult to justify from a PR point of view--the Chicago media would have a field day...

Soxfreak64 · Mar 13, 2017

I'm really intrigued reading this board. I'm not naturally an optimist, but I'm relatively encouraged by the names we're hearing.

The Monty offer showed Whitman was serious - it wasn't a public rejection like the MT days.

Sounds like the Gregg Marshalls of the world are at least receptive. Keatts would certainly make me happy. I'd be over the moon with Bryce Drew, and Cuonzo Martin, while far from my favorite, is still likely to be an upgrade.

There are only a few "Ew, No" candidates I've seen floated by ANYBODY worth listening to:
Frank Martin falls in that category.

Like several have said, this search probably won't get serious until next week, so buckle up and enjoy the ride. I think we're gonna wind up OK.

Ransom Stoddard · Mar 13, 2017

I'm still on the K train. Beating them in the NIT puts us one step closer to hiring him!!!!

golferjohn1970 · Mar 13, 2017

haasi said:
Three interesting first round NCAA tourney matchups:

1. Archie v. Marshall in 7-10 game on Friday in Indy.
2. Bennett v. Keatts in a 5-12 game noon Thursday.
3. Northwestern v. Vandy in 8-9 game on Thursday in a matchup of up and coming coaches I'd be happy with but we're unlikely to get

Good post could be 4 potential coaches here will be interesting the next two weeks until a coach is hired. I'd take any of these 4 guys!!

FiveStar · Mar 13, 2017

miketherevelator said:
Speaking of AAU Kingpins --

[FONT=&quot]Mac Irvin Fire‏ @TheMacIrvinFire 3hours ago [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Illinois should be rank in the Top 10 every year! #LetsGoIllini #GetAGoodCoach[/FONT]

This why Archie is number one on my list. He has players from Simeon and Morgan Park on his roster at Dayton. There's only two cps schools to truly prioritize and it's those two. He's already played that game and won. He has the respect of Smith and Irvin to at least send their players to him, and that's at a school that's 5+ hours away. I have no idea who is on his staff at Dayton, but bring the guy who led the Chicago recruitments and keep Walker if he can/wants, and you have northern and downstate Illinois covered. Third assistant could be a game planner/scouter, x and o guy, or a more national recruiter.

Second and Chalmers · Mar 13, 2017

Soxfreak64 said:
The Monty offer showed Whitman was serious - it wasn't a public rejection like the MT days.

Uhhh, it was absolutely a public rejection.

It's good that there's a double standard for MT and JW, because people were utterly ridiculous about MT in a counterproductive fashion whereas the halo around JW can only help, but man alive is there a double standard.

Golfer63 · Mar 13, 2017

miketherevelator said:
Speaking of AAU Kingpins --

[FONT=&quot]Mac Irvin Fire‏ @TheMacIrvinFire 3hours ago [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Illinois should be rank in the Top 10 every year! #LetsGoIllini #GetAGoodCoach[/FONT]

What the Irvins are really trying to say is, "Illinois should be a top ten team every year. Now let us pick your coach or else we will make sure you guys are never a top ten team"

Seriously, those POSs can shove it.

golferjohn1970 · Mar 13, 2017

FiveStar said:
This why Archie is number one on my list. He has players from Simeon and Morgan Park on his roster at Dayton. There's only two cps schools to truly prioritize and it's those two. He's already played that game and won. He has the respect of Smith and Irvin to at least send their players to him, and that's at a school that's 5+ hours away. I have no idea who is on his staff at Dayton, but bring the guy who led the Chicago recruitments and keep Walker if he can/wants, and you have northern and downstate Illinois covered. Third assistant could be a game planner/scouter, x and o guy, or a more national recruiter.

I like it he would be my #2 guy after Marshall but I'd take him right now he is an excellent coach and he would have us in the top 4 B1G almost every year. Not sure about his recruiting ability but this guy can flat out coach players.

Second and Chalmers · Mar 13, 2017

IlliNYC said:
Agree. BUT I do wish Cal had made the tournament. The team's collapse down the stretch would make this hire VERY difficult to justify from a PR point of view--the Chicago media would have a field day...

You never want to over-emphasize the most recent 10-or-so games on a many year head coaching resume, that's like sin #1.

.....but damn was that stretch pivotal for Cuonzo. This team should have been better than that.

Second and Chalmers · Mar 13, 2017

SwarminOrange said:
Here's a name I haven't seen yet:

@KendallG13
Just talked to my good friend Sam Mitchell. Former NBA Coach of The Year! He's interested in the Illini. We should be interested too.

zhawks said:
Yuck

Trakis said:
Not interested. Mediocre NBA experience. No college experience.

There is not a great deal of difference between Mitchell and Monty as coaches. Monty is in with the Colangelo in-crowd, that's the difference.

coryfor3 · Mar 13, 2017

haasi said:
If we can get past Valpo, looks like we might have a date with Larry K in the NIT second round next weekend. Would be interesting if there's significant talk of him coming to us.

I don't get the Larry K. buzz on the board. I haven't head his name related to the coaching search anywhere else. I get that his record out at Utah (other than this year) has been good and he has done a good job there. But other than his time with the Bulls, all his connections are out west. I don't see any reason that he would be a logical candidate here.

KBLEE · Mar 13, 2017

If it has been mentioned, then I missed it. But, is it possible that the Monty "rejection" was a publicity stunt to make it known to the coaching community that Illinois is willing to spend big on the right coach? The timing just seems strange to me, given that the search was only officially an hour old.

The Illinois Coaching Search

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