Cincinnati 71, Illinois 51 Postgame

#201      
Brad's presser was unacceptable and shows him being obstinate. There are too many upperclassmen on this team for this to be the effort and execution
 
#202      

ChiefGritty

Chicago, IL
I see kind of a three-legged stool of what's going wrong here, with all of them sort of feeding into one another:

1. The big question we knew we had going into the year, the obvious hinge point between us being great or just merely good, was what Curbelo looked like with a bigger role, more burden as a scorer, and an inability to let the bench cool him down when he gets a bit out of control as he often did last year. It's not going well, and the lack of complementary/supplementary PG options grows even more glaring.

2. The problem we didn't see coming is that this team can't shoot at all. Whatever magic Da'Monte conjured last year (such an underrated key factor) seems to have disappeared, Plummer has looked the furthest thing from a Power Five battle tested senior, Goode doesn't play, etc. So it's easy and low-cost for the defense to play off of Curbelo and gum up his passing options, as well as play Guillver's Travels defense all over Kofi.

3. And maybe the most disturbing thing, while I do think this team is trying hard, and the pretty decent defensive performance so far speaks to that, they've just become an incredibly cute, intricate, I hate to use this word but soft team on the offensive end. A finesse team, maybe that's the best way to say it. How did that happen? Why hasn't Underwood blown a gasket in these games?

And that goes back to #2. The 2019-20 team also couldn't shoot at all. And they were the best offensive team that couldn't shoot I've ever seen in college basketball, because they were both incredibly precise and disciplined in the way they ran their sets and also just hard-nosed and tough. We've totally lost that.

Some combination of Plummer, Goode, Trent, Da'Monte, Grandison, whoever, needs to open up the floor for us or I'm just at a loss for how this gets any better offensively.
 
#203      
What’s so disappointing is when you look at the history of this program(in my lifetime..44 years) we’ve had success but then slip back into mediocrity. This team had lofty expectations. I get it it’s 2 games, but it’s also 2 games that could leave a with a 9 dead or god help us..on the wrong side of the bubble..so forgive all of us that get overly fired up after this game. Lots of scar tissue. I’m not mad, I’m very disappointed.
 
#204      

skyIdub

Winged Warrior
Anybody know when the replay airs?

joking-kidding.gif
 
#206      
Frazier just seemed...less tonight...I don't know if he is under the weather/hurt, just didn't seem like he was a factor the whole game.
Not sure what the black wrap he has worn under his Jersey is for but he put it back on to start the second half if I remember correctly.
 
#209      
Last year I got put in message board timeout for being too salty after our ncaa tourney loss to Loyola so I’ll try to be better this time.

I think we’re going through a tough time right now which happens to a lot of teams especially early. We need to form a new identity and I’m confident that with time and hard work we’ll do that.

this is, after all, just a game. Much worse things going on right now than rooting for a struggling team.

(How was that?)
 
#210      
The only thing “elite” has been how poorly coached and prepared this team has been against last 3 real opponents. Some of the worst offensive basketball you’ll ever see.
That was my thought exactly. Watch our offensive “sets” versus any quality opponent.

I’m unsure of what we ever try to do. I’ve been a huge Underwood supporter, but his lack of in-game adjustment is bad.

He was just out-coached today.
 
#212      

azillini1

Scottsdale
Yeah that was point. BU gave him credit for the offense. We haven't played a single meaningful game where our half court was even just ok. How important was he to this team?
Which one of our Assistant Coaches is considered the adviser to BU on offense.
 
#217      
I see kind of a three-legged stool of what's going wrong here, with all of them sort of feeding into one another:

1. The big question we knew we had going into the year, the obvious hinge point between us being great or just merely good, was what Curbelo looked like with a bigger role, more burden as a scorer, and an inability to let the bench cool him down when he gets a bit out of control as he often did last year. It's not going well, and the lack of complementary/supplementary PG options grows even more glaring.

2. The problem we didn't see coming is that this team can't shoot at all. Whatever magic Da'Monte conjured last year (such an underrated key factor) seems to have disappeared, Plummer has looked the furthest thing from a Power Five battle tested senior, Goode doesn't play, etc. So it's easy and low-cost for the defense to play off of Curbelo and gum up his passing options, as well as play Guillver's Travels defense all over Kofi.

3. And maybe the most disturbing thing, while I do think this team is trying hard, and the pretty decent defensive performance so far speaks to that, they've just become an incredibly cute, intricate, I hate to use this word but soft team on the offensive end. A finesse team, maybe that's the best way to say it. How did that happen? Why hasn't Underwood blown a gasket in these games?

And that goes back to #2. The 2019-20 team also couldn't shoot at all. And they were the best offensive team that couldn't shoot I've ever seen in college basketball, because they were both incredibly precise and disciplined in the way they ran their sets and also just hard-nosed and tough. We've totally lost that.

Some combination of Plummer, Goode, Trent, Da'Monte, Grandison, whoever, needs to open up the floor for us or I'm just at a loss for how this gets any better offensively.

Astute points. At first I was as angry as everyone else about the game, but then I became curious as to what the heck was going on. This is a team of *great* players who have no concept of where *their* shots should come from (with the exception of Trent - he knows where is his money.) It reminds me of how much I loathed watching Mike Davis. Every swooned over his rebouding, but when you actually watched him closey - he was the king of running down the easy rebound to pad the stats. The he would hold the ball on his hip and take a breath and make a weak outlet pass that did nothin. Despite his frame and his stats he was absolute liability from a team chemistry and team ball standpoint. Just a selfish flowkiller. We have some strong basketball players that have been overpraised for low value skills and can't breakout of the mindset. I *really* thought Kofi would develop a strong kick-out game. It will benefit him so much a lessen those 3-4 defender scrums that currently hang off of him. Foul or no foul, he needs to play one-one-one bully ball by being a threat to kick it out. It is a multi-million decision byK ofi as ti whether he wants to do this or not, I have a feeling it wll be a main feature fo future practices

We are team of very good shooters where the wrong shooters shoot and the right shooters are taking crazy shots under duress. DMW may not make a 3 this year, See DMF Fr and So,. year for perspective.m His breakout last year was because Ayo got him open looks snd DMW's psyche benefited by more than anyone in college basketball from no fans in the stands. Made it seem like practice to him and he was able to shoot like practice. No chance this year., He's slow, a poor ballhandler and will prompyly revert to previous abysmal form. He needs to play spot defence, get a couple rebounds and ride the pine. HE IS WAS HE IS at this point.

It'a not an insult to say that Curbelo is better off the bench as the sixth man. He gets a chance to feel the game and knows that he wants to do when he's end. He's still a magician with the ball, but the 'Steve Nash' comps have gone straight to his head. He will not shoot better than 15% from 3 this year. And his propencity to try to split thee defenders no longer works. He's not spending enough time patiently running through at least 1 offensive set prior to freelancing. If he actually studied Steve Nash, he'd see how to maximize his skillset and height while still running smooth, unselfish offense. Brad has a tough Challenge with Curbelo. Have to give him the hook when he makes a stupid play and sit for a while. Frazier, Hutch and Plummer can handle adequately while he's out.

We clearly have a team chemistry for the moment because the rotations have not put the right units on the floor to be successful. Payne & Curbelo is a bad mix. Belo feeds him fancy passes in places he cannot finish. Kofi needs to have confidence when he kicks out to a lock down shooter ready to go. If he did that three times in a row, he'd be amazed at how open his footwork will be in the lane the next time down. He's got millions of dollars riding on his ability to do that consistently.

Hutch is one of our best players and needs starters minutes. He is smooth, long, can handle the ball and is a menace on defence. Also him being in the game makes DMW or Plummer sit, which automatically improved flow.

If I was going with the best 5 from a talent and cohesive game standpoint to stand toe-to-toe with Gonzaga it would be:

Frazier
Hutcherson
Grandison
Hawkins
Cockburn


That unit will play some D, has multiple initiators, the ball doesn't stick and we have the size to cause mismatch problems everywhere. Importantly, we then crash down on Kofi, he can kick to any of these guys with an offensive mindset.

Similarly - I need to see more tick from Melendez and Goode. The both look long and athletic and are agrressive on glass and moving the ball. Haven't looked like typical freshmen. I'd use BBV to spell Kofi at this point. Payne seems really raw and has bad hands. Good defensive presence at times.

However - we need to get our best offensive flow in the game and that is the guys above. I'd bring Curbelo off the bench first - he thrived in that role last year - but preserve a quick hook for bad decisions. If he wants to be the leader of the team, he needs to lead by mental toughness and by making the correct plays first - before trying the spectacular plays.


We have plenty of talent on this team. BU is just being stubborn early on with how he's deploying it.
 
#218      

JFGsCoffeeMug

BU:1 Trash cans:0
Chicago
3. And maybe the most disturbing thing, while I do think this team is trying hard, and the pretty decent defensive performance so far speaks to that, they've just become an incredibly cute, intricate, I hate to use this word but soft team on the offensive end. A finesse team, maybe that's the best way to say it. How did that happen? Why hasn't Underwood blown a gasket in these games?
Some on here have already alluded to this, and I think it has some merit: I think Ayo held the line as the team leader last season. He held himself to a high personal standard and demanded the same from his teammates. BU probably needs Trent to fully step into that role early this year. No knock against him, but I don't think Belo is ready for that yet. Could be a different story later in the season.
 
#220      
Curbelo is like Barry Sanders. He can do some amazing things that make you stand up and say wow, and he can often do too much and totally screw you. Sanders made it hard to sustain drives with the loss of yards plays, Curbelo makes it hard to sustain momentum with the turnovers.

The ball needs to move with the pass, not one guy dribbling all over the place. You don't make the defense work that way.
 
#221      
Curbelo is like Barry Sanders. He can do some amazing things that make you stand up and say wow, and he can often do too much and totally screw you. Sanders made it hard to sustain drives with the loss of yards plays, Curbelo makes it hard to sustain momentum with the turnovers.

The ball needs to move with the pass, not one guy dribbling all over the place. You don't make the defense work that way.
Those guys actually have to move, or the only way they're getting open is the dribble drive.
Very little motion until BU forced it late in the game.
 
#224      
I just found out that Cincinnati's coach, Wes Miller was on that 2005 UNC team as a walk-on and this is his first time facing Illinois again since that game...