Illini Basketball 2018-2019

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#401      

Bill Lumbergh

B
Bill Lumbergh
Just because somebody is not starting, or even getting "starter minutes", does not necessarily mean they're not a highly valuable piece of the puzzle or that they weren't worth recruiting.

Also, 20 min a game is not starter minutes, but that's a semantics argument for another day.
 
#402      

IlliniDent

IlliniDent
Chicago, IL
IlliniDent
Second and Chalmers said:
Ayo is the missing piece of that analysis.

Lucas would have played much less if Mark Smith had been what we thought he was going to be and what we're all confident Ayo is going to be. Also true of Alstork to an extent.

And you recruit Feliz because a quality backup PG with age and experience who's a good fit to distribute and keep the offense flowing with the second unit is a very nice piece to have. It's a piece that extracts additional value from your other longer-term upside plays.

My best guess of the minutes rankings, assuming everyone qualifies and stays healthy:

1. Frazier
2. Ayo
3. Kipper
4. DaMonte
5. AJ
6. Kane
7. Feliz
8. Tevian
9. De la Rosa
10. Giorgi
11. Griffin
12. Higgs
Click to expand...

I don't disagree with this line up all that much, but still in this scenario, Feliz is basically your first guy off the bench to replace the 1-3 spot at least to start the season. AJ unfortunately will probably need to spend some time at the 4 because we really don't have anyone else who will be ready to play immediate minutes there at the start of the season. Unless Tevian really settles in right away and can defend well, AJ is going to have to put some time in at the 4. Plus you have Higgs at the bottom of your depth chart so you don't believe he will be ready (I agree for the most part) for that role. Obviously, if AJ is able to play the 3 from the start that would be good news for the 4 position, but it seems that the 4 is going to be primarily made up of a SF/guard playing that spot. Overall, this means we are likely to see a lot of Feliz in the line up with 2 of Ayo, Frazier, and Damonte.
 
#405      

Newman

N
Newman
IlliniDent said:
I don't disagree with this line up all that much, but still in this scenario, Feliz is basically your first guy off the bench to replace the 1-3 spot at least to start the season. AJ unfortunately will probably need to spend some time at the 4 because we really don't have anyone else who will be ready to play immediate minutes there at the start of the season. Unless Tevian really settles in right away and can defend well, AJ is going to have to put some time in at the 4. Plus you have Higgs at the bottom of your depth chart so you don't believe he will be ready (I agree for the most part) for that role. Obviously, if AJ is able to play the 3 from the start that would be good news for the 4 position, but it seems that the 4 is going to be primarily made up of a SF/guard playing that spot. Overall, this means we are likely to see a lot of Feliz in the line up with 2 of Ayo, Frazier, and Damonte.
Click to expand...

I highly doubt we'll see AJ at the 4. I expect Kipper and Jones there. I'd rather have Damonte at the 4 than AJ if we need to go with a smaller guard there.
 
#406      

Second and Chalmers

S
Second and Chalmers
Newman said:
I highly doubt we'll see AJ at the 4. I expect Kipper and Jones there. I'd rather have Damonte at the 4 than AJ if we need to go with a smaller guard there.
Click to expand...

I'd rather play a senior out of position than a freshman, both for now and for the future. And AJ is a good deal bigger than DaMonte, which isn't everything, but it helps.

AJ played spot minutes as a 4 last year IIRC.

Higgs being a revelation would help an awful lot.
 
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#407      

Deleted member 643761

D
Guest
Deleted member 643761
Second and Chalmers said:
Ayo is the missing piece of that analysis.

Lucas would have played much less if Mark Smith had been what we thought he was going to be and what we're all confident Ayo is going to be. Also true of Alstork to an extent.

And you recruit Feliz because a quality backup PG with age and experience who's a good fit to distribute and keep the offense flowing with the second unit is a very nice piece to have. It's a piece that extracts additional value from your other longer-term upside plays.

My best guess of the minutes rankings, assuming everyone qualifies and stays healthy:

1. Frazier
2. Ayo
3. Kipper
4. DaMonte
5. AJ
6. Kane
7. Feliz
8. Tevian
9. De la Rosa
10. Giorgi
11. Griffin
12. Higgs
Click to expand...

As noted by another, this is probably about what others might anticipate. But I get the sense that you believe that there will be a big gap between DW and AJ minutes and Feliz. I guess I'd think that they'll all be about the same.

I do think that either AJ or DaMonte could find some time in a four guard lineup depending on how quickly Tevian develops on both ends.
 
#409      

Ga65

G
Ga65
I guess I see Jones as the backup as his 6'7" vs DaMonte at 6'3" has to be an advantage. Not putting DaMonte down as I think he is a lot more athletic than most people are crediting him. Think much of the lineup combinations are going to be more about chemistry than heights or positions however.
 
#410      

IlliniDent

IlliniDent
Chicago, IL
IlliniDent
Newman said:
I highly doubt we'll see AJ at the 4. I expect Kipper and Jones there. I'd rather have Damonte at the 4 than AJ if we need to go with a smaller guard there.
Click to expand...

We saw him at the 4 last year some already so it's not like this is a crazy idea. I think he will play some 4 for us this year since we lost all of our post talent. Damonte definitely isn't a 4 either. Jones I think will play the 4 this season, but well have to see how he does on defense guarding bigger and more importantly stronger guys than him. We don't have 1 guy on this team who is built to play the 4 on defense and is ready to play immediate minutes. As a result, we could easily go for someone who could slide into the 4 on offense as it is basically another guard spot, and has the defensive awareness to play the 4 on defense. This likely won't be a freshman right off the bat and therefore why I think AJ will split his minutes between the 3 and 4 spots.
 
#411      

Second and Chalmers

S
Second and Chalmers
illinitiger said:
Cant buy that we will have only 1 guy in our top 8 rotation over 6'7" (Kane)
Click to expand...

I'd see us going 9 deep with Kane and De La Rosa splitting the 5, with Giorgi getting a few scraps, and maybe the odd experiment with somebody else there.

But none of those guys will see a single second outside the 5, so they slide down the overall minutes list to guys who are more versatile.
 
#413      

FiveStar

F
FiveStar
Second and Chalmers said:
I'd see us going 9 deep with Kane and De La Rosa splitting the 5, with Giorgi getting a few scraps, and maybe the odd experiment with somebody else there.

But none of those guys will see a single second outside the 5, so they slide down the overall minutes list to guys who are more versatile.
Click to expand...

I’m quoting this one just cause it’s the last one in a long run of posts, but last year our best lineup had both Frazier and Lucas. If you think Feliz is a straight swap for losing Lucas, what makes you think we won’t see them together in a lineup with Ayo, who is our best recruit this decade, and also needs to be on the floor?

Secondly pertaining this post, I think Giorgi gets more than scraps. I think I’ve made it clear where I stand on him, but as the only big going through every piece of the offseason, and BU constantly talking about passing, I think he’s getting 10-15, if he doesn’t foul out, by design until Adonis gets back.
 
#415      

illinitiger

I
illinitiger
Second and Chalmers said:
I'd see us going 9 deep with Kane and De La Rosa splitting the 5, with Giorgi getting a few scraps, and maybe the odd experiment with somebody else there.

But none of those guys will see a single second outside the 5, so they slide down the overall minutes list to guys who are more versatile.
Click to expand...
early in season I can see giorgi and/or Higgs at least getting ebo-like minutes,10 to 15 mpg. delarosa is out (expecting meaningful minutes in Jan) and Kane is missing summer workouts. 10 mpg is cutoff for top 10 rotation last year.

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#416      

illiniguy24

illiniguy24
illiniguy24
We are due to have a non highly recruited freshman have a breakout career, right?


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#417      

dish3

D
Seattle
dish3
Maui Tix

Just got the email with notice:
These General Admission Booster tickets are $500 each, and include a ticket for each game the Illini play in (3 games).

Holy moly, $500!!
 
#420      

Second and Chalmers

S
Second and Chalmers
FiveStar said:
last year our best lineup had both Frazier and Lucas. If you think Feliz is a straight swap for losing Lucas, what makes you think we won’t see them together in a lineup with Ayo, who is our best recruit this decade, and also needs to be on the floor?
Click to expand...

You're answering your own question.
 
#421      

Joel Goodson

Joel Goodson
ties will be resolved
Joel Goodson
Second and Chalmers said:
Tough call. Feliz was pretty much a straight swap for Lucas, and while I really like Lucas and probably believe him to be a better overall basketball player, Feliz looks like the better fit for our system and more natural in the role he's (likely, IMO) to be asked to play.

If it was inevitable that Lucas was leaving, Feliz was a good replacement who I definitely would have recruited and I'm glad we have. And it's definitely possible he's better than Lucas, we shall see.
Click to expand...

lol

Feliz is a much better player than Lucas, IMO (and I'm a Lucas fan, FWIW). Yes, we shall see.
 
#422      

TCTORNADO

TCTORNADO
TCTORNADO
Joel Goodson said:
lol

Feliz is a much better player than Lucas, IMO (and I'm a Lucas fan, FWIW). Yes, we shall see.
Click to expand...

Feliz shot 77% FT and TJL shot 61% FT and TJL was absolutely painful to watch at the end of games and at the front end of one and ones. Not to mention only 5 threes all year. El General with a 41% 3 pt %. Not even close.:thumb:
 
#423      

FiveStar

F
FiveStar
TCTORNADO said:
Feliz shot 77% FT and TJL shot 61% FT and TJL was absolutely painful to watch at the end of games and at the front end of one and ones. Not to mention only 5 threes all year. El General with a 41% 3 pt %. Not even close.:thumb:
Click to expand...

TJL clearly the better player


/s
 
#424      

Ga65

G
Ga65
illiniguy24 said:
We are due to have a non highly recruited freshman have a breakout career, right?


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Click to expand...

Alan Griffin great stats, not highly ranked, will earn playing time.
 
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