Illini Basketball 2023-2024

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#26      

nichi

N
nichi
WhiteHorseWings said:
I’m all for giving Ty a shot but isn’t this why Jaylon Tate was not successful? Great handles and passing but zero threat of a shot allows defenses to sag off significantly?
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I bet the coaching staff thought of this and has something in mind.

Bruce Douglas and Jodie Harrison were successful point guards who were not effective long distance shooters.

Quinn Buckner is another one who had a pretty good college and NBA career. Charlie Ward. MSU had a PG couldn't shoot who had a nice NBA career.

Has the game changed that much?
 
#28      

BretMyBeachHouse

B
BretMyBeachHouse
nichi said:
I bet the coaching staff thought of this and has something in mind.

Bruce Douglas and Jodie Harrison were successful point guards who were not effective long distance shooters.

Quinn Buckner is another one who had a pretty cgood college and NBA career. Charlie Ward. MSU had a PG couldn't shoot who had a nice NBA career.

Has the game changed that much?
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Well yes. Three point shot and shot clock.

Think of all the times your lead ball handler is forced to take a shot at the end of the shot clock.
 
#29      

pruman91

pruman91
Paducah, Ky
pruman91
BretMyBeachHouse said:
Well yes. Three point shot and shot clock.

Think of all the times your lead ball handler is forced to take a shot at the end of the shot clock.
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The absolute worst time for me was when the tarholes went to the 4 corners stall game ........Boring as heck and did nothing to advance the sport...........

Give me a Pistol Pete game over that other bullcrap any day.....................
 
#30      

2020 Final Four

2020 Final Four
2020 Final Four
nichi said:
I bet the coaching staff thought of this and has something in mind.

Bruce Douglas and Jodie Harrison were successful point guards who were not effective long distance shooters.

Quinn Buckner is another one who had a pretty good college and NBA career. Charlie Ward. MSU had a PG couldn't shoot who had a nice NBA career.

Has the game changed that much?
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Mateen CLeaves was below average shooter and a above average PG. Shannon, Hawkins, Goode, Domask can all shoot it.
 
#32      

nichi

N
nichi
#36      

rtbritt

rtbritt
rtbritt
PepeSilvia said:
Hawkins has in fact never showed us that he can shoot it in a game scenario. He might have a few decent shooting games buts he never shot above 30 percent from 3 for a season.
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I agree with you, but he does still space the floor, because he can shoot and is capable of getting hot. When the ball is kicked to him, the defender does run out to him because he is a threat, whereas, the D would play Dain different if he were in the corner and caught the ball.
 
#37      

Thaillini22

Thaillini22
Thaillini22
Chester went from a combined 34.7% FG% his Soph & Junior year (35.5% & 33.7%, respectively) to 44.8% his Senior year.

In those same time frames, he went from 29.9% 3FG% (32.1% & 27.5%, respectively) to 38.2% his Senior year (which would have led last year's team by ~5% not counting Goode who attempted only 19 3FGs).

So, I'm openminded on the possibility of players like Ty and Sencire (and Coleman for that matter) making appreciable improvements shooting from range.
 
#40      

PasadenaIllini

P
PasadenaIllini
FrankNitty30 said:
Just to tie the last thread to this one…

1. Frank Williams is the best PG Illinois has ever had. We have had a bunch of them. HRF is the best.

2. People saying that the 05 team was missing a center? James Augustine had to be one of the most criminally underappreciated players in my lifetime. He was ABSOLUTELY the perfect center for that squad. Rebounding machine, tremendous defender that could switch on to guards, could shoot enough to keep you honest and an absolute deer running the floor.
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I feel differently. I think Deron was the best. I think Bruce Douglas was second best and Dee Brown after that. I would put Frank after those 3.
 
#41      

Ga65

G
Ga65
rtbritt said:
I agree with you, but he does still space the floor, because he can shoot and is capable of getting hot. When the ball is kicked to him, the defender does run out to him because he is a threat, whereas, the D would play Dain different if he were in the corner and caught the ball.
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How do you know Dain can’t shoot from there? Seen video of him shooting from outside and not bad. BU doesn’t let him shoot from outside and maybe for good reason but also no one since Ayo taking a mid range shot either.
 
#43      

MDchicago

MDchicago
Lake Norman NC
MDchicago
FrankNitty30 said:
2. People saying that the 05 team was missing a center? James Augustine had to be one of the most criminally underappreciated players in my lifetime. He was ABSOLUTELY the perfect center for that squad. Rebounding machine, tremendous defender that could switch on to guards, could shoot enough to keep you honest and an absolute deer running the floor.
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100%. Number 11 out of all NCAA players since 1995 in career win shares. Career Win Shares Link
 
#44      

HensonHall71

H
HensonHall71
PasadenaIllini said:
I feel differently. I think Deron was the best. I think Bruce Douglas was second best and Dee Brown after that. I would put Frank after those 3.
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Agreed, I think Deron has to be #1- he led the offense for an all time great NCAA team
Derek Harper was number 2 for me, good shooter to go along with the defense and playmaking , Douglas #3, Bardo #4, he’s way underrated as a PG - if you wonder what Ty could be Bardo is what we hope he turns into.

Dee was great, just not in the PG conversation
 
#46      

Joel Goodson

Joel Goodson
ties will be resolved
Joel Goodson
HensonHall71 said:
Agreed, I think Deron has to be #1- he led the offense for an all time great NCAA team
Derek Harper was number 2 for me, good shooter to go along with the defense and playmaking , Douglas #3, Bardo #4, he’s way underrated as a PG - if you wonder what Ty could be Bardo is what we hope he turns into.

Dee was great, just not in the PG conversation
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agree with a lot of this, but Frank is a glaring omission and Harper wasn't a good shooter until his last season. FWLIW, I'd probably slot Frank in as #3, but it's close between him and Harper. Also, Garris deserves a mention: at least as good as Bardo. as always, YMMV
 
#47      

PasadenaIllini

P
PasadenaIllini
HensonHall71 said:
Agreed, I think Deron has to be #1- he led the offense for an all time great NCAA team
Derek Harper was number 2 for me, good shooter to go along with the defense and playmaking , Douglas #3, Bardo #4, he’s way underrated as a PG - if you wonder what Ty could be Bardo is what we hope he turns into.

Dee was great, just not in the PG conversation
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Eff me, I forgot about Derek Harper. I feel differently about Dee though He was overshadowed by Deron in 02 but we really saw him put the team on his back after that.
 
#49      

FrankNitty30

F
FrankNitty30
HensonHall71 said:
Agreed, I think Deron has to be #1- he led the offense for an all time great NCAA team
Derek Harper was number 2 for me, good shooter to go along with the defense and playmaking , Douglas #3, Bardo #4, he’s way underrated as a PG - if you wonder what Ty could be Bardo is what we hope he turns into.

Dee was great, just not in the PG conversation
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I think he gets more credit for his pro career, which tints his college career. No doubt the guy was a stud. No one took over games like Frank. Ayo was close.
 
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